Just read this article over at Doctorwho.tv

http://www.doctorwhotv.co.uk/unpopul...leks-62371.htm

Although I found it an enjoyable episode I have to agree with the points raised especially the Dalek Parliament and Skaro points.

What do others think overall regarding the episodes effect on Dalek continuity and the plotholes raised in particular..

The plot holes aren't plot holes. Skaro as a decaying wasteland isn't even remotely inconsistent with what we know about the Time War. He somehow inflates "if it's easy to wipe their minds and cure them, why are they in the asylum" into a plot hole, too. The daleks don't want to cure the inmates of the asylum, they find their hatred beautiful - it's very clearly established that they couldn't bear to destroy them.

It doesn't break dalek continuity, it breaks the author's own preconceptions. The article is basically just a man being a bit precious about a picture of the daleks he's got in his head that he's not seeing reflected on screen. He's made up his mind about it, he's trying to twist the episode to justify his opinion, and it's not really working.

Fuss over nothing. But, to be expected on the internet!

I enjoyed the episode, but it was disappointing that the whole "Doctor Who" plot point never really amounted to anything, apart from vaguely foreshadowing Matt's last episode. That, and the whole 'stepping back into the shadows' thing seemingly set up something, but then just get dropped.

[quote=rwebster;72170402]The plot holes aren't plot holes. Skaro as a decaying wasteland isn't even remotely inconsistent with what we know about the Time War.

Really, never mind the Time war, last time I saw Remembrance Skaro was blown to bits.

[quote=Zeppelyn56;72173566]
And then was briefly seen in the TV Movie where the Master was executed by the Daleks.

Just because the Daleks have a parliament doesn't mean that there isn't an Emperor Dalek. The first use of the word is in relation to Henry III deferring a legal decision to the next meeting of the Kings Parliament in 12tyblahsomething and it was at that time by no means a democratic body. Everyone seems to assume that there has been some sort of Cromwellian Dalek Revolution just because of a big meeting...but it might be a good story line! The Roundheads v The Also Roundheads?

Have to agree, with the daleks collective memories having the doctor wiped from them, I was expecting it to be the set up for at least one cool episode where the daleks are wondering 'who is this nuisance who is trying to stop our plan?' It would have been great because it seems often that the daleks fear of the doctor is often what makes them hold back when dealing with him, so it would have been interesting to see a scenario where to them, he was just another ordinary humanoid that needed exterminating. Yet in the end, nothing came of it.

Also, your right about 'stepping back into the shadows' being short lived. apart From the odd mention of deleting his name from databases, he didn't make any attempt to hide his identity, or interfere any less in the universe's business. The whole concept seemed to be proposed then mostly forgotten about rather quickly.

I feel these are two examples of many where unfortunately Moffat put's more effort into a hype inducing set up than he does of showing the effects of or resolving each set up. He's a great writer when it comes to individual stories, but I think when dealing with anything longer like arcs or ongoing themes he just gets a little bored before it's done, and consistently just prematurely wants to move on to the next big new juicy set up/arc.

On the plus side, I largely enjoyed asylum of the daleks. Apart from being slightly thrown by seeing skaro (as it obviously aired before 50th so I was still under the assumption at the time that skaro was supposed to be destroyed) It felt simple and well told.From the initial scene's which showed amy and rory on the rocks rather than the usually cosy relationship, to the 'help us' plea from daleks to doctor, to Oswin Oswald, and the various aspects of the asylum itself (especially the intensive care wing dedicated to the daleks which survived the doctor), I thought it was an episode with a good background set up which was well paced and had good twists and turns. Best season opener since Smith and Jones in my opinion.

Well, Asylum is certainly an overrated episode...

I do think there was a disparity between the amount of publicity the PR department sought over the return of the original series daleks and the amount of screentime they got in the episode.

They were running riot with stories about how it was great to see them all in one place and which Dalek came from where, what Dalek the actors preferred, magazine covers, etc, and at no point did anyone in the production team say
"err, guys, it's not THAT big a deal, you see them for like 20 seconds in the background of one shot, maybe ease off on the "old daleks!!!" angle?"

At least this was the ep that truly established the failure of the new paradigm Daleks as they were shunted into the background in favour of the 2005 era Bronze daleks.
So, it's not all bad.

You do get the impression the RTD era Dalek episodes had more impact though.
Each time they returned there was a reason for it and the characters acted more surprised.
In AOTD the characters get abducted by the Daleks and their reaction is more of a Shrug and a yawn. "Hey ho, these guys again, oh well!"

Was that Skaro the planet, or Skaro's sun?

I think that's fair, but I think if you're holding onto that a good two years after the publicity drive happened, that says more about the viewer than the episode!

It's a fair point, but at the same time, it's kind of what PR departments do. They will alway's use the most seemingly interesting detail's or clips to drum up interest, regardless of if they have taken the scene or info out of context.

It's like if a companion said in anger "i'm going to kill the doctor" in an episode. In the promo for that episode, they'd probably show you the clip of that out of context so you think 'why does the companion want to kill the doctor? and then it makes you watch, even though in the episode, the scene in question would probably turn out not to be important at all.

It's was the same when the series 7 part 2 promo showed the doctor saying 'right Clara Oswald, time to find out who you are' as if the clip was at a point where he was actually about to find out, but then when the episodes aired it turned out it was just a clip from the end of bell's of st John when he's muttering it to himself for no other reason than he's actually found her again. Another example was the promo for the doctors wife. They showed a clip of the old console room with rory and amy standing by something glowing golden. For all intents and purposes that clip almost seemed as though rory and amy had somehow travelled back in time to the Tennant to Smith regeneration, but when the episode aired, that scene was nowhere near as big a deal as the clip made it seem.

it's all tricks of the PR trade.

both.

That's Time Wars for you isn't it, events get turned on their heads right left and centre.

I actually think it's one of the best Dalek episodes we've had. Plus it introduced Clara in her Oswin version as well.

i agree i watched it again yesterday, very much enjoyed it. And I have been watching a lot of Who recently including a lot of the old Dalek stories and this is def one of the most enjoyable for me (mind you a lot of the Dalek stories are a bit pants aren't they).

I agree with the article in that its silly to have the ability to turn off the forcefield in the asylum itself.

I agree with all above but one thing that I thought was left open was when the doctor had turned to Amy and said....just make them remember who you are......
nothing more came of this., or did I miss something again?

There's quite a few references to remembering in the script:
http://www.chakoteya.net/doctorwho/33-1.htm
The Doctor telling Amy to make an impression on the Daleks (foreshadowing the final Parliament scene where the Daleks have completely forgotten who the Doctor is), the Darla puppet not being able to access her old memories, Rory forgetting his name when talking to Oswin, making Amy remember who she is to hold back the conversion process, and culminating in Oswin asking the Doctor (and the audience) to remember her.

It's quite a theme when you look at it.

I agree lol. I think they're all right as commanding elite's or whatever, but I don't believe this was always the plan. Gattiss, after VOTD talked about how we could have a story staffed entirely with red Daleks. But when they realized how hated the models were, Moffat said "No, they're just elite ranks."

Not criticizing him though. He couldn't just say "Yes, we see now that they are dreadful, so we are getting rid." That would upset a lot of people lol.