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Quarter Final: Brazil vs Colombia @ Fortaleza, 04.07.14 @ 9pm, ITV 1/HD |
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#626 |
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Join Date: Nov 2002
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Quote:
Neymar is out of the World Cup, fractured vertebrae, nothing was said about that challenge for some reason.
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#627 |
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Join Date: Mar 2011
Posts: 6,777
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Quote:
Neymar is out of the World Cup, fractured vertebrae, nothing was said about that challenge for some reason.
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#628 |
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Inactive Member
Join Date: Jul 2005
Posts: 10,692
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Terrible blow losing Neymar, he is a genuinely brilliant footballer. Silva will be badly missed in the semi as well, looking pretty tough for Brazil so they will probably romp home now.
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#629 |
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Join Date: Mar 2005
Location: London
Posts: 10,702
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Quote:
There were people on here accusing him of time wasting, even after he was stretchered off.
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#630 |
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Inactive Member
Join Date: Jun 2014
Posts: 1,575
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Quote:
Neymar is out of the World Cup, fractured vertebrae, nothing was said about that challenge for some reason.
He will come on in a wheelchair. Sorry, very sad if true, he is quality. |
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#631 |
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Join Date: Mar 2008
Location: My Bedroom
Posts: 8,905
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He will come on in a wheelchair.
Sorry, very sad if true, he is quality. |
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#632 |
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Inactive Member
Join Date: Nov 2008
Location: London, UK
Posts: 11,516
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Disgraceful performance from the referee. Way to lenient allowing foul after foul after foul.
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#633 |
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Inactive Member
Join Date: Jun 2014
Posts: 1,575
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For the late nighters out there, the World Football Phone on BBC 5 Live starts at 2am, will mainly be about Brazil I reckon, and Vickery is on.
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#634 |
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Forum Member
Join Date: Nov 2002
Location: Dublin
Posts: 51,620
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Quote:
Disgraceful performance from the referee. Way to lenient allowing foul after foul after foul.
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#635 |
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Join Date: Jul 2009
Location: UK
Posts: 17,852
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Horrible. I hope germany win. Never thought i would say that.
Broken back is shocking. They probably shouldnt have lifted him the way they did, then. Might end his career even? |
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#636 |
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Inactive Member
Join Date: Nov 2001
Location: BUDDIETOWN
Posts: 20,385
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yeah, BLATANT knee to neymar's back, that should be considered dangerous!
wonder if they'll be any retroactive punishment for THAT? sadly, no there wont |
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#637 |
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Join Date: Nov 2002
Location: Dublin
Posts: 51,620
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yeah, BLATANT knee to neymar's back, that should be considered dangerous!
wonder if they'll be any retroactive punishment for THAT? sadly, no there wont |
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#638 |
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Join Date: Jul 2005
Posts: 4,412
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Quote:
The decisions they get by being at home (as every home nation do, us included in 66) has maybe just seen them over the line in some games. Maybe that sounds a bit ott but there have been a few decisions in games that I imagine would have gone for Brazil whereas they didn't for their opponents. Not sending off Caeser tonight and Neymars elbow against Croatia are two that spring to mind. Not clear cut you could say but they do make a difference. Then there was the continuous fouling tonight that saw one player (I think) booked. I just cant help thinking they are getting all the big 50/50's their way. Nothing surprising or new but perhaps a reason why so many would be disappointed to see Brazil win what has been a brilliant tournament and why they are attracting so much criticism.
