Cain needs to get over himself but Adam has every right to be angry at her - she cheated on his dad twice shagged his mate and tried to hide the truth about james to him and would of never of told him if she got away with it.

James has basically been disowned by his 3 kids he's hardly got away with it - and neithe should he

With his kids, Pete & Finn saying they would meet him tomorrow. Earlier in the episode Pete also decided that they weren't going to cut him out the family.

Well who raised Adam to be such an immature little bellend?

Ultimately, the writers have done a bang-up job in ruining Moira's characrer. I never liked this storyline to begin with. This idea that the show built up of John and Moira being the ideal married couple has been smashed to pieces.

another thing I can't get to grips with is why Alex is always thrown back in her face? He lied about Victoria around that time. She thought and he lead her to believe he was single and was seeing them both at one point, yet it was Moira who called a slang and other names by people in the village. If I was Moira, I would move. People in the country are horrible.

Unfortunately it's the woman that always cops the most flack

as a woman, although I am not surprised, I am still deeply saddened by this.

*Like that would have mattered to her. The insects would have been still gorging and getting very fat on John at the time
** I wish she would. I think the very deepest African jungles are nice but I'm not sure because not many have come back.


She so is, always has been. Cain should have known better than to trust her. She cheated with him didn't she?


Because it's the way of the world that it's usually the man who instigates it, because he's been given the right signals. A woman can still say 'no' if she wants to. Without her consent it's rape and in this case it wasn't.

I haven't been a fan of this storyline since it first came out but the hypocrisy in the last few episodes have ruined it even more for me! Tbh I found it pretty hard to have much sympathy for the likes of Adam & Cain considering their past mishaps (although understandably Adam was going to take it badly) & even Chas was clearly under the impression that her halo was bigger than it was.

The only one I really had sympathy for was Moira; regardless of what she'd done I thought the way she was treated was awful, hypocrisy at it's best. I really wanted her to stick up for herself or for at least one person to have her back but I guess they're going to go down the route of portraying her as the deceitful baddie for some time.

The fact that James practically got off free made it even worse!

I know but I would have thought Kate Oates would have made sure there was one person who was, if not sticking up for Moira, certainly backing her and telling her vile son off when he was calling her nasty names and being horrible to her generally. She's still his mum, she's stuck by him when he's done some stupid/downright bad things yet she's repaid by him making out like she's Slut of the North? Like she repeatedly shagged around? She cheated on John twice in 20-ish years. OK it's twice too often but it hardly makes her a serial adulterer!


Exactly. Apparently she lied and didn't tell him about her and James. But I ask you, would you? In Moira's position I wouldn't have either! Can you imagine what he'd have been like? Aggression against James, glaring, creating bad atmospheres, moodiness, sulking, probably following Moira around like a shadow in case James went near her! FGS he'd have been unbearable. Would I have told him? Absolutely not and if that makes me a slutty liar so be it! Sometimes it's better not to know everything. I very much doubt that Cain has sat down with Moira and told her everything about his past - for a start she wouldn't have the time, its a helluva tale and she's got a farm to run!


Ah. Diddums.

Sorry not directed at you Jimmy, directed at Cain and his silly attitude. It makes me quite mad that he stood there while Adam was vile TO HIS WIFE! Where's Cain's loyalty? Where's his natural protective instinct towards his wife? He just stood there whilst Adam was horrible to her. He obviously thought she deserved it and if I was Moira I'd find THAT hard to forgive. Never mind Moira's 'lied't to him and he's in a huff, if I was Moira I wouldn't have him back if his @rse was decked with diamonds. No loyalty at all.


Thank you, exactly. I think she told herself that Adam must be John's as James was just a one off.


Thanks JOP. Chas really disappointed me. Bloody short memories they've got on ED. Needless to say I agree with everything you say.


Thanks. They really took the pee having Adam manipulate Cain didn't they? When you think about it that was stretching it somewhat!

I honestly thought that Cain really loved Moira, that she was different to him but how can she be when he allowed himself to be led so easily? He never stuck up for her once and I can't say I'm not disappointed in him.

It's the venom coming from Adam which is so nasty to watch. His attitude when he almost gleefully told her that he'd told his sisters and implied that she'd lost them as well now (I somehow doubt it!) was awful, he was loving every moment of it, actually enjoyed watching her suffering. I could understand to an extent if she'd been a bad mother but she wasn't, she stuck by him when some mother's might have washed their hands. It's like he loathes her now and I know he's in shock but she doesn't deserve that

Moira has had some food for thought when it comes to the men in her life, they certainly don't love her as unconditionally as she loves them!


Thanks Bonny!


Ha, thanks Star! My amazing memory for names raises it's ugly head again, lol!


BIB1: I have a feeling that it'll come out that John knew all about it but made James promise that she'd never find out. That would explain John having nothing to do with James again, he didn't want the possible father of his son on the scene plus he will have known James better than anyone and knew that he took advantage of Moira when she was at a low ebb and hated James for it more than Moira? (I'm not absolving Moira of blame by the way, just wondering if John could have thought that way? I can imagine him drawing a line under it like that because he loved Moira so much.)

BIB2: I hope Chas remembers his lie, might give her food for thought that he isn't as innocent as he portrays himself.
Unless of course it's the writers forgetting that James had said that in the first place, lol!

Emma's a mystery isn't she? Your husband's a cheat so you leave and never contact your sons again never mind take them with you? I think there's a lot more to James and I don't think it's nice. They could be working their way up to him being another ED baddie. Never being in touch? She's either scared/terrified or dead.


Oh yeah, because the Barton son's were really as vicious as Adam weren't they? IMO they were what normal kids would be like, and out of the three of them there was bound to be one having a hissy fit like Ross.

