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Chelsea Supporters Thread (Part 5)
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Tip top 2
11-01-2016
It's all happening lads!

https://uk.sports.yahoo.com/news/hot...082054874.html
Source, Daily Star

Bids made for Alex Texeira and Carlos Bacca, two forwards as predicted. Could be that Falcao and Remy might be off.

If either signs, let's just hope it's not another Juan Cuadrado catastrophe.. No PL experience.
Dixon
11-01-2016
30 million for a 29 year old Bacca, is an absolute joke fee!
We really do have a habit of making major cock-ups when it comes to signing forwards.
Texeira is an OK player but hardly world class.

Anyway, good to see Loftus take his goal well and very pleased by the comments from Gus about him challenging for a first team spot. The lad had far, far more potential than either Mikel or Ramieres, so lets hope he finally gets a fair run in the team.
He is the best prospect we've produced since JT! What stands out for me is how calm he is on the ball and he looks to have time, which is always a sign of a natural, talented player.
The_don1
11-01-2016
Originally Posted by Dixon:
“30 million for a 29 year old Bacca, is an absolute joke fee!
We really do have a habit of making major cock-ups when it comes to signing forwards.
Texeira is an OK player but hardly world class.

Anyway, good to see Loftus take his goal well and very pleased by the comments from Gus about him challenging for a first team spot. The lad had far, far more potential than either Mikel or Ramieres, so lets hope he finally gets a fair run in the team.
He is the best prospect we've produced since JT! What stands out for me is how calm he is on the ball and he looks to have time, which is always a sign of a natural, talented player.”

Its only a poster here who is going on about "signing" world class players most people are an awful lot more sensible about the level of players we looking to sign. Any fee has little to do with a players ability, Its has more to do with who the club we dealing with length of contract and how badly we want the player. As a pretty recent signing his fee is naturally going to be slightly higher then if he had been there for a while plus while Milan are maybe not the giants they once was they are still of a level where we need to go in at the higher end of his value.
Dixon
11-01-2016
Originally Posted by The_don1:
“Its only a poster here who is going on about "signing" world class players most people are an awful lot more sensible about the level of players we looking to sign. Any fee has little to do with a players ability, Its has more to do with who the club we dealing with length of contract and how badly we want the player. As a pretty recent signing his fee is naturally going to be slightly higher then if he had been there for a while plus while Milan are maybe not the giants they once was they are still of a level where we need to go in at the higher end of his value.”


It's about value for money no matter what price you pay for a player.
30 million for a 29 year old Bacca , is very bad business on our side!
Not quite on the Sheva and Torres deals, but not far off.
The_don1
11-01-2016
Originally Posted by Dixon:
“It's about value for money no matter what price you pay for a player.
30 million for a 29 year old Bacca , is very bad business on our side!
Not quite on the Sheva and Torres deals, but not far off.”

But do you think we will find a experienced striker available in Jan for that much less?

Its not fantastic business I agree but if you take into all the factors length of current contract,size of selling club,position (striker often command higher fees),It being Jan etc I really don't think its far from being a logical price.

This window is always a sellers market.

Do we continue with the current options? Or do we bring in new players? If we bringing in new ones I don't think we will be getting away with much less for players of his level unless we buying off a club that need the money or a player coming to end of contracts
Dixon
11-01-2016
Originally Posted by The_don1:
“But do you think we will find a experienced striker available in Jan for that much less?

Its not fantastic business I agree but if you take into all the factors length of current contract,size of selling club,position (striker often command higher fees),It being Jan etc I really don't think its far from being a logical price.

This window is always a sellers market.

Do we continue with the current options? Or do we bring in new players? If we bringing in new ones I don't think we will be getting away with much less for players of his level unless we buying off a club that need the money or a player coming to end of contracts”


Now that we're not going to get to be involved in a relegation battle or qualify for the CL via our league position, i would rather we fiddle through with what we've got and wait until the summer to sign new players.
I know he didn't pull up any tress at Palace, but i would bring back Banford as cover.
Just one winning goal as a sub cold completely turn his career around, More than any other position,. a striker can improve no end with a shot of confidence running through their veins.
The_don1
11-01-2016
Originally Posted by Dixon:
“Now that we're not going to get to be involved in a relegation battle or qualify for the CL via our league position, i would rather we fiddle through with what we've got and wait until the summer to sign new players.
I know he didn't pull up any tress at Palace, but i would bring back Banford as cover.
Just one winning goal as a sub cold completely turn his career around, More than any other position,. a striker can improve no end with a shot of confidence running through their veins.”

Its a tough one. Normally I would agree

Falco fitness is a major worry so that leaves Remy really as the only back up and if his head is turned by the clubs looking to bring him plus when we do need him he has come up injured sadly.

