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Has Edith improved since she came in?
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jacko12
11-03-2005
Originally Posted by thenetworkbabe:
“Edith does something very similar to what Alex did in the music room singing quietly . She did it more with Carrie - where there was a different mood going on too - but even with David she sings each word with its meaning reflected in her voice. Lots of subtle stuff goes on. The actresses had a go at emotion and Kim usually asks the right question how do I sing this, but Edith is the only one i have seen just do it. What she doesn't do is carry that so much into the show performance and she can't hit the wow button so often to underline what the emotion is she is conveying. To be fair Alex usually took a longer lesson to get it right, had a jazz singers voice in reserve and enormous lung capacity and often had her backing tracks altered to fit the new concept so its not surprising if we are short on wow.


I think its the same interpreting skill though. David seems to think so too - though apart from duets and one afternoon they kept Alex with Carrie . Lesley's point I thought is the other thing you notice about Edith and Lesley, David and Carrie have all told us about. Edith knows so much music that she knows the style these songs ought to be sung in - she knows how to sing Sinatra. That doesn't mean she sings it just ike Sinatra or without her own touches or can't steal ideas from multiple sources - it just means it sounds right for what it is. Ade did it for punk and Reggie for rap but Edith does it for all sorts of styles.

Thats all why I think we had several cases of the judges disagreeing about her too. The feeling the song thing turns up with Bridge Over Troubled Water which she says is her favourite as she feels the song more and which she sings quietly in the music room with lots of things going on that don't quite make it to the performance - Richard wants Alex like wow on stage. The musical knowlege turns up when he gets criticised by Richard for not adding wow to her swing song and David and Carrie point out that that is how you sing swing . Edith knows what swing singers wouldn't do so she doesn't do it - result Richard and public not so enthused. Its the FA 2 problem with Peter and Paris where you had Carrie and David pointing out they wre doing the right things for people in their genres even if Richard wanted something else and the public wouldn't vote for them..”

I've said this before but will say it again for you.
the main difference between Edith and Kim is Edith feels the music which is only to be expected as she has music around her all the time, where as Kim is a method singer, put simply she needs a story to feel the song, it's a common thing with a lot of singers but mainly with a singer/songwriter as you've already mentioned her I'll use Carolynne as an example if she gets a song written by some one else she also requires a story, but if it's one of her own songs she has the feelings for the song as she writes from the heart ( her words not mine), the only one out of the finalists to improve is Kim when she first went in she didn't put any emotion in her singing now she is, fair enough she's not the finished article by a long way but she has improved and if she had the confidence in her singing and stopped being so intense about her technique feel she has a lot more power in her voice if she put a bit more of herself into the song,
AgingRocker
11-03-2005
Thankfully Edith and Kim are different, otherwise it could all get a bit samey. They are both excellent singers, with a slightly different type of appeal.

Kim has excellent technique. Edith has a more throaty quality to her voice which I find more appealing. I'll probably go on tonight's performance/vocal, which of course could even be Ade though I haven't voted for him yet.
woden666
11-03-2005
Originally Posted by T--J:
“Stripped (the album containing the Beautiful track) was only released in late October 2002 and Beautiful was released as a single in late February 2003. As Alex went into FA in July 2003, she wouldn't even have had chance to be singing it 'in public for donkeys ages' or have 'literally ... years to work ... up to suit her style', never mind the inclination. ”

Agreed in part due to a surfeit of Banks's Mild on my part in the early hours of this morning . However, do you remember all those vids of AP on FA covering that song, in front of an open air audience, way before it was performed on that first night before She entered the academy?
zelana
11-03-2005
Originally Posted by grant1:
“I agree! Edith is an ok singer, but without the Radio One hype and promotion, which is a totally unfair advantage, but invariably to be expected from them, isn't really a credible new talent!”

