I've been wanting to know for some time if the majority of people with widescreen (16:9) TVs tend to watch old 4:3 programmes stretched into the 16:9 ratio, causing the picture to look wider than it really is, or do most put it into its proper ratio with black bars at the side, which is what I do.

I've been wondering this for some time now because when I use many other people's TVs and put it temporarily into 4:3 to watch something old, they question why the image looks all tall and not right, meaning that they have got used to seeing that programme fat. Is this the case for the majority of people, where they watch 4:3 stretched, or do most get the TVshow the black bars at the side (which is noticeable at first but soon you forget that they're there)?

Also, another question regarding 16:9 CRT tvs, since I switched directly from a 4:3 CRT tv to a HD 16:9 LCD display. Were these TVs able to display 4:3 content with black bars at the side like the modern TVs are, or could they only display old content stretched? I know that they could display 16:9 content well, but did they offer support for correct 4:3 viewing too?

Black bars every time.

I wouldn't want to watch a sideways-stretched picture or lose the top and bottom of the picture when zooming it.

I went from 4:3 CRT to a widescreen LCD, too, so I can't help with your query.

Some TV channels are actually doing the second (cropping the top and bottom into a 14:9 format, even if the programme was originally broadcast in 4:3). We have no other option in these cases.

Grey bars for me as I have a plasma. Always 4:3 though never fattyvision.

If you have a Pace Sky box though you may not have a choice as some TVs do not allow you to manually alter the aspect ratio on HD HDMI.

I hate it when its stretched would rather have the bars than for it to be zoomed in to.

Yes, CRT sets had similar options to Plasma/LCD, allowing various different settings.

You need to be aware though that all broadcasts were only 4:3 - 16:9 were simply broadcast with black bands top and bottom. The 16:9 CRT set then stretched it to fit vertically, so it was lower resolution than normal 4:3. This is one reason the USA never went widescreen (prior to HD), because their pictures were lower resolution to begin with, and they couldn't afford to lower it even more.

I always used to watched stretched more so with DVDs, but since Netflix, Blu Ray & HD channels 4:3 with black bars down the side is the norm and doesn't bother me in the slightest.

Nowadays I always have 4x3 displayed as 4x3, no stretchy vision.
However if you have a tiny LCD, 4x3 will look very small, so stretchy mode is prolly ok in that situation. Btw, by tiny I mean screen size of say under 20inch.

We could widen this discussion to say why do so many people like their picture burned out or over vibrant.

Ex.
When our friend and neighbour got a new large screen LCD, she could barely see the difference between sd and hd (due to how it was setup). After I checked and fixed the settings such as putting the digi box into 1080 output, she agreed she could see the difference. Then I put a film on, and put the TV is Movie mode display - and this didn't go down well......too dark, too dark! But that's how it should be I said, no no no, too dark....

We seem to have come a long way. It wasn't so many years ago that people were demanding on DS that everything should be stretched (and writing to the broadcasters).

The thrust of the argument being that they's paid a lot of money for wide screen real estate and they wanted it filled. They hadn't paid to watch black bars.

I used to be a stickler for ensuring everything was displayed in the correct aspect ratio. But nowadays, almost all my "serious" viewing is HD anyway, so displays correctly. As for the rest, the SD stuff that's most likely to be in 4:3, well it's a crappy picture anyway (compared to HD), so I'm not so bothered now if it appears in fatty-vision. It also makes channel-surfing quicker as there's no lag when the set switches from one ratio to another.

I did see a few anamorphic transmissions on analogue TV (about 4 I think). These were not advertised and I think were probably (almost certainly) accidental with the wrong aspect being selected by the broadcaster since there was no switching info and I had to adjust manually - still good though. I expect they got some complaints about tall skinny people from those with 4:3 sets.

Always black bars for me.

Was demonstrating my TV to a colleague, who was interested in buying the same model, and he questioned how to change the screen mode when he saw the black bars. Told him that it was the correct aspect ratio and recommended not to use that button (keep it on AUTO), but he didn't seem to be convinced.

It's like some people think they are getting short-changed if their screen is not completely full of image all the time.

That probably was the most commented justification for fattyvision.

It seems that the vast majority of people on Digital Spy watch 4:3 material with bars, however we need to remember that those on here are likely to be more concerned with the image looking correct than the general population. Because the majority of other people that I know seem to watch old stuff in fattyvision mode. Was it really worth buying a 16:9 TV in the early 2000's if you didn't have digital TV and even then it might not have been worth it since only the four analogue providers were using a widescreen ratio at that time. Were any others doing so?

I think the main use would have been for playing DVDs. Also a lot of broadcast material was 14:9 and so you could zoom in a little bit for smaller bars without losing anything. (apart from what was taken off before transmission)

Laserdiscs where available in widescreen as early as 1989.

VHS had widescreen versions early 90's.

DVD were widescreen when released in 1997.

It's not only 4x3 that gets butchered, ratios like 2.35:1 get zoomed to full screen, I wonder if the person knows what they are really doing, losing picture information and picture quality. I suppose they are more bothered about filling the screen.

used to have them in "cinema mode", where the edges were stretched, and was perfectly happy with it!

now i zoom the picture in and have the option of moving the screen vertically, as virtually all the old programs can be viewed centrally, but with a slight scroll up the way

Nearly always 4:3, although I'll often flip through the five or six picture formats my TV provides. I think old episodes of Family Guy are ones that I'll sometimes change to fill the screen without it being too noticeable.

I wonder how many people were trying to alter the first episode in series 2 of Utopia

Anyone got the boxed set of The West Wing?, we had a customer bring it in a year or two back - just one of the DVD's in the set was in a completely obscure format - with black bars top, bottom, and sides, which you couldn't get rid of. The other discs were fine.

Season 3 was non anamorphic, you would need horizontal/vertical zoom to make it fit the screen. If the TV does not provide this feature then it's not very flexible and goes to show having control at the TV end is a good idea, that's what we have been trying to say on the other thread.

I've needed to do this on a few discs that have not got an anamorphic transfer.

[tangent]Not all DVDs were in widescreen; there were definitely full screen versions out there. A quick glance of my collection shows I have a fullscreen version of Monty Python and the Holy Grail. Bought it back when I was young and naive and my only dvd player was built into my oldschool Windows ME PC which only had a 4:3 15" monitor. I thought at the time that this was the best idea (and cheaper too!) as it would look too small on my screen from about 5 feet away! [/tangent]

And don't forget, if something was made on studio video in 4x3 and not changed in anyway, then mastered to DVD, the picture would still be 4x3. I have many old TV progs which were originally made in 4x3 format and later sold on DVD with no changes other than a front menu screen. Those DVDs are all in 4x3 format.

I think most people, barring DS members, watch fatty vision. Recently I've seen in two different houses satellite boxes set to 4:3 and the punters watching everything in fatty vision on 16:9 TVs. In one case the TV was a recent replacement for a 4:3 CRT.

That was what I was thinking. Most people are probably leaving it to "auto", and for most TVs that means stretchy/fattyvision. Or for some TVs the top and bottom of the image is cut off, which is bad in a different way.