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Old 09-04-2014, 18:45
TheTruth1983
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Who else is really starting to love it? Or has already been loving it?

I am really getting into it and having an absolute ball discovering the wonderful bands of the genre.

There is something about the power and intensity of Metal fused with Classical overtures that is quite exquisite.
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Old 09-04-2014, 18:51
gelbma0991
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I used to really be into a lot of Symphonic Metal, there's some really amazing bands out there - I've often thought Sarah Brightman should do a full on Symphonic Metal album haha.
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Old 09-04-2014, 19:08
TheTruth1983
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It started with a Derry band called Selene for me who I discovered on Bandcamp and loved, so I decided to delve into the genre.
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Old 09-04-2014, 20:45
gelbma0991
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Oh, I've just listened to one of their tracks on youtube... it's a bit too underpolished for my liking (could have just been a demo?). They have potential though!

Check out this track though, it's one my favourites! https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=uN3yqMr3ffY
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Old 09-04-2014, 21:13
embryo
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Check out this track though, it's one my favourites! https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=uN3yqMr3ffY
Not my favourite Nightwish track but a good choice nonetheless. I can't say I'm a huge fan of symphonic metal but I do think Nightwish are great - while I don't mind a lot of other bands in that style, I'm yet to find any that are quite as effective as they are.

That said, I do like a fair bit of symphonic black metal, since I'm more of an extreme metal fan - Emperor, Summoning, Arcturus and Sigh are among my favourite metal bands.
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Old 10-04-2014, 10:30
Glawster2002
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Who else is really starting to love it? Or has already been loving it?

I am really getting into it and having an absolute ball discovering the wonderful bands of the genre.

There is something about the power and intensity of Metal fused with Classical overtures that is quite exquisite.
As I am sure you already know, I'm a huge Symphonic Metal fan!!

The only problem you will find, once you dip your toe is just how vast the genre is!!!! My Amazon wishlist is getting longer and longer!

AMBERIAN DAWN - Kokko- Eagle of Fire
ARVEN - Believe
DELAIN - Stardust
LEAVES' EYES - Hell To The Heavens
MARKIZE - Mechanical Hearts
THE MURDER OF MY SWEET - Follow The Rain
NIGHTWISH - I Want My Tears Back*
PYTHIA - Betray My Heart
RHAPSODY OF FIRE - Sea Of Fate
SERENITY - Wings of Madness
SIRENIA - Seven Widows Weep
SLEEPING ROMANCE - Free Me
STREAM OF PASSION - Out In The Real World
TARJA TURUNEN - Never Enough
WINTER IN EDEN - Inside
WITHIN TEMPTATION - Dangerous

I could go on but that will keep you busy for a little while!!!

* I chose a Nightwish track with Floor Jansen. I'm a massive Tarja fan and the band's reasons for sacking her still don't ring true, especially after what happened to Annette. However whilst I never took to Annette Olsen, Tarja's replacement, based on their Waken performance with Floor I'm convinced she can really take them to the next level.
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Old 10-04-2014, 11:08
Kiko H Fan
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I do enjoy Nightwish. I need to invest in their albums pre Century Child.
I'm not so taken with Within Temptation. They are ok.
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Old 10-04-2014, 11:20
Electra
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Not my favourite Nightwish track but a good choice nonetheless. I can't say I'm a huge fan of symphonic metal but I do think Nightwish are great - while I don't mind a lot of other bands in that style, I'm yet to find any that are quite as effective as they are.

That said, I do like a fair bit of symphonic black metal, since I'm more of an extreme metal fan - Emperor, Summoning, Arcturus and Sigh are among my favourite metal bands.
Oh, another Summoning fan. I love them - wouldn't say they're extreme though. I actually find them very relaxing

As for Symphonic Metal - a bit lightweight for me, although I do enjoy the odd track here & there.
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Old 10-04-2014, 11:39
mgvsmith
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I have listened to Within Temptation and Nightwish and some of it is quite listenable.

I'm not sure it should be called 'Symphonic' Metal though as very little of this music actually seems to be in symphonic form, it seems more operatic than symphonic.
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Old 10-04-2014, 12:22
gelbma0991
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I have listened to Within Temptation and Nightwish and some of it is quite listenable.

I'm not sure it should be called 'Symphonic' Metal though as very little of this music actually seems to be in symphonic form, it seems more operatic than symphonic.
I'm not sure I really agree with that, a lot of their music is heavily based on incorporating classical music and infusing it into the band. If you take away any of the vocals, you will hear that there's probably more instrumentation coming through from strings, pianos, horn sections, etc. Tarja is the only 'operatic' thing about either band. Anette was much more of a belter, and Sharon from WT just has a beautiful upper register which she uses as her 'norm'.
I can't really comment on Floor though as I've not listened to Nightwish since she came into the band.

