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Chelsea Supporters Thread (Part 5)


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Old 03-11-2014, 15:31
RichmondBlue
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Typical media comment to hype brand premiership.

We are a million miles from being the "best team ever". We are playing well in places and have improved from last season but we still have a long way to go before we can even say we are the best team this season. Let's not get carried away and lazy (something that sort of happened at the weekend).

We are going in the right direction but we been there before and shot ourselves in the foot
I agree. In my opinion we haven't yet reached the level of the 2004/5 team, so this is not even the best Chelsea team of the Premiership era. People talk about "The Invincibles" of Arsenal, but we only lost one league game that season, 1-0 away to Man City and that was a penalty. In the Champions League that season we put out Barcelona and Bayern before going down (unluckily) to Liverpool.
Man for man, we had some terrfific players in 2004/5 and 2005/6. Of course, hopefully we will transcend that and reach even higher levels. But I think we've got a little way to go yet.
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Old 03-11-2014, 15:38
codeblue
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I agree. In my opinion we haven't yet reached the level of the 2004/5 team, so this is not even the best Chelsea team of the Premiership era. People talk about "The Invincibles" of Arsenal, but we only lost one league game that season, 1-0 away to Man City and that was a penalty. In the Champions League that season we put out Barcelona and Bayern before going down (unluckily) to Liverpool.
Man for man, we had some terrfific players in 2004/5 and 2005/6. Of course, hopefully we will transcend that and reach even higher levels. But I think we've got a little way to go yet.
We havent consistently played well yet, and when we play the big teams like city and united i am still not convinced we will win them.

I think we have a fantastic young team, which if we can keep them together, can only keep improving.

(I just wish JT was 8 years younger! )
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Old 03-11-2014, 15:57
RichmondBlue
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We havent consistently played well yet, and when we play the big teams like city and united i am still not convinced we will win them.

I think we have a fantastic young team, which if we can keep them together, can only keep improving.

(I just wish JT was 8 years younger! )
Yes, we've certainly got more exciting young talent on our books these days. With the FFP rules we will need them. Even if Abramovich is prepared to dig into his deep pockets again, we can't just go out and buy anyone we want. If we want to bring in one or two more big established names, there will be tough decisions to make about who we let go.
Mourinho is gradually getting the balance right, and I have to admit even some of the decisions I thought were wrong at the time (Mata and Lukaku in particular) now make sense.
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Old 03-11-2014, 16:25
codeblue
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Yes, we've certainly got more exciting young talent on our books these days. With the FFP rules we will need them. Even if Abramovich is prepared to dig into his deep pockets again, we can't just go out and buy anyone we want. If we want to bring in one or two more big established names, there will be tough decisions to make about who we let go.
Mourinho is gradually getting the balance right, and I have to admit even some of the decisions I thought were wrong at the time (Mata and Lukaku in particular) now make sense.
Nearly every decision that jose has taken regarding 10m+ players in and out has been correct.

In

Fabregas
Costa
Luis
Drogba
Remy
Schurrle
Eto
Willian
Matic
Salah
Zouma

Out

Luiz
Ba
Eto'o
Lukaku
de Bruyne
Mata

Compare that to LVG or Ridgers, and the hiring and firing of Chelsea has been tremendous.

As to losing players before we buy, well, Losing cole and Frank, and Torres, must have free'd up nearly 400k a week wages!

Also, the very tough decision to axe cech and bring back courtois has also proved him correct.
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Old 03-11-2014, 17:09
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I think the jury's still out regarding a few of those. But I agree, so far Jose has got most things right with his transfer dealings. Costa, Fabregas, Matic and Willian have proved to be excellent signings. The biggest surprise for me was Willian, I was really annoyed when he was brought in at the expense of Mata, but it now appears to have been the correct decision. If only Willian could find the back of the net a bit more often it would probably be a no-brainer.
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Old 03-11-2014, 17:17
codeblue
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I think the jury's still out regarding a few of those. But I agree, so far Jose has got most things right with his transfer dealings. Costa, Fabregas, Matic and Willian have proved to be excellent signings. The biggest surprise for me was Willian, I was really annoyed when he was brought in at the expense of Mata, but it now appears to have been the correct decision. If only Willian could find the back of the net a bit more often it would probably be a no-brainer.
Willian needs more end product.