This is Comic Relief does Fame Academy, not Fame Acadamy, Pop Idol or X-factor. The whole idea is to get people to raise money for Comic Relief. Part of the promotion has to come from Radio One so what better way than for them to support one of their own. The hype and promotion isn't for Edith herself its to encourage more people to vote for her and also to raise awareness of Comic Relief and encourage others to do their bit. Claudia mentioned that someone had worked out that each contestant in the show would generate about £1,000,000. The votes are just part of it, the majority of that money will come from people seeing the show and deciding to do their own thing to raise funds.

It doesn't really matter who wins its the raising money that counts.
jacko12
11-03-2005
Originally Posted by zelana:
“This is Comic Relief does Fame Academy, not Fame Acadamy, Pop Idol or X-factor. The whole idea is to get people to raise money for Comic Relief. Part of the promotion has to come from Radio One so what better way than for them to support one of their own. The hype and promotion isn't for Edith herself its to encourage more people to vote for her and also to raise awareness of Comic Relief and encourage others to do their bit. Claudia mentioned that someone had worked out that each contestant in the show would generate about £1,000,000. The votes are just part of it, the majority of that money will come from people seeing the show and deciding to do their own thing to raise funds.

It doesn't really matter who wins its the raising money that counts.”

no sorry it's an unfair advantage especially as she is going out live on air during her regular show, so when did all the others get this sort of plug for themselves??
Veri
11-03-2005
Colin's saying right now that the reason FA's raised so much money is that people care passionately about who wins.

Oh, and I agree.
Stewing
11-03-2005
Originally Posted by Veri:
“I'm thinking not. She came in with a great deal of ability, and she's used that well, but she hasn't become significantly better.

But perhaps her fans think differently.”

I do disagree as her repeat of Shout last night was miles better than the 1st version which was one of the 1st songs she did in there.Get away with the Edith rants now..she has done nothing obnoxious..she simply is NOT an actress like the other females in there with their plastic fantastic practised always smiling gobs..gimme a break...she is cool
Veri
11-03-2005
Originally Posted by Stewing:
“I do disagree as her repeat of Shout last night was miles better than the 1st version which was one of the 1st songs she did in there.Get away with the Edith rants now..she has done nothing obnoxious..she simply is NOT an actress like the other females in there with their plastic fantastic practised always smiling gobs..gimme a break...she is cool ”

Does eyeliner and unbrushed hair make you cool?
britcub
11-03-2005
Originally Posted by *buttercup*:
“i thought you defened the students,as you say it is for charity,ade has had a sore throat for days now,i bet you could not sing with no vioce,
edith had a bit of a cough and that is all we heard about for days,ade has done well to carry one imo,ade looked sad today,so dont say you defend them all you dont just edith.
practice what preach sweety. ”

*buttercup* - CAN YOU ACTUALLY READ? You certainly don't show much evidence of it.

I'm expressing my opinions. Unlike you, I am capable of doing so without doing a complete hatchet job on the participants.

As others have said, I'm really sick of your constant Edith-bashing, that's all. And if you look carefully at my post above, you'll find that I described both Kim and Debra as BETTER SINGERS THAN EDITH. I also said that Ade DESERVES TO BE THERE through his humourous performances. How you can possibly take that as "defending only Edith" I cannot understand.

The topic for the thread was about IMPROVEMENT in the singers. I'm not the only one who thinks Adrian and Edith have not improved much, if at all. I'm not the only one who things that Kim and Debra are good singers. I'm not the only one who thinks Reggie has improved tremendously, but is still a poor singer. However, unlike you, I admire them ALL for taking part, and don't have to have a go at them at every opportunity.

And I don't "preach". I simply believe in credit where it's due.

It's such a shame you're so negative all the time.
*buttercup*
11-03-2005
Originally Posted by britcub:
“*buttercup* - CAN YOU ACTUALLY READ? You certainly don't show much evidence of it.

I'm expressing my opinions. Unlike you, I am capable of doing so without doing a complete hatchet job on them.

As others have said, I'm really sick of your constant Edith-bashing, that's all. And if you look carefully at my post above, you'll find that I described both Kim and Debra as BETTER SINGERS THAN EDITH. I also said that Ade DESERVES TO BE THERE. How you take that as "defending only Edith" I cannot understand.