I also forgot about this gem of a track

Instrumental version https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Vm2G2nxwrBQ
Normal version https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1HYgidYaBl8
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Old 10-04-2014, 12:41
Electra
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I'm not sure I really agree with that, a lot of their music is heavily based on incorporating classical music and infusing it into the band. If you take away any of the vocals, you will hear that there's probably more instrumentation coming through from strings, pianos, horn sections, etc. Tarja is the only 'operatic' thing about either band. Anette was much more of a belter, and Sharon from WT just has a beautiful upper register which she uses as her 'norm'.
I can't really comment on Floor though as I've not listened to Nightwish since she came into the band.

I also forgot about this gem of a track

Instrumental version https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Vm2G2nxwrBQ
Normal version https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1HYgidYaBl8
Tbh, I think many of the bands regarded as Symphonic Metal, are actually just Female-fronted Power Metal, with some symphonic elements. I'd also argue that Within Temptation are no longer Metal at all.

I agree about not calling it Opera Metal, as yes, Tarja is pretty much the only opera singer in the genre. Look at Powerwolf. Nobody calls them opera, or symphonic, even though they are fronted by an opera singer. Then again, he's a bloke. Powerwolf
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Old 10-04-2014, 13:05
mgvsmith
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I'm not sure I really agree with that, a lot of their music is heavily based on incorporating classical music and infusing it into the band. If you take away any of the vocals, you will hear that there's probably more instrumentation coming through from strings, pianos, horn sections, etc. Tarja is the only 'operatic' thing about either band. Anette was much more of a belter, and Sharon from WT just has a beautiful upper register which she uses as her 'norm'.
I can't really comment on Floor though as I've not listened to Nightwish since she came into the band.

I also forgot about this gem of a track

Instrumental version https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Vm2G2nxwrBQ
Normal version https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1HYgidYaBl8
Tbh, I think many of the bands regarded as Symphonic Metal, are actually just Female-fronted Power Metal, with some symphonic elements. I'd also argue that Within Temptation are no longer Metal at all.

I agree about not calling it Opera Metal, as yes, Tarja is pretty much the only opera singer in the genre. Look at Powerwolf. Nobody calls them opera, or symphonic, even though they are fronted by an opera singer. Then again, he's a bloke. Powerwolf
Symphonic and operatic are really forms of classical music. Symphonies normally come in four movements and rarely contains vocals, that's the first thing. Opera is a mixture of music, words and drama but I think that style of singing in 'Symphonic' metal sounds at least quite theatrical if not fully operatic.

I would have thought a term like Orchestral Metal might be more accurate.

Apparently the terms Neoclassical Metal and Baroque Metal are already used.
Not so sure what they sound like though?
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Old 10-04-2014, 13:10
gelbma0991
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Tbh, I think many of the bands regarded as Symphonic Metal, are actually just Female-fronted Power Metal, with some symphonic elements. I'd also argue that Within Temptation are no longer Metal at all.

I agree about not calling it Opera Metal, as yes, Tarja is pretty much the only opera singer in the genre. Look at Powerwolf. Nobody calls them opera, or symphonic, even though they are fronted by an opera singer. Then again, he's a bloke. Powerwolf
To be honest with you, I haven't even kept up with WT since The Heart of Everything ha! My music taste has mellowed out a bit and spread to a crazy amount of genres and I barely revisit a lot of my previously loved rock/metal bands, so I'm not as 'in the loop' as I used to be. I agree with what you're saying though, I think because metal has such a diverse range of sub-genres, it's difficult to hit each band specifically with a 'style' and they tend to get lumped together.

It's funny, I've often attempted to sing (badly) in a more classical crossover style, and wondered what it would be like to sing in a male fronted band with an opera-influenced vocal... I'll check them out, so thanks for the tip!

Symphonic and operatic are really forms of classical music. Symphonies normally come in four movements and rarely contains vocals, that's the first thing. Opera is a mixture of music, words and drama but I think that style of singing in 'Symphonic' metal sounds at least quite theatrical if not fully operatic.

I would have thought a term like Orchestral Metal might be more accurate.
Yeah, I agree with this (seems we posted at the same time ha!) - it just further proves my point they all seem to get lumped together under one genre, when in reality, subtle differences between the bands could totally make them a whole other genre!
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Old 10-04-2014, 14:11
Glawster2002
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Yeah, I agree with this (seems we posted at the same time ha!) - it just further proves my point they all seem to get lumped together under one genre, when in reality, subtle differences between the bands could totally make them a whole other genre!
Which is why there are so many sub-genres, and sub sub-genres in Metal.
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Old 10-04-2014, 14:16
Glawster2002
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Tbh, I think many of the bands regarded as Symphonic Metal, are actually just Female-fronted Power Metal, with some symphonic elements. I'd also argue that Within Temptation are no longer Metal at all.

