With Lampard and Gerard having surely now played their last tournament for England, that is the end of The Golden Generation,

I believe that started in 98, with the emergence of Beckham, Scoles, Owen, and The out going of Gazza (who pretty much symbolised 90-96, along with other greats like Pearce, etc, and were England most successful "generation" since the sixties

The term The Golden Generation I dont think was being widely used till the 2002 World Cup, and Eriksson taking charge, but 98 had many players in place.


So, WHY didnt the Golden Generation get even close to winning anything ?

I do think that certainly they had the players, and did under achieve... but were also rather unlucky in a number of ways...

Right, heres my list, i am just thinking off the top of my head, so please feel free to add your "unlucky" moments for this team... will start off very generally...

1.-Going out on Penalties numerous times. The obvious one.

2.- Coming up against "Talismanic" players at their peak, who often seem to do especially well aginst us (Pirlo, Suarez,Ronaldinho, Figo,Ronaldo,). I know Suarez was 70% fit, but that was probably his greatest match in a Uruguay shirt, for example, an amazing performance.

3.- Injuries have ruined / severely affected potentially our two best young players of this generation. Rooney is not the player he was since 2004, and Michael Owen is still only 34, but has been pretty much semi retired for ten years. Both player really were potentially Messi / Ronaldo like when younger, the thought of the pair of them together up front for ten years could have been astounding.

4. Unlucky with refereeing decisions. Sol Campbells disallowed goal, etc. Also I still think if Lampards goal against Germany was allowed it really could have turned that game, etc. I am not saying England were always let down by refs, but i think the balance has been slightly against them.

5. Having to sing a national anthem that very few of them actually believe in, but thats been the case for a long time I guess.

6.- Glenn Hoddle saying something stupid, but then the press making things even worse, and Tony Blair effectively sacking him. Hoddle was potentially the man who would realy change English football. I still dont get why he said what he did, whether he still believes it, ir has ever apologised, but what a daft way to spoil things, from a number of sides. He was and is still one of the best thinkers on the game, especially compared to his colleagues Keegan and Mclaren,

7. Sven did okay, if he had a bit of luck, and a fit Rooney, Owen, Beckham in the big tournaments then a semi or final was not out of the question. In many ways he is similar ro Roy Hodgson, without the dirty bits, his teams are solid, but need that bit of magic from a star player or two.

8.-Capello. Disaster in the tournaments, yet was widely regarded as a truly great manager. No one could have seen how bad England would be in tournaments under him.

Right, thats it for now, missing my new fave team, Chile

Englands golden generation, were more then likely the best team England have had since 66. However when compared to other teams around at the same time, they werent golden, but more aluminium. By English standards, golden yes, but by world standards anything but.

Bad management:-


Picking the best players but not the best team:

players out of position

unbalanced

players that don't compliment each other

Taking big names instead of players in form

Taking unfit players to tournaments.

Sounds like a lot of excuses to cover up the fact that English players aren't as good as English people think they are, and are made to look better by playing with world class imports from around the world

They were never as good individually as the English media made out and as a team they were tactically unbalanced and playing a style(*) that never suited international football. They lack class midfielders who stay behind the play and help solidify the defence. Hargreaves and Butt were the last decent ones I can think of. Other countries have masses of these type of players.

(*Style = get it wide early and hope Johnson or Baines can break down the sides. Play at a high pace that doesn't vary so the opposition are never caught unawares. When you get tired and need goals get Gerrard or Beckham or whoever to launch long passes forward totally avoiding the need to build play through the middle and hope someone gets a flick on. Have one young player who can run with the ball and let everyone pin their hopes on him and treat him as if he's the next Messi because he's the one English player who occasionally tries to dribble.)

They also have elements in their media (which can spread to fans) which are terribly dismissive of other teams they view as being below them. Arrogance is bad enough from those who actually are better than everybody else but it's laughable some of the statements ex-footballers make to the British media who lap it up. It's a symbiotic relationship where a name says something controversial for cash and the media promote it to have something to write about and we lap it up like the tabloid reading idiots we are. It's an industry built on bullshit.