The topic for the thread was about IMPROVEMENT in the singers. I'm not the only one who thinks Adrian and Edith have not improved much, if at all. I'm not the only one who things that Kim and Debra are good singers. I'm not the only one who thinks Reggie has improved tremendously, but is still a poor singer. However, unlike you, I admire them ALL for taking part, and don't have to have a go at them at every opportunity.

And I don't "preach". I simply believe in credit where it's due.

It's such a shame you're so negative all the time.”

yes i can read so dont be so bl**Dy rude,but i wont read any of your post again i dont like nasty people,we are here about the students not get personal with ds members.
britcub
11-03-2005
Originally Posted by *buttercup*:
“ i dont like nasty people”

LMAO!!! You are so funny!
*buttercup*
11-03-2005
Originally Posted by britcub:
“LMAO!!! You are so funny!”

i know i have been told.
La Guardianista
11-03-2005
Originally Posted by Veri:
“Does eyeliner and unbrushed hair make you cool? ”

I hope so, I've based my entire wardrobe round that look for years
Veri
11-03-2005
Originally Posted by La Guardianista:
“
Originally Posted by Veri:
“Does eyeliner and unbrushed hair make you cool?”

I hope so, I've based my entire wardrobe round that look for years ”

Black eyeliner is a great look. The most effect for the least effort of any makeup technique.
La Guardianista
11-03-2005
Originally Posted by Veri:
“Black eyeliner is a great look. The most effect for the least effort of any makeup technique.”

I discovered aubergine mascara recently (I didn't invent it, you know what I mean). My advice, if you have hazel/green eyes..buy it, it's a miracle worker. (Do you think this is slightly off thread?)
Roan
11-03-2005
Originally Posted by La Guardianista:
“I discovered aubergine mascara recently (I didn't invent it, you know what I mean). My advice, if you have hazel/green eyes..buy it, it's a miracle worker. (Do you think this is slightly off thread?) ”


Thanks for the tip, I'll try it

Back on thread, I honestly don't believe Edith has improved much, she has not been overly consistant, and her performances have been good then poor then good etc. Last night was poorer than she has done.
La Guardianista
11-03-2005
Originally Posted by Roan:
“Last night was poorer than she has done.”

Roan, sweet pea, your Kim is going to win....you don't need to resort to nonsense Edith doing 'Shout' was fantastic. She was better than Kim last night. She's not the better technical singer but she does give it more passion than Kim. Unfortunately, most of the British public agree with you and will vote MOR perfection over soul
Mart_UK
11-03-2005
There's a bit of a pattern, she's brilliant at rockier up-tempo numbers, and she's poor at slower songs... yet she continued to pick/be given slow songs. Now she's singing an.. Oasis.. song tonight, no way she's gonna win.
How Soon is Now
11-03-2005
Originally Posted by La Guardianista:
“ She's not the better technical singer but she does give it more passion than Kim. Unfortunately, most of the British public agree with you and will vote MOR perfection over soul ”

I really don't get this. I have enjoyed a number of Edith's performance and think she is talented. Kim is good at almost everyhting she has done but for me has been ABSOLUTELY outstanding with her peformances of Something, Don't Know Why and particularly Born to Try.
Veri
11-03-2005
Originally Posted by La Guardianista:
“Edith doing 'Shout' was fantastic. She was better than Kim last night. She's not the better technical singer but she does give it more passion than Kim. Unfortunately, most of the British public agree with you and will vote MOR perfection over soul ”

It can be easier to give (or be perceived as giving) passion to energetic songs to involve an already excited audience.

Also, it's often been mentioned in this forum that the one who goes first is at a disadvantage when people are thinking back and comparing the songs.