I agree about not calling it Opera Metal, as yes, Tarja is pretty much the only opera singer in the genre. Look at Powerwolf. Nobody calls them opera, or symphonic, even though they are fronted by an opera singer. Then again, he's a bloke. Powerwolf
As with most genres I think terms like "Power Metal" and "Symphonic Metal" are pretty much interchangable anyway.

It's probably a reasonable rule of thumb to assume a male-fronted band will be called a "Power Metal" band, and a female-fronted one a "Symphonic Metal" band.

As for Within Temptation not being "Metal" any more, they had as much of a Goth influence to bebin with and they have evolved their sound as they have gone on which I will always support. nothing worse than <entre genre here> by numbers.
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Old 10-04-2014, 14:29
Electra
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As with most genres I think terms like "Power Metal" and "Symphonic Metal" are pretty much interchangable anyway.
I guess that may depend on where a band stands on the Power spectrum. Avantasia - possibly. Sabaton - probably not

It's probably a reasonable rule of thumb to assume a male-fronted band will be called a "Power Metal" band, and a female-fronted one a "Symphonic Metal" band.
Battle Beast?

As for Within Temptation not being "Metal" any more, they had as much of a Goth influence to bebin with and they have evolved their sound as they have gone on which I will always support. nothing worse than <entre genre here> by numbers.
I'm not saying they're not good anymore, just not Metal. Like several other bands, it seems that in order to achieve any sort of mainstream recognition (eg A7X), they've had to ditch the Metal element & become a rock band. I think I'd probably put them closer to Evanescence these days.
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Old 10-04-2014, 16:24
Dirtyhippy
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Lacuna Coil satisfy the criteria for this genre?
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Old 10-04-2014, 18:26
Electra
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Lacuna Coil satisfy the criteria for this genre?
Not really. I'd say they're another gothic rock band tbh.
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Old 10-04-2014, 18:27
TheTruth1983
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Which is why there are so many sub-genres, and sub sub-genres in Metal.
Metal really is a rich, vibrant and varied genre. I love it, all tastes are well catered for.
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Old 11-04-2014, 10:44
Glawster2002
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Lacuna Coil satisfy the criteria for this genre?
Not really. I'd say they're another gothic rock band tbh.
I'm a big fan of Lacuna Coil, their new aldum is brilliant.

I would say they are very much a "cross-over" band as, like Within Temptation and Nightwish, there they have a lot of both Goth and Symphonic Metal fans.

I think the distinction between Goth and Symphonic Metal is often a very blurred one.

I'm going to see Delain and Within Temptation @ Wembley Arena tomorrow and from past experience I would expect a lot of Goths to be there.
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Old 11-04-2014, 19:05
TheTruth1983
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I have recently started listening to Delain (because of Within Temptation) and I like very much. Jealous at you getting to see them
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Old 11-04-2014, 19:41
Tal'shiar
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Symphonic Metal to me is the more classical infused power metal end. Lots of shredding and high tempos, the odd ballad for no reason that it has to be done. Nightwish and the like are just heavy metal with a bare hint of it, but mostly silly female vocals.

Here is what some of the more classical symphonic metal would be

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ZIr6glUP7UY

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=TaV-I5C90zk

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9IEX7U-Ht2U

etc etc
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Old 11-04-2014, 21:46
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I'm off (8 of us) to see Delain and Within Temptation tomorrow.

Will report back on Sunday!
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Old 12-04-2014, 10:36
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Does Dimmu. Borgir count? I don't really like growly black death metal stuff, but their Abrahadabra album is awesome, recorded with a full on choir and orchestra.

This is a one off show they did https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=-YC4WJcvd7Y
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Old 12-04-2014, 11:12
mgvsmith
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Does Dimmu. Borgir count? I don't really like growly black death metal stuff, but their Abrahadabra album is awesome, recorded with a full on choir and orchestra.

This is a one off show they did https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=-YC4WJcvd7Y
And people say Image is irrelevant in music?
Those guys wouldn't look out of place performing Wagner's 'Ring' cycle.
I like this kind of theatricality in music. Quite over the top and quite brilliant!
I still think that this is much more operatic in form but it sounds and looks great.
And I'm not sure that 'Bat out of Hell' doesn't have some influence in all of this.

(Also a band that calls an album 'Puritanical Euphoric Misanthropia' deserves some sort of recognition!)
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