I heard two housemates talking about Pav on the HL show tonight; I think it was Ash and Helen (although I’m not sure) .

They were talking about Pav and they said “Pav keeps boasting all the time that he is going to ‘win the money’ obviously BB isn’t showing us this footage because they want Chris out on Friday but why on earth is Pav doing this..

If he wants to be accepted as part of the group he should keep that to himself and then maybe he wouldn’t have to keep going in the DR and whining on and on about not being accepted…..

Pav also said he has been watching BB from day one….so, where was he when Christopher, Chris and Ashleigh were getting bullied and not accepted by the other house mates. They had to work hard to be accepted and it was painful for them.

Sorry guys but Pav is using the “I’m a victim so please vote the old housemates out because they don’t like me ” as a way to the final….it won’t work ….sadly Winston will be the winner.

The logic here is slightly flawed, becasue if Pav's going around boasting that he's going to win the money, but wants the sympathy card, then how does he know the edit isn't showing the boasting parts and not the footage that's sypathetic towards him?

I've only seen him say 'I know I'm not going to win the money' LOL

Are you referring to several convos that took place after Pav's letter was read out and where the 'end goal' all of a sudden became the 'prize money'? And then all of a sudden these hms who are only in there for the experience start slating Pav for wanting to win?

What the heck are they all doing in there? I smell the hypocrisy a mile off with this lot.

On just about every HL show Pav is seen in the diary room speaking to BB about how he's not accepted by the group.

But almost every other scene they show of him in the house he's actually there with a group of housemates talking and having a laugh.

The housemates talk with him, sit outside with him, and one one occasion he's actually having a hopping race with him.

What does Pav expect of them?
Even Marlon seemed to be more on his own in his last week than Pav is.

Pav is not trusted because 'he knows what he's doing' - it must be true because Danielle and Matthew told them.

HMs don't have to know what the edit will be before they do things they think will affect viewers. Sure, the edit might frustrate their hopes and plans, but that doesn't mean they can't have plans or can't be trying to carry them out.

Indee, why couldn't he be doing both, saying he's going to win and playing for sympathy?

He could even think he's going to win because he'll get sympathy.

And anyway, why shouldn't the housemates not trust him when it took them just over 6 weeks to trust each other?
Why would you trust anyone who you've known for barely two weeks?

He's got their company and their time, what more does he expect?

I do find that Chris is getting the Danielle treatment this week. I'm fairly neutral to him too, i do think he's boring to an extent yet his "crush" or whatever you want to call it on Ashleigh is fine since it's harmless. Yet I've found it quite odd and out of character for Chris to be so adamant against Pav, sure a reason could be he doesn't want Pav getting any attention from Ashleigh but i think that's a bit short sighted. It does seem there's more to it, more that we're not been shown. It's like recently when Helen was talking about how Chris and Ash have been getting along brilliantly and they've had a lot of chats of the past two weeks, Chris agreed and Ash affirmed this as well... Where were these conversations? Where is the Chris/Ash friendship storyline? So yeah, something's up that we're not getting the full picture and the hatchet is being buried in Chris's back this week. I have a feeling these producers would prefer Pav to stay to get closer to Ashleigh or become more of a Machiavellian player.

BIB - But Marlon knew how to handle himself in there.

That is a seriously good question

What, exactly, does Pav think the other housemates should be doing for him ?

Because it doesn't make sense to do that. If he wants the sympathy vote then he'll have to appear humble and make out as if he's not expecting to win. Going around telling the HMs he's going to win the money is hardly going to get him some sympathy.

I don't believe he's even said it. It's most likely they are still going on about his VT and given how they twisted what was said in his letter just so they could bitch about him I wouldn't be surprised if it's the same thing that's happened here.

Excellent points. Unfortunately we see only the tiniest of snippets and since 5 took over I think the manipulated editing has been very strong

So Helen has made her mind up about Pav after a couple of weeks has she?

Now what was her opinion of Slugworth, Wasp and 'Creepy' Chris after a fortnight?

Did we take her word for it?

Apart from the hopping race and other scenes where he's with them, When they were talking veg, Ash included him in the convo asking what he'd be.

Considering Pav said he was the least welcoming in his nomination it makes me wonder what we might be missing.

I also think personality has a lot to do with it. Pav is probably the wrong kind of person to come in late as he seems more deep, like he'd want a real conversation with you and really get to know you.

Problem is the HMs have all built up their trust and will find it hard to interact with Pav on his level. Partly because they all have their confidantes and partly because of the vt and ex HMs they haven't built up the level of trust.