All international tournaments are fixed to help the hosts to a greater or lesser degree - ask yourself why host nations have such an astonishing level of success at the World Cup, the Euros, the Copa America and the African Nations Cup. A while back some statisticians at a university whose name escapes me analysed the figures and found that host nation status is worth at least a goal a game. I would estimate that 60-70% of host nations win the tournament, 80% reach the final, 90% reach the semi-final and 99% reach the quarter-finals or come at least fourth (the early Copa Americas, the first World Cup and some African Nations Cups have been held as round-robin league tournaments with no knockout stages). You can't tell me that is all down to the normal advantage of playing at your home venue in a football match. That is one of the reasons why the myth of the great Venables team of 1996 is such utter self-delusionary rubbish. If we were any good we'd have won the bleddy thing, or at least reached the final instead of a German team ravaged by injury with the entire world-class spine of their team missing. The referee in the the infamous South Korea v Italy match was later banned after being found to have fixed matches in his native Bolivia (and amusingly was also found guilty of corruption in his later political career). That's far from the only example of a bad stench around a host nation's success at international tournaments - take the exremely suspicious goings-on in Argentina's 1978 win to name but one example. As you correctly point out our record as host nation is hardly squeaky clean either. Some of the shenanigans that worked to our advantage in 1966 were beyond dodgy - the refereeing selection controversy for the knockout stages under the then English FIFA president, the extremely suspicious refereeing in two of the quarter-finals (contrary to revisionist rubbish about "animals" we committed 33 fouls to the Argentinians 16, yet they were the ones who had their captain controversially sent off, not to mention our almost as controversial offside winner) and the last-minute switching of the designated venue of a knockout match the hosts were due to play to the host's national stadium, which is still unique in World Cup history. There is a widespread belief in South America that 1966 was fixed. In fact that's part of the reason Argentinians have absolutely no remorse about the Hand Of God - they see it as revenge for that 1966 quarter-final, which they still call "el robo del sigio" (the theft/robbery of the century). Euro 96 was no different - the refereeing in the Spain game for example was absolutely shocking. Gascoigne getting away with blatantly hacking down Alfonso in the box and Martin-Vasquez's clearly onside goal being disallowed are only two examples of the embarrasingly homer refereeing. The then Spain manager Javier Clemente said "We had no chance - we had to play 11 Englishmen, 70'000 fans and the referee". The only reason we didn't take advantage of the help host nations always get and win what was an extremely low-quality tournament in general is the fact that we have alway been depressingly rubbish. Contrary to popular belief there was no halcyon period when we made the world tremble. We have been regularly embarrassing ourselves on the international stage ever since we first entered international tournaments the last time the World Cup was held in Brazil and were knocked out in the first round, infamously losing to a bunch of no-mark amateur ringers masquerading as the USA. Things are even worse this time - the powers that be are desperate to dampen down the whole controversy in Brazilian society surrounding the corruption and the broken promises of improved social provision and infrastructure that came with the award of the tournament to Brazil. If Brazil don't provide the success an entire nation are desperate beyond belief for, in order expunge the trauma of the catastrophe of 1950 whch is still ingrained in the national psyche 60 years later, the potential for earth-shattering riots, social unrest and the resurrection of some extremely difficult questions for FIFA, the CBF and the Brazilian Government to answer is surely making certain powerful individuals wake up sweating in the middle of the night. I pray that at least two of the Brazilian team go mental and beat their opponents to the ground right in front of the referee and the eyes of the world. Fortunately it isn't yet possible to absolutely guarantee the result of a football match 100% (I hope). That is almost the only way I can see a fair fight in the rest of the tournament - and I say that as a Brazilophile who collects and DJs Brazilian music, loves most things Brazilian and who for years helped run a stall at Portobello and Camden market selling Brazilian music and goods. I would love nothing more than to see a Brazilian side with the unutterable beauty of '70 or '82 smash all-comers on the way to winning at the Maracana in a couple of weeks time, but not this side and not in this way. Mark my words - Russia will reach at least the semi-finals in 2018; in 2022 we will all be hearing about "plucky little Quatar" emulating the astonishing North Koreans of 66; and if the USA get the World Cup in 2026 as has been mooted, every news report for days after they win the final with an offside goal will feature mass crowds at fan parks, delis and bars in the States chanting "U-S-A, U-S-A" ad infinitum. If only there was some way to hold the bleddy thing at a neutral venue. |
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#639 |
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Forum Member
Join Date: May 2011
Posts: 1,466
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I just do without all the hype that surrounds Brasil, they are a shadow of the sides that played in 70 and 82. The beautiful game has died, 1982 saw to that, it's now all about winning.
They have some stars but they also have some bang ordinary players. As for last night's officials, Brazil set out to rough up Columbia and they just let it go, by the second half it was a free for all. I'll hold back on saying he was a homer but he was extremely poor. The Brasil encroachment on a Columbia free kick was scandalously not penalised, the knee in the back on Neymar, the persistent fouling of Rodriguez. Just shocking. It almost felt like Brasil had the heads up that anything goes just before kick off. |
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#640 |
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Forum Member
Join Date: Dec 2004
Posts: 11,349
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Quote:
Yep, pathetic and idiotic comments in here about him play acting even after we'd had the replay which showed him being kneed in the back and he was being stretchered off in agony. I'll resist the temptation to go back and quote them but those individuals should be thoroughly embarrassed.
