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Chelsea Supporters Thread (Part 5) |
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#2301 |
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Forum Member
Join Date: Apr 2009
Posts: 7,680
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Didn't notice at the time, but how on earth did Cahill and Terry end up grappling eachother for Silva's goal??
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#2302 |
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Forum Member
Join Date: May 2008
Location: Richmond, Surrey.
Posts: 13,811
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Quote:
personally I don't think Chelsea are anywhere near good enough to seriously compete in the CL yet. yes, you're beating shit teams and winning the league very comfortably, but it's a poor league at this point in time, so it's not quite the achievement it's made out to be.
for the money spent, and also the type of players in the market that you have access to, I'd expect more creativity and an attacking plan that amounts to more than just giving it to Hazard or Terry/Cahill/Ivanovic scoring from set-pieces. I can't see much wrong with our creativity. Oscar has been below par for a while but he has enormous potential. Hazard is a creative player, exceptionally quick at seeing openings, I just wish he was more prolific in front of goal. Willian is more of a workhorse the way we are playing him, but before he arrived at Chelsea I can remember him running games from midfield. Then we have Fabregas, one of the most creative players in the game. |
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#2303 |
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Forum Member
Join Date: Jul 2010
Posts: 6,213
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well on the evidence of these two games against PSG, you appear to be behind them also. anyone can lose a game or tie, but the ease with which they were able to control the game on your patch with 10 men is rather telling. I don't think it's just them either.
I've not seen a great deal from Oscar in quite a while now, and all I ever see Willian do is run around covering loads of ground. and Fabregas - just as at Barca - appears to go to sleep halfway through a season. in the system you play, that's just too many ineffective attacking players. I make it 49 goals in all competitions between your first-choice front 6, you really can't see much wrong with that? |
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#2304 |
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Forum Member
Join Date: Jun 2006
Posts: 12,605
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Quote:
I've not seen a great deal from Oscar in quite a while now, and all I ever see Willian do is run around covering loads of ground. |
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#2305 |
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Forum Member
Join Date: May 2011
Posts: 7,430
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Surprise surprise.
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#2306 |
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Inactive Member
Join Date: Oct 2014
Posts: 760
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Quote:
You're not allowed to say things like that in this thread.
Willian for example rarely ever gets to the byline and crosses a ball, or even tries to take a player on, although is often seen running towards his own half with the ball! At times last night, the passing of the ball in front of the opposition penalty area across to Ivanovic was like watching a rugby game, where you can't go forwards until you've passed backwards! Chelsea have enough high quality attacking players to score 6 or 7 goals against opposition teams at times, and are just not going there for some reason. That has to change imo. |
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#2307 |
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Forum Member
Join Date: May 2008
Location: Richmond, Surrey.
Posts: 13,811
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Quote:
well on the evidence of these two games against PSG, you appear to be behind them also. anyone can lose a game or tie, but the ease with which they were able to control the game on your patch with 10 men is rather telling. I don't think it's just them either.
I've not seen a great deal from Oscar in quite a while now, and all I ever see Willian do is run around covering loads of ground. and Fabregas - just as at Barca - appears to go to sleep halfway through a season. in the system you play, that's just too many ineffective attacking players. I make it 49 goals in all competitions between your first-choice front 6, you really can't see much wrong with that? I think that's the reason Mourinho has been wary of continuing to play the high pressing game that was successful at the beginning of the season. Loads of possession and nothing to show for it, teams were beginning to hit us on the break and beat us at our own game. I don't think there was much between PSG and ourselves over the two games. They're a very good side when in the mood, and so are we. They can also be inconsistent and play some very ordinary stuff, like ourselves. We were awful in the second half last night, but I'm not sure how much of that can be attributed to the brilliance of PSG. |
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#2308 |
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Inactive Member
Join Date: Oct 2014
Posts: 760
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Quote:
No, I made the same point. We need more goals from players like Hazard, Willian and Oscar. But I don't think it's lack of creativity, there have been numerous games this season where we have created 20+ chances and struggled to convert a single goal.