I remember him before he went to russia, he could go past players and find the net. He has a good shot on him, we just need more from him.
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Old 03-11-2014, 17:34
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I agree. In my opinion we haven't yet reached the level of the 2004/5 team, so this is not even the best Chelsea team of the Premiership era. People talk about "The Invincibles" of Arsenal, but we only lost one league game that season, 1-0 away to Man City and that was a penalty. In the Champions League that season we put out Barcelona and Bayern before going down (unluckily) to Liverpool.
Man for man, we had some terrfific players in 2004/5 and 2005/6. Of course, hopefully we will transcend that and reach even higher levels. But I think we've got a little way to go yet.
Yep that was the team that should have gone on to forge a Utd like legacy.

The signs are there that this current crop can get to that level but I wont be convinced for a season or two yet. Still very much a work in progress as we have a number of players who are not even close to being halfway to their potentiol
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Old 03-11-2014, 17:39
The_don1
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I think the jury's still out regarding a few of those. But I agree, so far Jose has got most things right with his transfer dealings. Costa, Fabregas, Matic and Willian have proved to be excellent signings. The biggest surprise for me was Willian, I was really annoyed when he was brought in at the expense of Mata, but it now appears to have been the correct decision. If only Willian could find the back of the net a bit more often it would probably be a no-brainer.
I think with Willian it was more who he bought him off more then anything. Before going there he was a very sought after player (and we had been looking at him for a while) and as you say was replacing Mata who was the fans darling so was swimming against the tide (as shown by Dixon's unfair attacks on him).
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Old 03-11-2014, 18:32
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Who is the best player at chelsea?
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Old 03-11-2014, 19:31
RichmondBlue
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Who is the best player at chelsea?
That's a good question. I've noticed people like to talk about a player's "ceiling" these days. in that respect, the sky's the limit with Hazard. If he starts to score goals regularly, along with his amazing ability, he could really be one of the greatest in the world.

Oscar is another with fantastic natural ability, but he needs to be more consistent. Fabregas has fulfilled his potential, and remains a very good player. Costa is a better footballer than I expected, he offers a lot even when he's not scoring.
Matic is an interesting player, he's another with a lot more technical ability than I had expected. For a big man he's got a lovely touch and can pick out a pass as well as some of those who are considered more gifted ball players.
Ivanovic is 30, but apart from maybe Zabaleta, I think he's the best RB in the PL. The amazing John Terry remains one of the best CB's and Courtois and Cech are two of the best keepers in the world.

It has to be Hazard for me. But I think there's one or two other players we'd miss more if they picked up a long term injury.
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Old 03-11-2014, 20:01
The_don1
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It depends on your own criteria. For me it's JT or Brana, I have 100% in them I am confident that they will do the job every single time. Matic is getting close to have level for me. Going forward once JT and Brana go at the moment it will be Oscar and Matic. I not sure it will ever be as good as a few years ago when we had JT,Brana,Ash,Lamps and Cech but I think we was spoiled then.
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Old 03-11-2014, 20:21
RichmondBlue
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It depends on your own criteria. For me it's JT or Brana, I have 100% in them I am confident that they will do the job every single time. Matic is getting close to have level for me. Going forward once JT and Brana go at the moment it will be Oscar and Matic. I not sure it will ever be as good as a few years ago when we had JT,Brana,Ash,Lamps and Cech but I think we was spoiled then.
Yes, it does depend on the criteria you use. Best player in terms of pure ability, or the most important player to Chelsea. I would probably go Matic and JT as the players we would miss most right now. Their replacements would leave us considerably weaker, even with Ivanovic moving into the centre..and I don't want to even think about going back to Mikel as a replacement for Matic.
Losing Hazard would be a big blow, but we do have adequate replacements. We wouldn't pose the same threat without the little genius, but we'd cope.
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Old 03-11-2014, 20:36
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How is the better hazard brother doing this season?
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Old 03-11-2014, 21:23
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I don't think he's being harsh at all criticising the atmosphere at Stamford Bridge and criticising the performance of the team against QPR. He knows what it takes to win, especially a PL / CL double. You've got to be fair and ruthless.

He possibly also knows that supporters should get real and accept that the club will probably have to move from Stamford Bridge to effectively compete in the future.

As far as the performance went, it was poor, and it's better to nip any slide in the bud, as opposed to wait until poor performances start to turn into losses, especially around November time, when historically Chelsea start to falter.
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Old 04-11-2014, 00:57
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How is the better hazard brother doing this season?
Here's his stats for Borussia Mönchengladbach:

Bundesliga - 8 appearances, 0 goals, 1 assist
Europa League - 4 appearances, 2 goals, 1 assist
DFB-Pokal - 2 appearances, 1 goal, 0 assists
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Old 04-11-2014, 07:36
codeblue
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I don't think he's being harsh at all criticising the atmosphere at Stamford Bridge and criticising the performance of the team against QPR. He knows what it takes to win, especially a PL / CL double. You've got to be fair and ruthless.