When you spend as much time on the floor as he does, it's only natural that people willl assume he's not seriously hurt again. |
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#641 |
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Forum Member
Join Date: Nov 2013
Posts: 177
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Quote:
Terrible blow losing Neymar, he is a genuinely brilliant footballer. Silva will be badly missed in the semi as well, looking pretty tough for Brazil so they will probably romp home now.
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#642 |
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Inactive Member
Join Date: Sep 2012
Location: A Sound Expert
Posts: 13,881
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I called it last night during the game.
We could see Brazil almost assaulting James throughout the evening, and the ref allowing it. When James tackled a Brazil player, he got a yellow himself and Brazil scored from the free kick! With no ref protection, it was no surprise that the Colombians started to mix it up themselves to the point of the game being incredibly dirty. I could see that one player was about to be seriously injured, and posted here that this would happen. Then Neymar got kneed on the back! I was expecting a leg breaking tackle. |
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#643 |
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Inactive Member
Join Date: Apr 2008
Posts: 6,613
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My dad is still saying we should have done what was done to Neymar to Surraz and I am starting to agree with him. Please persuade me otherwise.
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#644 |
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Inactive Member
Join Date: Sep 2012
Location: A Sound Expert
Posts: 13,881
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Quote:
My dad is still saying we should have done what was done to Neymar to Surraz and I am starting to agree with him. Please persuade me otherwise.
What happened to Neymar on the 88 the minute was retaliation for the refs allowing the away team to be kicked throughout the game. I hate to say it, but Brazil are spoiling the tournament. It should have been a great game of football but we got spoiling, kicking, dirty fouls and a ref so bias that he would not book players for assaults. Yes in the end the Colombians gave it back, but if the ref doesn't protect them they have to do it themselves.. In the chile game, when a brazil ing player scythed down an opponent, the chilieans took their "free" foul against Neymar and kicked him. It is the fault of homing refs, refs who have clearly been told not to give out cards, and the style of spoiling stoke type play that Brazil have adopted that has caused the Neymar injury. He is lucky that he will play again in a month, as I was expecting a leg breaking tackle on him out of frustration and retaliation. Brazil have lost fans worldwide. Their football is cynical anti football, they make a mockery of the great footballing Brazilian teams. It has changed so much that I would want Germany or Argentina to win over them! |
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#645 |
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Forum Member
Join Date: Oct 2007
Location: London
Posts: 895
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Quote:
Yep, pathetic and idiotic comments in here about him play acting even after we'd had the replay which showed him being kneed in the back and he was being stretchered off in agony. I'll resist the temptation to go back and quote them but those individuals should be thoroughly embarrassed.
Having said that, I have every sympathy for Neymar. It was a horrible incident that should not go unpunished. I would also say that the ref was an absolute disgrace and if anybody should be embarrassed it is him. |
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#646 |
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Forum Member
Join Date: Jun 2009
Posts: 12,251
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The Luiz free kick was a rare highlighted of what a disappointing game due to the players taking advantage of the ref's approach sadly.
Hopefully the rest of the games aren't so stop start and full of fouls. |
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#647 |
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Join Date: Feb 2003
Location: Derby
Posts: 27,584
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Funny how a relatively clean, fun tournament is turning into a hackathon!! Having said that Ghana and Honduras put in some impressively physical performances in the group stage.
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#648 |
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Forum Member
Join Date: Feb 2003
Location: Derby
Posts: 27,584
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Is he though? I just don't see it myself. Unbelievably overrated footballer.
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#649 |
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Forum Member
Join Date: Aug 2012
Posts: 588
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If I read you correctly then I agree 100%. I fact I'm surprised at the naivety of many people and especially the TV and radio pundits, who believe that because Brazil aren't playing well this or that team might upset the applecart. How good or bad they might be is virtually irrelevant - Brazil are as nailed on as you can get to win this tournament.
