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11/12 (12/1) Regeneration scene
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Pull2Open
25-01-2014
Having now watched this scene a number of times, I have concluded that it now replaces 4/5 regeneration scene as the best one for me.

I thought it was well acted, exactly the right amount of emotion and perception of loss without going OTT or self indulgent (thought the Amelia scene was wonderful and watching the Eleventh Hour recently, it really struck me as how fitting it was!) but for me, the aspect of that regeneration that stands out and makes it the best is the music. The score for that scene was absolutely perfect, dramatic, emotional and a sense of finality in equal parts.
TheSilentFez
25-01-2014
I actually think 8's regeneration to The War Doctor wins. You really have a sense that he's been running from the Time War for a long time and has lost a lot as a result, and his regeneration represents him finally giving up and giving in- thus breaking his promise.
But he also went with dignity, referencing his friends and companions we never fully got to know on-screen.

11's regeneration to 12 probably comes second or third. Matt delivered his final words perfectly and the hallucination of Amelia was handled very well, but the actual physical regeneration disappointed me. I was disappointed that it was so abrupt and we didn't get to see any morphing. Eight's regeneration felt better made even though we didn't actually see the final change.
lady_xanax
25-01-2014
I like the first regeneration and the one from seven to eight. I prefer seeing the morphing rather than a blaze of energy.
JackMShep
25-01-2014
In terms of actual regeneration my favourite is 9-10 because you can actually see him slowly morph from one actor into the other that I don't think you get with any of the others. However, in terms of the whole sequence, I agree with you that 11-12 was the best, however the Amy Pond cameo ruined it for me. It was unnecessary,completely undermined Clara/Jenna and reminded me just how much I hate Amy Pond!
Abomination
25-01-2014
The only regeneration sequence I didn't like was the 10/11 one.My favourite would have to be 9/10 though...a truly dignified and understated exit meant Eccleston bowed out leaving me wanting a whole load more, whilst also feeling satisfied with the brilliant series I'd just had from him.

And OP, a rather good rip of the score from The Time of the Doctor's regeneration scene is available on Youtube:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=o6RR-D58dGU

It goes nicely as an epilogue to The Long Song:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=X21JXIO-Tec

Will2911
25-01-2014
9/10 is the best I think. Love Chris's final lines.
daveyboy7472
25-01-2014
For me the regeneration at Xmas has been the worse there's ever been. Despite a nice speech from Matt Smith it lacked any punch, either dramatic or emotional. For me, the 4/5 is far superior to it in every way and is my fave ever.

All the regenerations are good in their own way for different reasons. In New Who the 9/10 is still the best but the 10/11 has more emotional impact.

RememberMeWhen
25-01-2014
Originally Posted by JackMShep:
“In terms of actual regeneration my favourite is 9-10 because you can actually see him slowly morph from one actor into the other that I don't think you get with any of the others. However, in terms of the whole sequence, I agree with you that 11-12 was the best, however the Amy Pond cameo ruined it for me. It was unnecessary,completely undermined Clara/Jenna and reminded me just how much I hate Amy Pond!”

This! Completely agree!
daveycrocket222
25-01-2014
Originally Posted by Pull2Open:
“Having now watched this scene a number of times, I have concluded that it now replaces 4/5 regeneration scene as the best one for me.

I thought it was well acted, exactly the right amount of emotion and perception of loss without going OTT or self indulgent (thought the Amelia scene was wonderful and watching the Eleventh Hour recently, it really struck me as how fitting it was!) but for me, the aspect of that regeneration that stands out and makes it the best is the music. The score for that scene was absolutely perfect, dramatic, emotional and a sense of finality in equal parts.”

Too much waffling on in the new series.

Just a short line would do.
Pull2Open
25-01-2014
Just to clarify, I am talking about the whole inTardis regeneration scene, from Clara's entrance to Capaldi's. Not just the actual point of regeneration, based on which, I think 4/5 retain the lead.
Pull2Open
25-01-2014
Originally Posted by daveyboy7472:
“All the regenerations are good in their own way for different reasons. In New Who the 9/10 is still the best but the 10/11 has more emotional impact.

”

I still cringe at 10/11
CELT1987
25-01-2014
Originally Posted by Will2911:
“9/10 is the best I think. Love Chris's final lines.”

Loved the 9th to 10th Doctor regeneration. Bit of humour added made it better.
daveyboy7472
25-01-2014
Originally Posted by Pull2Open:
“Just to clarify, I am talking about the whole inTardis regeneration scene, from Clara's entrance to Capaldi's. Not just the actual point of regeneration, based on which, I think 4/5 retain the lead.”