He possibly also knows that supporters should get real and accept that the club will probably have to move from Stamford Bridge to effectively compete in the future.

As far as the performance went, it was poor, and it's better to nip any slide in the bud, as opposed to wait until poor performances start to turn into losses, especially around November time, when historically Chelsea start to falter.
Your post seems confused.

The atmosphere at qpr had nothing to do with supporters not wanting to move from the bridge. Most fans I know want a new stadium, and would be happy to move if we cannot expand the bridge.
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Old 04-11-2014, 08:30
The_don1
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I don't think he's being harsh at all criticising the atmosphere at Stamford Bridge and criticising the performance of the team against QPR. He knows what it takes to win, especially a PL / CL double. You've got to be fair and ruthless.

He possibly also knows that supporters should get real and accept that the club will probably have to move from Stamford Bridge to effectively compete in the future.

As far as the performance went, it was poor, and it's better to nip any slide in the bud, as opposed to wait until poor performances start to turn into losses, especially around November time, when historically Chelsea start to falter.
Not sure what you mean by "get real".

Most fans I speak to (including many from the C.P.O) know a move is more then likely BUT only the right move and after all the options have been looked at fully.

We dont want another M.K Dons.

When the move happens it has to be done in the right way for the LONG TERM future of the club and has to improve things from more then the income side.

There has to be discussions about current season ticket holders having priorty seating, There has to be a serious discussion about prices (and one thing I would like to see is a "young adult" price to cusion the blow between child prices and paying a full adult price and to attract new ones, We need to lead the way and have a very serious discussion about safe standing (this and the young adult season ticket are the most important IMO) and many many many other things, Not promise of discussions not we will sit down nearer the time and not we will take all views into considration. They have to be discussed and agreed. At the moment there is a popular view amongst the world of football that "fan ownership" is a good idea at Chelsea we might not have that but what we have is a massive say and that should not be given up lightly.

No other top club fans has such a advantage and that should not be given up for promices or lip service

It was not the move that the C.P.O was agaisnt it was the way that the Board went about it.

Someone tells you they are doing something and its to do with something you own and they dont ask you or talk to you about it then of course you going tell them where to go.

The relationship between fans and boards has never been the best in most clubs (and Chelsea more so whoever is sitting on it) but they really screwed up with the way they went about it
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Old 04-11-2014, 17:28
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Not sure what you mean by "get real".

Most fans I speak to (including many from the C.P.O) know a move is more then likely BUT only the right move and after all the options have been looked at fully.

We dont want another M.K Dons.

When the move happens it has to be done in the right way for the LONG TERM future of the club and has to improve things from more then the income side.

There has to be discussions about current season ticket holders having priorty seating, There has to be a serious discussion about prices (and one thing I would like to see is a "young adult" price to cusion the blow between child prices and paying a full adult price and to attract new ones, We need to lead the way and have a very serious discussion about safe standing (this and the young adult season ticket are the most important IMO) and many many many other things, Not promise of discussions not we will sit down nearer the time and not we will take all views into considration. They have to be discussed and agreed. At the moment there is a popular view amongst the world of football that "fan ownership" is a good idea at Chelsea we might not have that but what we have is a massive say and that should not be given up lightly.

No other top club fans has such a advantage and that should not be given up for promices or lip service

It was not the move that the C.P.O was agaisnt it was the way that the Board went about it.

Someone tells you they are doing something and its to do with something you own and they dont ask you or talk to you about it then of course you going tell them where to go.