Finally, I have to say again that Kim's singing affects me more emotionally than any of the others' -- including her "hanging on" last night -- and my dislike of MOR and, for that matter, Eastenders knows few bounds.
La Guardianista
11-03-2005
Originally Posted by How Soon is Now:
“I really don't get this. I have enjoyed a number of Edith's performance and think she is talented. Kim is good at almost everyhting she has done but for me has been ABSOLUTELY outstanding with her peformances of Something, Don't Know Why and particularly Born to Try.”

I get it...people prefer different things. More people prefer what you like than what I like, that's all. I don't hate Kim, I think she seems like a very nice person and a hard worker she just isn't my cup of tea, never will be. I would like Ade or Edith to win 'cos they are. I will be disappointed.
How Soon is Now
11-03-2005
Originally Posted by La Guardianista:
“I get it...people prefer different things. More people prefer what you like than what I like, that's all. I don't hate Kim, I think she seems like a very nice person and a hard worker she just isn't my cup of tea, never will be. I would like Ade or Edith to win 'cos they are. I will be disappointed.”

That's fine and I respect your opinion. Is your opinion of Kim based on her performances or her demeanour during streaming? (it may be both, but which is the more prominent force in your decision?) - only interested!
La Guardianista
11-03-2005
Originally Posted by How Soon is Now:
“That's fine and I respect your opinion. Is your opinion of Kim based on her performances or her demeanour during streaming? (it may be both, but which is the more prominent force in your decision?) - only interested!”

I think that Kim has been false, and before you jump on me, false in a nice way. I think she has always known that technically she is the best singer in there, but really likes the other contestants. Therefore, when she's given compliments I feel her reactions to them are a little over-modest, but she's doing that with the best of intentions. She has worked extremely hard in there, but I preferred watching the others have a bloody good time.
I don't like her voice. It reminds me of thousands of others who have very good, very pure voices, but I just don't see the spark that others on the forum do. She never seems to be enjoying herself when she's up there - I'm surprised, as she's an actress but I sense she's never really giving of herself when she performs. There was one night where she did a bit and it was my favourite performance by her.
I prefer music in general where although it's out of tune, whatever, you can hear the person through the music. I know others on the forum get that from Kim, I really don't.
I also watched this in the spirit of Comic Relief, rather than FA. The other 2 left have made me laugh, Kim hasn't.
But she'll win tonight and I'll be pleased for the girl.
So in answer to your question, a bit of both.
How Soon is Now
11-03-2005
[quote=La Guardianista][/QUOTE

Thanks. Horses for courses!
thenetworkbabe
11-03-2005
Originally Posted by Veri:
“Suppose you had to sing something. Wouldn't you "just do it"?

Think of "Bridge over troubled water". The title alone suggests a great deal. Then the lyrics and the sound naturally suggest certain emotions. Try singing the words; that'll help too. Sure, you might not do as good a job on your own of finding suitable emotions as Simon and G, but you've heard their version.

And you know other songs. You can "steal ideas from multiple sources", you can add your "own touches", and, drawing on your musical knowledge, built up by listening to many songs, maybe dancing to them or singing them (perhaps you even play an instrument), make it "sound right for what it is", or even change it and do it in some other style.

Also songs can be tied to memories and can bring back emotions. Maybe you even picked this song because it has such memories.

So when I read your descriptions of what Edith does, I don't think "wow! how does she do that?" I think "that's the sort of thing I would do". I think "that's what you would do."

You and me and Edith and Alex would all be doing the same kind of thing. The differences would be in how inventive, insightful, or faithful to the original our interpretations were and in our ability to get our voices to do what was required.”

After watching this morning's livestreaming I like my Carrie point even more. There was a moment when Carrie said to Edith why not change the emotion from concern to indignation, David agreed and Edith did what Alex did to Imagine straight off - not as well, not as much wow - but definite wow factor and an easier song to sing - all it needed was a spark.

You also saw the feel the emotion point - as she sang it in the stronger version she burst out crying.....

Strangely kim went to the other extreme and asked for a tape of edith Cassidy - only to be asked by David why she didn't work it out. Edith's session ended with Carrie saying she had wanted Edith and David saying he was determined to get her....
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