Costa needs someone on his level to push him, I not sure Remy that player, I still see his strength being as a sub
RichmondBlue
11-01-2016
The attraction with Bacca is that he would be avaiable for the Champions League. He's also developed late, so he might have another 3/4 years left in the tank. Not the greatest signing, but we're not in a position to dictate terms if we want an experienced striker. We were linked with him before when he was with Sevilla, so it's not like we're taking a complete gamble on an unknown.

Teixeira looks an interesting proposition. I dont know that much about him but his goal scoring record demands respect even if it is only for Shakhtar.
The_don1
11-01-2016
Originally Posted by RichmondBlue:
“The attraction with Bacca is that he would be avaiable for the Champions League. He's also developed late, so he might have another 3/4 years left in the tank. Not the greatest signing, but we're not in a position to dictate terms if we want an experienced striker. We were linked with him before when he was with Sevilla, so it's not like we're taking a complete gamble on an unknown.

Teixeira looks an interesting proposition. I dont know that much about him but his goal scoring record demands respect even if it is only for Shakhtar.”

Did not think of the availability for the Champion's League.

That's something else that will push the price up. Whenever you buy a asset be it a player or a brand there will be many factors when judging a value. In this case this asset has quite a few costly factors that need to be considered when fixing its worth to us (and the selling club).

Would Teixeira have played with Willian at Shakhtar? If so maybe he has mentioned that he thinks he would be a good fit for us.
RichmondBlue
11-01-2016
Originally Posted by The_don1:
“Did not think of the availability for the Champion's League.

That's something else that will push the price up. Whenever you buy a asset be it a player or a brand there will be many factors when judging a value. In this case this asset has quite a few costly factors that need to be considered when fixing its worth to us (and the selling club).

Would Teixeira have played with Willian at Shakhtar? If so maybe he has mentioned that he thinks he would be a good fit for us.”

Yes, he would have spent 2/3 years at Shakhtar playing with Willian. He's an attacking midfielder rather than a striker, but his scoring record has been improving recently. He's got 22 goals from 15 league games so far this season ! Only 5ft 8ins though, another shorty
The_don1
11-01-2016
Originally Posted by RichmondBlue:
“Yes, he would have spent 2/3 years at Shakhtar playing with Willian. He's an attacking midfielder rather than a striker, but his scoring record has been improving recently. He's got 22 goals from 15 league games so far this season ! Only 5ft 8ins though, another shorty ”

With not an awful lot of time to do research or scout players getting a senior player to suggest names is a sensible route to go down. He will more then likely still talk to players from that league/club etc a risk like any transfer but at the moment its not a awful idea and one that is more sensible then to go down the flavour of the month route of players like Vardy etc.
The_don1
11-01-2016
Hoping we get MK Don's in the next round. Would be a decent away day
carefree_blue
11-01-2016
Originally Posted by The_don1:
“Hoping we get MK Don's in the next round. Would be a decent away day”

Happy with that draw whichever opponent we end up with.
Dixon
12-01-2016
Originally Posted by The_don1:
“With not an awful lot of time to do research or scout players getting a senior player to suggest names is a sensible route to go down. He will more then likely still talk to players from that league/club etc a risk like any transfer but at the moment its not a awful idea and one that is more sensible then to go down the flavour of the month route of players like Vardy etc.”

Imho, Ssnce Raneiri's era our scouting has become very lazy and conservative!
Always going for fairly expensive, almost ready made players and never taking a punt on unproven young talent.
UTD took a punt on Marcial, so why can't we do something like that for a change? Again, there is simply no value in going for someone of Bacca's age at that price!
The_don1
12-01-2016
Originally Posted by Dixon:
“Imho, Ssnce Raneiri's era our scouting has become very lazy and conservative!
Always going for fairly expensive, almost ready made players and never taking a punt on unproven young talent.
UTD took a punt on Marcial, so why can't we do something like that for a change? Again, there is simply no value in going for someone of Bacca's age at that price!”

Because that's not the business plan we have chosen to go down. Taking a "punt" is all well and good but quite a few times its a gamble and saying we should gamble is all well and good when its not your money your suggesting to gamble with. Would you take a punt with millions of pounds of your own cash? Utd can do that to a extent due to the massive cash cow they are. Their revenue streams ensure gambles are not as costly. Now that might change for us when we are settled into the new ground and have opened the different revenue streams that should bring us but at the moment a gamble of X amount to them is very different to us doing the same.

You can keep saying there is no value at that price but that is not going to make any difference because you are using your own meaning of the word and not what actually the club is judging as "value". Any "value" that has no set formula can only be measured by the selling or buying parties.