I think that's the reason Mourinho has been wary of continuing to play the high pressing game that was successful at the beginning of the season. Loads of possession and nothing to show for it, teams were beginning to hit us on the break and beat us at our own game. I don't think there was much between PSG and ourselves over the two games. They're a very good side when in the mood, and so are we. They can also be inconsistent and play some very ordinary stuff, like ourselves. We were awful in the second half last night, but I'm not sure how much of that can be attributed to the brilliance of PSG. As JM said, a few individuals simply didn't perform well enough on the night, and as a team we need to learn and move forward. The main point I agree with is that the team has to be more attack focused. The pressing is great, but then the final balls into the box to score? Often very poor at the moment, including last night. The team has to man up there and step up. In boxing, it's like a fighter who defends very well, and gets in range but is then too afraid to hit his opponent for fear of getting hit back. Too much fear in the play last night, and not enough courage from the attacking players (Costa excepted). Bringing Drogba on was also a big, big mistake, and Mourhino should take some flack for that. He simply can not keep up with the play now, and imo if Mourhino wants a big, strong striker to bring on he should have kept Demba Ba. Incidentally, he scored the winning goal last year. |
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#2309 |
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Forum Member
Join Date: Jan 2011
Location: Alberto Del Rio's Car
Posts: 2,290
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Gutted with the way we went out yesterday. I've lost count the amount of times we've blown a 1-0 lead this season. Our team is not capable of sitting deep and seeing out a 1-0 win any more, we need to change our approach as this has become a reoccurring problem. I know Jose is a very pragmatic manager, but it's time we adopted a different approach when facing tougher opposition. I'm not asking for us to attack relentlessly without giving a second thought for defending, but we need a better balanced approach. There is only 1 game I can think of where we have done this and that was our away game to Man City last season. We completely dominated them with our pressing and we did not sit back after we scored. We went for the kill and we completely nullified City's attack.
Yesterday Oscar, Hazard and Costa were all pressing high up the pitch early on in the game. But the problem is our pressing was too easily bypassed. There's no point in Oscar and Hazard pressing high up if there is a huge gap between our midfield and defence. We need our defensive line to move up the pitch so we can minimise the space behind our midfield. But playing both Terry and Cahill in a high line is defensive suicide, so the end result is that we don't control the game at all. In games like yesterday I don't understand why Luis doesn't play. Luis is our most technical defender and it's frustrating how he doesn't even get a look in. He was phenomenal against Burnley - he won the ball numerous times high up the pitch and he offers so much to our attacking game. Not to mention he's one of the few players who understands how to press effectively. |
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#2310 |
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Inactive Member
Join Date: Oct 2014
Posts: 760
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Quote:
Gutted with the way we went out yesterday. I've lost count the amount of times we've blown a 1-0 lead this season. Our team is not capable of sitting deep and seeing out a 1-0 win any more, we need to change our approach as this has become a reoccurring problem. I know Jose is a very pragmatic manager, but it's time we adopted a different approach when facing tougher opposition. I'm not asking for us to attack relentlessly without giving a second thought for defending, but we need a better balanced approach. There is only 1 game I can think of where we have done this and that was our away game to Man City last season. We completely dominated them with our pressing and we did not sit back after we scored. We went for the kill and we completely nullified City's attack.
Yesterday Oscar, Hazard and Costa were all pressing high up the pitch early on in the game. But the problem is our pressing was too easily bypassed. There's no point in Oscar and Hazard pressing high up if there is a huge gap between our midfield and defence. We need our defensive line to move up the pitch so we can minimise the space behind our midfield. But playing both Terry and Cahill in a high line is defensive suicide, so the end result is that we don't control the game at all. In games like yesterday I don't understand why Luis doesn't play. Luis is our most technical defender and it's frustrating how he doesn't even get a look in. He was phenomenal against Burnley - he won the ball numerous times high up the pitch and he offers so much to our attacking game. Not to mention he's one of the few players who understands how to press effectively. |
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#2311 |
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Forum Member
Join Date: Jul 2010
Location: West London
Posts: 5,657
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Quote:
personally I don't think Chelsea are anywhere near good enough to seriously compete in the CL yet. yes, you're beating shit teams and winning the league very comfortably, but it's a poor league at this point in time, so it's not quite the achievement it's made out to be.
for the money spent, and also the type of players in the market that you have access to, I'd expect more creativity and an attacking plan that amounts to more than just giving it to Hazard or Terry/Cahill/Ivanovic scoring from set-pieces. The first job of any team is to try and win the league, thats the number one priority. We have a pretty decent chance. Chelsea have not won it for 5 seasons. If you are seriously saying that it won't be an achievement then you are very wrong. So if Barcelona win La Liga will that not be much of an achievement as they only have one, maybe two teams to get the better of ? I don't disagree in that Chelsea aren't at the level of the big 3 and they have to improve but you don't need to be the best to win it. |
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#2312 |
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Forum Member
Join Date: Jul 2010
Location: West London
Posts: 5,657
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It was a poor display last night. Too many players was off the pace. Looked lethargic and at times dis-interested.
We didn't deserve to go thru but going ahead twice we should of been capable of holding onto a lead however bad we were playing. |
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#2313 |
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Forum Member
Join Date: May 2011
Posts: 7,430
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Are we good enough to win the The Champions League?