All international tournaments are fixed to help the hosts to a greater or lesser degree - ask yourself why host nations have such an astonishing level of success at the World Cup, the Euros, the Copa America and the African Nations Cup. A while back some statisticians at a university whose name escapes me analysed the figures and found that host nation status is worth at least a goal a game. I would estimate that 60-70% of host nations win the tournament, 80% reach the final, 90% reach the semi-final and 99% reach the quarter-finals or come at least fourth (the early Copa Americas, the first World Cup and some African Nations Cups have been held as round-robin league tournaments with no knockout stages). You can't tell me that is all down to the normal advantage of playing at your home venue in a football match. That is one of the reasons why the myth of the great Venables team of 1996 is such utter self-delusionary rubbish. If we were any good we'd have won the bleddy thing, or at least reached the final instead of a German team ravaged by injury with the entire world-class spine of their team missing. The referee in the the infamous South Korea v Italy match was later banned after being found to have fixed matches in his native Bolivia (and amusingly was also found guilty of corruption in his later political career). That's far from the only example of a bad stench around a host nation's success at international tournaments - take the exremely suspicious goings-on in Argentina's 1978 win to name but one example. As you correctly point out our record as host nation is hardly squeaky clean either. Some of the shenanigans that worked to our advantage in 1966 were beyond dodgy - the refereeing selection controversy for the knockout stages under the then English FIFA president, the extremely suspicious refereeing in two of the quarter-finals (contrary to revisionist rubbish about "animals" we committed 33 fouls to the Argentinians 16, yet they were the ones who had their captain controversially sent off, not to mention our almost as controversial offside winner) and the last-minute switching of the designated venue of a knockout match the hosts were due to play to the host's national stadium, which is still unique in World Cup history. There is a widespread belief in South America that 1966 was fixed. In fact that's part of the reason Argentinians have absolutely no remorse about the Hand Of God - they see it as revenge for that 1966 quarter-final, which they still call "el robo del sigio" (the theft/robbery of the century). Euro 96 was no different - the refereeing in the Spain game for example was absolutely shocking. Gascoigne getting away with blatantly hacking down Alfonso in the box and Martin-Vasquez's clearly onside goal being disallowed are only two examples of the embarrasingly homer refereeing. The then Spain manager Javier Clemente said "We had no chance - we had to play 11 Englishmen, 70'000 fans and the referee". The only reason we didn't take advantage of the help host nations always get and win what was an extremely low-quality tournament in general is the fact that we have alway been depressingly rubbish. Contrary to popular belief there was no halcyon period when we made the world tremble. We have been regularly embarrassing ourselves on the international stage ever since we first entered international tournaments the last time the World Cup was held in Brazil and were knocked out in the first round, infamously losing to a bunch of no-mark amateur ringers masquerading as the USA. Things are even worse this time - the powers that be are desperate to dampen down the whole controversy in Brazilian society surrounding the corruption and the broken promises of improved social provision and infrastructure that came with the award of the tournament to Brazil. If Brazil don't provide the success an entire nation are desperate beyond belief for, in order expunge the trauma of the catastrophe of 1950 whch is still ingrained in the national psyche 60 years later, the potential for earth-shattering riots, social unrest and the resurrection of some extremely difficult questions for FIFA, the CBF and the Brazilian Government to answer is surely making certain powerful individuals wake up sweating in the middle of the night. I pray that at least two of the Brazilian team go mental and beat their opponents to the ground right in front of the referee and the eyes of the world. Fortunately it isn't yet possible to absolutely guarantee the result of a football match 100% (I hope). That is almost the only way I can see a fair fight in the rest of the tournament - and I say that as a Brazilophile who collects and DJs Brazilian music, loves most things Brazilian and who for years helped run a stall at Portobello and Camden market selling Brazilian music and goods. I would love nothing more than to see a Brazilian side with the unutterable beauty of '70 or '82 smash all-comers on the way to winning at the Maracana in a couple of weeks time, but not this side and not in this way. Mark my words - Russia will reach at least the semi-finals in 2018; in 2022 we will all be hearing about "plucky little Quatar" emulating the astonishing North Koreans of 66; and if the USA get the World Cup in 2026 as has been mooted, every news report for days after they win the final with an offside goal will feature mass crowds at fan parks, delis and bars in the States chanting "U-S-A, U-S-A" ad infinitum. If only there was some way to hold the bleddy thing at a neutral venue. Like you said it's near impossible to fix a match or a tournament but you can do many things to nudge teams over the line. A team with quality (which Brazil have despite not being an outstanding side) will take advantage of these breaks. That said the South Korea v Italy game shows just how blatant these things can be Brazil winning this would leave a sick taste in many peoples mouths and the Germans will get the support of most neutrals on Tuesday. It's not an anti-Brazil thing, it's simply due to the way they have played and the things that have gone in their favour throughout the tournament |
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#650 |
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Forum Member
Join Date: May 2012
Posts: 4,209
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I'm not embarrassed for not believing him - THE BOY WHO CRIED WOLF SYNDROME!!!
If players didn't roll around after the slightest touch or no touch at all then people wouldn't call them out when they are seriously injured! The way he was bundled on to the stretcher probably didn't help any injury he had already suffered!!!!! |
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