Yes James has really suffered, just like Moira who's currently waiting to be tarred and feathered and her head shaved. Not forgetting the big 'A' attached to her front.

I'm just waiting for Peter Cushing to ride in as The Witchfinder General shouting "thou shall not permit a witch to live!" whilst he sets up the dunking stool!


ROFL!!! I wouldn't have put it past the little toad.


I didn't like it either when I first heard. I know they have to come up with storylines but they sold us a very happy, tight couple and now they had 'secrets' *roll eyes*


To show how much of a slut she is of course! *roll eyes* (bloody hell, I'm rolling my eyes so much they're going to be sprained soon!)
Of course when it comes to Alex her biggest crime was that ...... *gasps!* ... he as SO much younger than her.

Burn the witch!

Lotty, Thank you. I always enjoy your posts so much. You're very articulate and say what I try too Another thing, that's a similar point to the first you made, I couldn't believe in Thursday's episode at 8 when Adam said he was glad John died in the car crash to stop him getting an STD from Moira that NOBODY, not even James, told him he was out of order. I would have done more than slap any man who said that to me.

Why?
Adam is hurting. His father, who he loved and looked up to, wasn't his father. His mother is anybody's for a dish of fish. Pretty devastating. Wouldn't you lash out?

James isn't suffering as much as Moira because he has not done something as bad as Moira who has cheated and lied a lot in the past - maybe that's why Adams more angry the james kids and not because she is a woman! Very weak excuse to try excuse someone's behaviour

4 guys in 40 years - Adam's had more partners than that in 4 years!

Is shagging two brothers any worse than shagging a mother & daughter

James has cheated and lied as well, there is a lot we don't know about him and he has down so to his children for the same amount of time as Moira has. As she said on her wedding day, they are both as guilty. Now you're going to need to help me out here Lewis, but I'm generally curious, as to where I have said that Moira's behaviour was ok?

Have I even mentioned you? I just think a lot of people here are excusing Moira's behaviour because she is a woman and Adam is being made out to be the villain here which is ridiculous.

No one is defending james or making excuses for him as he is in the wrong but at least he tried to be honest as soon as he knew there was a possibility he could be his dad where Moira just wanted to continue lying. This Is the second time she cheated on his dad - Adam is completely justified in his actions IMO

apologies, I just assumed that seeing as this thread was created by me it was directed towards me. We're going to have to agree to disagree but I take your difference of opinion on board.

That's fine - that's what the forums are for, different opinions!

BIB: Me too. The way they were all rounding on her like a pack of rabid dogs was quite distressing to watch (even Chas who really disappointed me.) I'm typically British, I'll protect the underdog, lol! But the reactions were disproportionate IMO especially Cain's and Chas's, even Adam's OTT. Of course he's going to be devastated, the parentage he took for granted has been turned on it's head and his foundations have been rocked. Devastation and anger I can understand (but is he forgetting that he's still related to John as his nephew? Tha's a pretty close relative, you share half the genes!) But it was the venom which got me, the awful things he was saying as if she was the good time that's been had by all! Actually enjoying seeing her crumpled, cowed and sobbing. Horrible to watch. Whatever else she's been she's been a good mum to him, supportive when he's needed it the most.


Exactly. Things like that really got to me. Didn't Cain stand by while he said that? About his wife?!

(thanks by the way )


Well said Sheepie. I think we should remember this - 4 men. Four.





Don't anyone get me wrong, I'm not excusing Moira's behaviour all those years ago but we've all made mistakes when we were young and daft (and in her case it sounded like she was upset, crying and at a low ebb) but yes she could have pushed James off and told him 'no' but she's human. She made a mistake and now seems to be paying far too high a price with her new husband leaving her (because she never told him - one could ask what the hell it's got to do with him anyway as it happened years before they even met!) and her son treating her worse than something he stood in, he seems to actually loathe her. But his nasty attitude is making me lose all sympathy for the whining brat.

I think what also needs to be remembered is that Moira was still in shock as well, she's known about a month herself, that's not along time at all. Obviously we can't be sure but she may have told him at a better time, when he actually liked James, but I guess we will never know now. I think it was easier for James to get his head around because as he has said many times that night meant something to him and the product being Adam makes that night all the more real, I'd imagine.

Didn't Adam sleep with his girlfriend's mother a few years ago? Declan's family.

I can't get over half the people slagging her off weren't even alive when the incident happened or in Chas's case, none of their bleeding business.

Should Moira go back 20 years ago and criticise the state of Chas's sex life? She doesn't need to, her current one is just as messy.

LOL!!!

I think the dumbest thing of this whole storyline is that it is based on a home DNA test with a sock of all things...a sock for that may or may not belong to Adam. And can't wait to see Chas fall off that high horse she's on.

So sleeping with your brothers wife isn't as bad as sleeping with your brother inlaw?

From what we have been told so far it sounds like James always fancied Moira (his brothers wife) and when she was vulnerable he took his chance. I'm not saying that what Moira did wasn't wrong but it is clearly James who is the one who pursued her and continued to pursue her when he came back.

As I've said before, I think the acting last night was very good but I would have liked to have seen the writing more evenly balanced. The Barton boys lost their mum because of their dads obsession with Moira yet they have already decided that he won't be chucked out of their family. Meanwhile, Moira loses everything and is judged harshly by those closest to her. The only one who had any right to be angry was Adam - Chas and Cain's reaction was far too extreme when you consider the things they have done in the past.

Anyhow, if Moira hadn't have been decent enough to give the Bartons a roof over their head when they had lost everything then none of this would have happened - so I guess at the end of the day it is all her fault