Of course not and that should not be the objective at the moment, We just about good enough to compete for the title at the moment (time will tell if we good enough to win it) after quite a few years, Not since Carlo have we had even the slightest chance of being anywhere near the level needed to mount a title challenge. Have about much interest in the type of football we play as much as I have in the most popular color of underwear today. The only thing that matters is lifting the league title at the end of the season (or at least being in with a chance until the last weekend or so), To do that we have to do one thing and that's improve every season. Where we should be, What type of player we should have, What type of football we should be playing is irrelevant. Jose had a tough job when he came back a much harder job then when he first came he had to sort out a awful mess and has done a very good job so far, The difference from last season is the difference between night and day and its been done in a very sensible way. The players might not be classed as "young" but they are young in terms of playing title winning football. They are learning each game and will have learned a hell of a lot from yesterdays game (more so then they would have by winning it) and it will make them better players. Drogba was not just bought back for what he does on the pitch, Jose lost one of his biggest strengths in the dressing room when Lamps left and with Cech not being number one it was possible he was losing another one, He needed to replaces those voices, Hazzard Oscar etc are not those voices yet and Drogba was perfect for role. Who scores our goals is not important, As much as its important we attack as a team we defend as team that's the main thing. A goal from JT is as valuable as one from Costa when it comes to the final result Last season we could have played with a extra man and had Roman as a ref and I still don't think we had a chance to win The League, Every weekend when I went to the game I thought "how are we going to win this game? Where is the goal going to come from?" this season I am confident we will score (and I think we have only played one game this season where we have not). Its a massive improvement and that's all I can ask for each season. |
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#2314 |
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Inactive Member
Join Date: Oct 2014
Posts: 760
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Who's in and who's out?
Imo:
Cech - will probably be sold. Cahill - out. He won't be happy with a squad role, and JM will bring in another world class defender. Preferably Varane. JT? - a poor record in Europe, but still very consistent domestically. You can never play a high line with JT in the team, and Benitez had a point there. Mikel - out. Looks injury prone now, and is too immobile to play in the holding role. Zouma - very much in, and should have a long future at the club. Oscar - this will cause some debate. Definitely out. Not nearly consistent enough, and I would definitely play a second striker on occasion as opposed to playing Oscar. Cash in and spend the money wisely. When he could have been sold instead of Mata, he turned on the tackling football. That's gone now, and I would definitely bring Mata back. No doubts there at all. Mata is still young, has loads of experience and what you lose defensively he more than makes up for attacking wise. Willian - in, but he has to start taking more risks. Shoot every now and then, try and take a player on every now and then. Far too cautious, but is that what he is being told to do? Play it safe? You have to take risks to win in football. Remy - probably out but he hasn't really been given much of a chance. I do not agree with Mourhino's obsession with playing one striker all the time. He played very well early on in the season but was then automatically dropped for the next game. Very demotivating, and what's the point of scoring crucial goals if you're automatically dropped to accommodate a sometimes very boring and negative one striker policy? Drogba - in and out. I do not agree with don 1 and his comments about Drogba's voice in the dressing room. He should have been brought back as a coach and emergency back up maybe, not as an outfield player. As mentioned earlier, if JM wanted a big, strong physical presence, what was the problem with Ba?! He scored some crucial goals last season, and was very dependable. He was never going to be number one, but as a regular back up, very good. Who will be brought in? Another world class striker definitely and a world class centre back. Patrick Bamford is due back, and the likes of Loftus Cheek are coming through. |
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#2315 |
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Forum Member
Join Date: May 2011
Posts: 7,430
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Being a coach would be a different voice in the dressing room. Coaches have one of them no matter who they or how long they been there. He needs them amongst the players. Someone who knows his management style, someone who knows what he expects someone to get the players back on his way of thinking when things are going wrong, he needs "his" players being the biggest voice in the dressing room. Someone who has won the league title, someone who has played at places like Wembley and won there.
Drogba I don't think was ready to retire last season, Do we owe him a playing contract? No of course not but I like the fact we gave him one, gave him a chance of a last trip to his favourite ground Wembley. As it stands he will more then likely retire as a Chelsea player and that's how it should be. |
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#2316 |
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Inactive Member
Join Date: Oct 2014
Posts: 760
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Quote:
Being a coach would be a different voice in the dressing room. Coaches have one of them no matter who they or how long they been there. He needs them amongst the players. Someone who knows his management style, someone who knows what he expects someone to get the players back on his way of thinking when things are going wrong, he needs "his" players being the biggest voice in the dressing room. Someone who has won the league title, someone who has played at places like Wembley and won there.
Drogba I don't think was ready to retire last season, Do we owe him a playing contract? No of course not but I like the fact we gave him one, gave him a chance of a last trip to his favourite ground Wembley. As it stands he will more then likely retire as a Chelsea player and that's how it should be. |
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#2317 |
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Forum Member
Join Date: May 2011
Posts: 7,430
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From on the pitch perspective no there is no point but sometimes that's not the overriding reason to do something.