The relationship between fans and boards has never been the best in most clubs (and Chelsea more so whoever is sitting on it) but they really screwed up with the way they went about it
Things are more complicated at Chelsea due to Chelsea Pitch Owners. The Board have to liaise without a doubt, and I think that everyone attached to the club should realise that a 42,000 capacity ground will not enable Chelsea to compete effectively over the next 10 years +.
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Old 04-11-2014, 18:00
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Things are more complicated at Chelsea due to Chelsea Pitch Owners. The Board have to liaise without a doubt, and I think that everyone attached to the club should realise that a 42,000 capacity ground will not enable Chelsea to compete effectively over the next 10 years +.
It's not really complicated as they do realise that but it has to go further then just liaise with each other there has to be serious and open and worthwhile discussions and ones that have a solution. So far there has been nothing even close to that even the fan forum meeting have been nothing more then lots of nodding of the heads and leaving the meeting and doing the opposite of what was said
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Old 04-11-2014, 19:45
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It's not really complicated as they do realise that but it has to go further then just liaise with each other there has to be serious and open and worthwhile discussions and ones that have a solution. So far there has been nothing even close to that even the fan forum meeting have been nothing more then lots of nodding of the heads and leaving the meeting and doing the opposite of what was said
It seems that most if not all discussions so far have revolved around either redeveloping the existing ground, which would be extremely difficult, or moving to another part of West London where sites are very rare. I doubt anybody connected to the club would accept a move to another city (as happened with Wimbledon / MK Dons) but what about moving to another part of London? Not North or East, but South is an idea. To my knowledge it hasn't been discussed yet.
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Old 04-11-2014, 19:48
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It seems that most if not all discussions so far have revolved around either redeveloping the existing ground, which would be extremely difficult, or moving to another part of West London where sites are very rare. I doubt anybody connected to the club would accept a move to another city (as happened with Wimbledon / MK Dons) but what about moving to another part of London? Not North or East, but South is an idea. To my knowledge it hasn't been discussed yet.
Moving to another city?
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Old 04-11-2014, 20:43
The_don1
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It seems that most if not all discussions so far have revolved around either redeveloping the existing ground, which would be extremely difficult, or moving to another part of West London where sites are very rare. I doubt anybody connected to the club would accept a move to another city (as happened with Wimbledon / MK Dons) but what about moving to another part of London? Not North or East, but South is an idea. To my knowledge it hasn't been discussed yet.
Trouble for it to work there has to be a good relationship between the two parties and at the moment I not sure there is (Jose's comments won't have helped). Don't get me wrong it's better then some clubs but like we have done on the playing side we have wasted a lot of time and made a lot of mistakes with the boardroom and fans relationship, considering what Ken Bates was like it's not really improved that much, I am not talking about Roman far from it, Roman has been godsend and think Chelsea fans will always be extremely thankful for what he has done it's more the people he has employed with the day to day running of the club. There is going have to be a lot of work done from the clubs point of view for any discussion be it redevelopment of the Bridge or moving somewhere else. I think at the moment it's a few years off
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Old 04-11-2014, 23:26
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Must admit, my knowledge about the politics surrounding the Chelsea ground situation is very limited. But I wonder whether clubs will need huge stadia in the future. I know it's almost sacrilege to say it, but won't the future be more about selling live games across all the different avaiable platforms ?
If we could push the capacity of the Bridge up to a more modest 50,000 (if thats possible) wouldn't that be sufficient. Success on the pitch is what brings in the big sponsorship revenue, together with tv revenue and selling all the live games directly to subscribers, wouldn't that make having a giant new stadium a bit redundant ?
I don't know, I'm just asking.
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Old 04-11-2014, 23:51
The_don1
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Must admit, my knowledge about the politics surrounding the Chelsea ground situation is very limited. But I wonder whether clubs will need huge stadia in the future. I know it's almost sacrilege to say it, but won't the future be more about selling live games across all the different avaiable platforms ?
If we could push the capacity of the Bridge up to a more modest 50,000 (if thats possible) wouldn't that be sufficient. Success on the pitch is what brings in the big sponsorship revenue, together with tv revenue and selling all the live games directly to subscribers, wouldn't that make having a giant new stadium a bit redundant ?
I don't know, I'm just asking.
That's if the TV/media bubble never bursts and continues to get bigger (as I don't see wages or transfer fees going down) and I not sure that will happen and we don't have too many "big teams" to dilute the possible income bums on seats will always be a vital income revenue. The more tickets we sell the more sponsorship we can attract as well.

It's not something that will be sold overnight sadly.

At the moment the most logical and sensible step is to put all the efforts into extending the bridge once every avenue has been explored checked and checked again should we then look at moving
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Old 05-11-2014, 15:59
RichmondBlue
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That's if the TV/media bubble never bursts and continues to get bigger (as I don't see wages or transfer fees going down) and I not sure that will happen and we don't have too many "big teams" to dilute the possible income bums on seats will always be a vital income revenue. The more tickets we sell the more sponsorship we can attract as well.

It's not something that will be sold overnight sadly.

At the moment the most logical and sensible step is to put all the efforts into extending the bridge once every avenue has been explored checked and checked again should we then look at moving
Yes, it's a difficult one. You appear to be well informed, do you attend meetings and suchlike ? As I said, I only follow the bits and pieces that come up in the media occasionally. For something so important, most fans (like myself) appear to be ill informed about what is going on. I'm ashamed to say, I don't even know why the Battersea Power Station deal collapsed, that sounded really exciting at the time.
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