Zoe and Bianca fit right in because they're much more jump right in, have a laugh, don't get too deep, kind of people. If you're a newbie and you just join in the fun, you'll get along fine, if you want anything deeper, you'll struggle because connections have been made and every group you try and get deep with you're affecting the dynamics.

It's much better as a newbie to play it likeZoe until you've built up friendships and trust.

Fishy isn't it?

I said before, Pav knew going in that he had to work to stay in. No point playing the HMs, they have already bonded, so he's better off playing the viewers.

BB viewers love an underdog.

Not freezing him out, perhaps? Taking him at face value and getting to know him. Not telling him to stop looking at people. Not calling him 'Stirrer' ?

Several of them have said they keep him at arms length. One has called him a prickly and said that he doesn't want to get to know him, whilst telling him to his face that he likes him and would like to go out for a drink with him.

As they all say, even after a couple of weeks, that its an intense environment.
They have accused Pav of all sorts :

Staring at Ashleigh
His VT and not "being himself"
Not trustworthy
Saying he's going to win

I just think the HM's begrudge someone coming in so late in the game and thats why they dont like/trust him coupled with the messages from Danielle and Matthew. So any little thing they are going to jump on and twist to suit their agenda.

As for Pav, I do feel sorry for him. He has been isolated in there - something that cannot be denied just based on the amount of times we see HM's talking aout him constantly, And so he must be feeling quite lonely and isolated, knowing, or thinks that he knows he is disliked by both housemates and public.

None of those hms were ever bullied or had to work hard to be accepted at all ! Where was Pav??? he wasn't in the house for a start. It's clear Christopher was annoying to the hms and that is the reason they couldn't bond with him judging by his constantly being nominated by hms including Chris.

So does Pav.

I pretty much agree with you. I think the hms have been full of suspicion and paranoia and have not taken too well to Pav's VT. However, the excuses that they have come up with to validate their points are laughable. In fact, they've actually changed the context of what was said in his letter and are making a mountain out of a molehill that he's some kind of gold digger and will kill to get to the final and the 'prize money'.

I also think Pav has made every effort to fit in and get along with them. He has been seen to do this and like another poster has said above, we have seen him sit and have a laugh or having fun. But | think that's down to Pav trying not to allow them to ostracise him and just forcing himself to be part of the group. Where else would he go? Sit on his own in the bedroom? Surely that would really be seeking sympathy and victim status? No, instead he's probably flummoxed and confused at the open hostility shown from the likes of Mark. That incident where he was asked his opinion about what kind of fruit he'd be was an example of being hostile even though they were the ones to ask his opinion. I.e. to look like they are including him but then sneering at him when he says anything. It's very subtle, but it's there and he must be confused by it.

And then the talking and bitching about him behind his back. It's the viewers who have given Pav the victim status, not Pav himself. He's said he expects to go on Friday because he doesn't fit in despite his efforts, but will do his best to have as good a week as he can.

You don't know that either. Just because he goes into the DR and bleats it parrot fashion it doesn't mean it's happening. The hms talk about each other even after being together for a longer time.than Pav. BB could be using the odd times the hms talk about Pav because that is the part they have chosen for him.

Just as it seems they have chosen to show Zoe in a negative way just talking about herself and thiking she is above everyone else. The hms seem to have good things to say about her so i am sure she just doesn't have those conversations that BB wants us to believe just as Pav probably doesn't feel isolated as they want us to believe either.

BB producers WANTED everyone to hate the new housemates.....they said that they wanted to "stir things up" so this is exactly how BB wanted it to go....everyone is being controlled by BB. Have people forgotten that BB is the 'baddie' here which is why people are losing interest in the show...its all gone 'too far' and its become very nasty.

The show used to be fun but this year people are hating the show

theres a huge difference between saying you are there for the money then saying i WILL WIN the money.

Helen and ash really arent reliable for their comments

Well they did change 'end goal' to 'prize money' rather conveniently.

I don't see why the original housemates think they have more right over staying in until the end over the newbies. Someone will always have to be the newbie and they know when they go in their is every chance new people will be added. I think it was unfair of mark to call Pav a stirrer when it was Helen that went and told him Christopher was faking in the test. Why was she not called a stirrer?? Also they are all in there to win it. What about Zoe and how she talks about being there until the end. I think they all have a right to be in there, they all have a right to be nominated and evicted and they need to remember it is a game and we the viewers have the say on who we want in or out. I thought Judy James was spot on with Chris when she said about Helen not being so in control so he had to pick on Pav as he himself had been picked on. I used to like Chris but I will be glad to see him go on friday