The Drog retiring in any other shirt then a Chelsea one would be a sad thing to see. We have so few real legends at Chelsea for many different reasons (from Ken Bates to our very high turn over of players since Roman bought us) and to create a dynasty we need them. Winning the title in the Drog's last season creates a emotional memory. Not only for the fans but for the players. His last kick in his first run was to win the Champions League, his last kick in this run could end with us lifting the trophy (not saying he will score), it creates a type of legacy we don't have or has never really had the opportunity to create |
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#2318 |
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Inactive Member
Join Date: Sep 2012
Location: A Sound Expert
Posts: 13,881
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Quote:
Imo:
Cech - will probably be sold. Cahill - out. He won't be happy with a squad role, and JM will bring in another world class defender. Preferably Varane. JT? - a poor record in Europe, but still very consistent domestically. You can never play a high line with JT in the team, and Benitez had a point there. Mikel - out. Looks injury prone now, and is too immobile to play in the holding role. Zouma - very much in, and should have a long future at the club. Oscar - this will cause some debate. Definitely out. Not nearly consistent enough, and I would definitely play a second striker on occasion as opposed to playing Oscar. Cash in and spend the money wisely. When he could have been sold instead of Mata, he turned on the tackling football. That's gone now, and I would definitely bring Mata back. No doubts there at all. Mata is still young, has loads of experience and what you lose defensively he more than makes up for attacking wise. Willian - in, but he has to start taking more risks. Shoot every now and then, try and take a player on every now and then. Far too cautious, but is that what he is being told to do? Play it safe? You have to take risks to win in football. Remy - probably out but he hasn't really been given much of a chance. I do not agree with Mourhino's obsession with playing one striker all the time. He played very well early on in the season but was then automatically dropped for the next game. Very demotivating, and what's the point of scoring crucial goals if you're automatically dropped to accommodate a sometimes very boring and negative one striker policy? Drogba - in and out. I do not agree with don 1 and his comments about Drogba's voice in the dressing room. He should have been brought back as a coach and emergency back up maybe, not as an outfield player. As mentioned earlier, if JM wanted a big, strong physical presence, what was the problem with Ba?! He scored some crucial goals last season, and was very dependable. He was never going to be number one, but as a regular back up, very good. Who will be brought in? Another world class striker definitely and a world class centre back. Patrick Bamford is due back, and the likes of Loftus Cheek are coming through. JT may be slow, but he marshals the other defenders into a unit. Zouma is not ready for that. Bring mata back? I simply cannot agree, that ship has sailed. United are crying out for the player you describe, why arent they using him? because he gets ran off the ball. Oscar at 23 has the potential (and has performed for club and country) to be world class. He is the bedrock and the future, along with eden, they are the crown jewels. To even think of selling him is, well, i simply cannot understand it. Remy out? hasnt been given a chance, but has performed well when on the pitch. Cheap as chips, why not keep him as he is? |
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#2319 |
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Inactive Member
Join Date: Oct 2014
Posts: 760
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Oscar out, Mata in.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=h6OjNTMuh88 https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Xhhr-jZ7ukU Where the utter rubbish comes from that he kept getting pushed off the ball I have no idea. Chelsea player of the season two years in a row and he is still only 26. More attacking football, and less of the defensive obsession. It's not working anyway, and Chelsea don' even have the best defensive record in the league. How many late goals have the team conceded this season? More than most other teams.
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#2320 |
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Forum Member
Join Date: May 2011
Posts: 7,430
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The old player of the year twice chestnut and the even older "attacking" football one.
Next it be what the media and people on talk shite say next The fact we are top of the league says it is working |
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#2321 |
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Inactive Member
Join Date: Sep 2012
Location: A Sound Expert
Posts: 13,881
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Quote:
Oscar out, Mata in.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=h6OjNTMuh88 https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Xhhr-jZ7ukU Where the utter rubbish comes from that he kept getting pushed off the ball I have no idea. Chelsea player of the season two years in a row and he is still only 26. More attacking football, and less of the defensive obsession. It's not working anyway, and Chelsea don' even have the best defensive record in the league. How many late goals have the team conceded this season? More than most other teams. ![]() Why do you not think he is not in the United squad? |
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#2322 |
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Forum Member
Join Date: May 2011
Posts: 7,430
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And Benitez never has a point.
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#2323 |
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Inactive Member
Join Date: Oct 2014
Posts: 760
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Attacking football
It's petition time ladies and gents, and we're looking for 10,000 signatures
Bring back attacking football, bring back the magician! https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jHCFxOM6yvs Thank you.
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#2324 |
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Forum Member
Join Date: May 2011
Posts: 7,430
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Will it be entitled "I don't want to win the league"
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#2325 |
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Forum Member
Join Date: May 2011
Posts: 7,430
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Seen that it seems we won't be loved.
But I want to be loved, I want a hug I have to be loved, someone love us |
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