For example a club has a player who is 33 and a year left or so left on his contract Not going to command a high value normally so really there is not much "value" for a club to buy him. Yet to a club he was worth a transfer fee of 10m on a 4 year contract. Value when it comes to players is not really something you can put a "value" on in a normal way
RichmondBlue
12-01-2016
Originally Posted by Dixon:
“Imho, Ssnce Raneiri's era our scouting has become very lazy and conservative!
Always going for fairly expensive, almost ready made players and never taking a punt on unproven young talent.
UTD took a punt on Marcial, so why can't we do something like that for a change? Again, there is simply no value in going for someone of Bacca's age at that price!”

We were linked with Martial. But £36m (which could rise to £58m depending on clauses) was just considered too much of a gamble.
Anyway, you could say our purchases of Oscar, Hazard and Lukaku were examples of us "taking a punt". True, they were on a lot of clubs radar (same as Martial) at the time, but we were the one's prepared to flash the cash. Even Baba Rahman in the summerwas a gamble, he hadn't done a lot to justify nearly £22m for a young LB. I also think Stones will be a gamble if we end up paying around £40m, he hasn't even been the best CB in the Everton team this season.
codeblue
12-01-2016
cuadrado was the only turkey
Jokanovic
12-01-2016
Originally Posted by RichmondBlue:
“We were linked with Martial. But £36m (which could rise to £58m depending on clauses) was just considered too much of a gamble.
Anyway, you could say our purchases of Oscar, Hazard and Lukaku were examples of us "taking a punt". True, they were on a lot of clubs radar (same as Martial) at the time, but we were the one's prepared to flash the cash. Even Baba Rahman in the summerwas a gamble, he hadn't done a lot to justify nearly £22m for a young LB. I also think Stones will be a gamble if we end up paying around £40m, he hasn't even been the best CB in the Everton team this season.”

Blimey, I do worry about Dixon sometimes.
Well listed RB
Tip top 2
13-01-2016
A bid has apparently been made for JS for £45 million. I think he's worth that, with the increase in revenue this season, although I still doubt that Everton will sell.

http://www.express.co.uk/sport/footb...affic.outbrain
Tip top 2
13-01-2016
Lads, going forward, I'm not going to be able to spend as much time on this thread. My posts have been spotted by a big publication, and I've been promoted now.

I know that will upset a few people, and in my absence I'm nominating Dixon as chief poster on here.

If anyone else is interested in moving up, I'm happy to put a good word in for you (no favours mind), but note, you have to consistently achieve B+ for most of your posts.

Lads, good luck, .. and may the force be with you..
Jokanovic
13-01-2016
Missing you already. No doubt see you posting in the Liverpool thread
codeblue
13-01-2016
Originally Posted by Tip top 2:
“Lads, going forward, I'm not going to be able to spend as much time on this thread. My posts have been spotted by a big publication,”

is RAWK a big publication these days?
RichmondBlue
13-01-2016
Originally Posted by Tip top 2:
“Lads, going forward, I'm not going to be able to spend as much time on this thread. My posts have been spotted by a big publication, and I've been promoted now.

I know that will upset a few people, and in my absence I'm nominating Dixon as chief poster on here.

If anyone else is interested in moving up, I'm happy to put a good word in for you (no favours mind), but note, you have to consistently achieve B+ for most of your posts.

Lads, good luck, .. and may the force be with you.. ”

I didn't know the Beano had a football column ? Good luck anyway, and give my regards to Biffo and Lord Snooty.
Dixon
13-01-2016
Originally Posted by The_don1:
“Because that's not the business plan we have chosen to go down. Taking a "punt" is all well and good but quite a few times its a gamble and saying we should gamble is all well and good when its not your money your suggesting to gamble with. Would you take a punt with millions of pounds of your own cash? Utd can do that to a extent due to the massive cash cow they are. Their revenue streams ensure gambles are not as costly. Now that might change for us when we are settled into the new ground and have opened the different revenue streams that should bring us but at the moment a gamble of X amount to them is very different to us doing the same.

You can keep saying there is no value at that price but that is not going to make any difference because you are using your own meaning of the word and not what actually the club is judging as "value". Any "value" that has no set formula can only be measured by the selling or buying parties.

For example a club has a player who is 33 and a year left or so left on his contract Not going to command a high value normally so really there is not much "value" for a club to buy him. Yet to a club he was worth a transfer fee of 10m on a 4 year contract. Value when it comes to players is not really something you can put a "value" on in a normal way”



But, at one time were picking up very/extremely good players for very good prices - Lamps, Joe Cole, Gallas, Cudachini, Cech , to name just a few.
We are just not doing that these days!
Dixon
13-01-2016
Originally Posted by Jokanovic:
“Blimey, I do worry about Dixon sometimes.”

That makes me feel so much better!
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