Looking at regeneration scenes as a whole, I would say the 11/12 one worked okay upto until the regeneration scene itself. The sudden appearance of Capaldi and his exceedingly short intro just sort of didn't work for me personally.

It's just my opinion but for a regeneration to work as a whole, you need three things.

1) A good episode leading upto it.

Now that's where Parting Of The Waves wins in the New Series as it was such a cracking episode leading upto the regeneration. The Caves Of Androzani works the best for me overall as it was a storming last episode which every Doctor should have. Logopolis was also quite a good last episode in this regard as was Planet Of The Spiders. Maybe the First and Second Doctor's last episode wasn't so dramatic but they're still good episodes in their own right. It's also where The End Of Time didn't work so well for me, Time Of The Doctor was okay but not that brilliant.

2) A nice departure speech or scene from the departing Doctor.

This is where I can give top marks to all The Doctors bar the Sixth and Seventh Doctors as most of last scenes have been very good.

3) A good regeneration sequence so you can see the changeover.

Okay, we didn't really see the Regeneration from Second to Third but even the dodgy regeneration from Sixth To Seventh you saw the change. This is where the 11/12th fell seriously flat and had no impact. It just happened. I think that speech from Matt Smith deserved the full regeneration effect to follow it-but it didn't and that's where it failed.

And though I don't think it's as essential, if you get a good debut as a New Doctor straight after a regeneration before that episode ends you're also on a winner. That's where Matt Smith wins hands down on that one. To think it took to Colin Baker to actually say something immediately after a regeneration at the end of an episode and he was the only Classic Doctor to do that. We take it for granted now but it didn't happen often in Classic Who.

So for me that's where the 4/5 still wins out as it had a good last episode, nice little moments with Tom Baker before he regenerated and the sequence itself I've always loved.

Though it's followed exceedingly close by The Caves Of Androzani which even with it's 'advantages' that Peter Davison has often mentioned, was just a shade of perfection in the regeneration sequence itself.

Originally Posted by Pull2Open:
“I still cringe at 10/11 ”

Bless

lady_xanax
25-01-2014
Originally Posted by TheSilentFez:
“I actually think 8's regeneration to The War Doctor wins. You really have a sense that he's been running from the Time War for a long time and has lost a lot as a result, and his regeneration represents him finally giving up and giving in- thus breaking his promise.
But he also went with dignity, referencing his friends and companions we never fully got to know on-screen.”

Oh yeah, this was great. Despite being the Doctor with the least on-screen history, McGann managed to communicate so much history.
tiggerpooh
26-01-2014
Originally Posted by TheSilentFez:
“I was disappointed that it was so abrupt and we didn't get to see any morphing.”

If you look at this clip, you will notice that someone has 'added' the face morph, by pausing the clip at the point of change, when the Doctor leans his head back.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?featur...f6HMgQIoQ#t=79

I, personally, think that the story should have been shown with this, instead of the split second lean back, and...Wham! Peter Capaldi is here!
Will2911
26-01-2014
Originally Posted by tiggerpooh:
“If you look at this clip, you will notice that someone has 'added' the face morph, by pausing the clip at the point of change, when the Doctor leans his head back.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?featur...f6HMgQIoQ#t=79

I, personally, think that the story should have been shown with this, instead of the split second lean back, and...Wham! Peter Capaldi is here!”

Well that's just bad. The original is much better
TheSilentFez
26-01-2014
Originally Posted by tiggerpooh:
“If you look at this clip, you will notice that someone has 'added' the face morph, by pausing the clip at the point of change, when the Doctor leans his head back.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?featur...f6HMgQIoQ#t=79

I, personally, think that the story should have been shown with this, instead of the split second lean back, and...Wham! Peter Capaldi is here!”

Yeh, I've already seen that. I didn't find it very convincing. It just didn't work.
That said, the added regeneration glow was very well done.
Actually, why was the regeneration glow so badly done in the actual episode? Instead of having the doctor's whole face glow, they just made his neck glow. Why?!
It was nowhere near even the standard of Night of the Doctor which was made with the leftover budget for Day of the Doctor.
Helbore
26-01-2014
Originally Posted by Pull2Open:
“I still cringe at 10/11 ”

Me too. I really don't like the way it treats the regeneration like a death and I hate the "I don't want to go," line, along with the way Tennant is breathing like something horrible is about to happen.

I like 9/10 and 11/12 because they both treat the regeneration as something both sad and exciting. ITs sad because we will miss the actor playing the Doctor, but the Doctor reassures us that its all ok and that this is a good thing and he's still going to be with us. 10/11 made it feel like a disaster was happening and I've got to admit, it is a massive credit to Matt Smith that he was able to make any success after that.