In their version of reality they live in a world where the giants of football such as England, Brazil, Germany, Italy and Argentina compete for the World Cup every 4 years. That's understandable from the common person on the street who only gets into football every 2 or 4 years and gets caught up in the media hype but these "experts" should know better. They get the same outcome every tournament and still trot out their garbage the next one.

Commentators this time have mainly been balanced and rational but you still get the odd one who goes the tabloid, jingoistic route. I guess it's an easy earner for them.

This current team has no connection to the 1998 squad.

I feel it started with Beckham, Scoles, Owen in 98, but was not really labelled the Golden Generation till 02, of which Cole, Lampard and Gerard were just joining in, with their retirements coming up, i think its fair to say its the final end of the golden generation.

(Actually, Lampards debut was in 99, Gerard in 2000, and Cole 2001 )

Rather than bad luck, the generation rarely played well in big tournaments.

Mainly because of overexpectation, ego, picking players not a system, not using a system to account for the opposition.....and the fact that the players were never as good as people made out.

World Cup 1990, Euro 96 and World Cup 2002 were the only tournaments we turned up at in the last 25 years. There was no Golden Generation.

Rooney's injury in the game against Portugal in Euro 2004 was a massive blow. Who knows what might have happened had he not suffered that injury?

We played woeful in that game. Basically just tried to defend our lead for the last hour or so.

We should never have had the penalty against Argentina in 2002.

With a fit Rooney, things could have been different.

Interestingly the player to concede the penalty was none other than the current Spurs manager.

basically.

IMO, the Euro 96 squad remains the best of my lifetime, especially when you look at the quality of players that couldn't get into it. the players got more high-profile after that, but they didn't get better.

We'll never know, but look at how other countries are doing at this World Cup without their best players e.g. Colombia & Falcao, France without Ribery, Nasri etc.

I think that for many years English players have lacked the basic skills to play quality football.

Many times during this World Cup I have watched a match, Germany/Ghana for example, and wondered why England can't play like them. Ghana were superb, playing exciting, creative football and had the skill and confidence to pass and keep the ball, they were very unlucky to draw.

Unfortunately, there is no way that England can play like that at the moment.

LOL at the OP point 5, about the national anthem, it's hardly a rousing tune to sing at the best of times when you compare it to other anthems such as the French or Italian.

96, penalties, woodwork, gazza nearly scoring that golden goal
94, Koeman - cheating and then chipping in the winner
92, Alan Smith for Lineker
90, Penalties, Woodwork
86, The hand of God
82, Unbeaten in WC but still knocked out.

this unlucky streak never ends does it....

True, with a rub of the green England would have won the last eight world cups...

⚽

Is this a troll thread? Rooney and Owen being potential Messi and Ronaldo level players? Please...

I would say it's poor management choice, they are almost always a type who would do well in the premiership. Bookish. Arsene Wenger types.

The English mentality also needs a cock in the squad to motivate, some kind of arrogant tosser in mid-field.

With such leadership then I think England could be routinely in at least the quarter-finals and frequently the semis.

It wouldn't have helped with the players being named 'The Golden Generation'.

I thought that gold was something you get when you win tournaments.
Fancy being called one of the golden generation before the team has actually won anything yet.

Yeah, self-proclaimed titles (or ones proclaimed by your own media) tend not to stand up to scrutiny.

There's been a few golden generations from different nations, right enough, and not all of them have won things. It's not just England that have used that tag.

English fans are spoilt by the Premier League. Its no way near as good as people think it is. I suppose a lot of fans think it will reflect in the England team. The unpleasant truth is that we just are not that good at football. We don't produce enough talent. We don't produce talent that can compete at any level, let alone international level.

Hardly. The PL is one of, if not the best, leagues in the world.
In the last 10 years of the Champions Leage.
Spanish winners: 4
English winners: 3
Italian winners: 2
German winners: 1

Not that it neccessarily helps the England team.