It was a big mistake for them to go with the idea of "its like I die and another man walks away." It felt like an attempt to make it all the more emotional by implying the Doctor was actually going to die when he regenerated. Big mistake and I hope they never go that route again.
Pull2Open
26-01-2014
Originally Posted by Helbore:
“Me too. I really don't like the way it treats the regeneration like a death and I hate the "I don't want to go," line, along with the way Tennant is breathing like something horrible is about to happen.

I like 9/10 and 11/12 because they both treat the regeneration as something both sad and exciting. ITs sad because we will miss the actor playing the Doctor, but the Doctor reassures us that its all ok and that this is a good thing and he's still going to be with us. 10/11 made it feel like a disaster was happening and I've got to admit, it is a massive credit to Matt Smith that he was able to make any success after that.

It was a big mistake for them to go with the idea of "its like I die and another man walks away." It felt like an attempt to make it all the more emotional by implying the Doctor was actually going to die when he regenerated. Big mistake and I hope they never go that route again.”

This is why I think that 11/12 was perfectly pitched. I loved all the reassurance and the 'He's a comin!' line coupled with the notion that he is and will always be the Doctor. Not sure about the breath on the mirror line but the 'times change and so must I' was spot on. Finally, the reliving past companion bit was handled perfectly imo.
Michael_Eve
26-01-2014
Aside from the travesty that was 6 to 7 (for obvious reasons) I personally think all the regenerations have been handled pretty effectively to a greater or lesser extent.

5 to 6 was my first as a fan and my favourite for many years, but 11 to 12 is right up there. Matt's little speech is beautifully pitched and performed. It's the little reassuring "Hey..." he whispers to Clara that gets me every time. His last word. Sorry to be predictable, but although I was sweeped up in events at the time, I can understand people's criticism of 10 to 11;still, 10 had vanity issues! But I guess it was a bit too OTT for my tastes in retrospect.

So; 1/2...iconic and groundbreaking. 2/3...atypical! 3/4...great scene. 4/5...ditto. And gawd bless Paddy Kingsland. 5/6...Goosebumps. 6/7...I deny this reality! 7/8...Gurn-tasticly effective. 8/War...love McGann's last line. War/9...actually just right, IMO. 9/10...Another great scene. 10/11...see above. 11/12...see above.
lady_xanax
28-01-2014
Ooh, I don't like the 2nd regeneration, apart from going into colour.
saladfingers81
28-01-2014
Originally Posted by Helbore:
“Me too. I really don't like the way it treats the regeneration like a death and I hate the "I don't want to go," line, along with the way Tennant is breathing like something horrible is about to happen.

I like 9/10 and 11/12 because they both treat the regeneration as something both sad and exciting. ITs sad because we will miss the actor playing the Doctor, but the Doctor reassures us that its all ok and that this is a good thing and he's still going to be with us. 10/11 made it feel like a disaster was happening and I've got to admit, it is a massive credit to Matt Smith that he was able to make any success after that.

It was a big mistake for them to go with the idea of "its like I die and another man walks away." It felt like an attempt to make it all the more emotional by implying the Doctor was actually going to die when he regenerated. Big mistake and I hope they never go that route again.”

I always hated his final line but also there is something a little selfish about the way RTD managed that whole regeneration. It was an exercise in pure ego and perpetuating his and Tennants own legend and wasn't for the good of the show. Also not very gracious for Moffat who faced a hell of a task as it was and this was only made harder by RTD making it clear this ending was a tragedy, a funeral and something should be mourned instead of a celebration.
Mrfipp
29-01-2014
My overall thoughts on each regeneration.

http://mrfippstuff.tumblr.com/search/regeneration
lady_xanax
29-01-2014
Originally Posted by saladfingers81:
“I always hated his final line but also there is something a little selfish about the way RTD managed that whole regeneration. It was an exercise in pure ego and perpetuating his and Tennants own legend and wasn't for the good of the show. Also not very gracious for Moffat who faced a hell of a task as it was and this was only made harder by RTD making it clear this ending was a tragedy, a funeral and something should be mourned instead of a celebration.”

Yes, it was a bit funereal, but I think maybe it was the nervousness about going into a new era- would the show fail again? I think that would be a concern whoever was replacing.
jpl
29-01-2014
With the knowledge that Matt Smith was the 'last' incarnation you can retcon 10's regeneration and explain it as a nervousness of hitting his last life.

As I said pure retcon and not the original intention but if you view it that way it works better
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