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Deinterlacing woes... Need help


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Old 26-08-2014, 13:08
tony-w
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Firstly I am not sure if this is in the correct forum, But I will assume it is and relay my problems...

I have a desktop PC which is used as a HVR containing the following hardware:
X6 1090T
8GB RAM
Dual TBS DVB-T2 PCI card
GTX650

Up until I purchased a new monitor everything was perfect, 1080I played flawlessly (no interlacing artifacts) and the same applied to SD.

When I purchased the new monitor it came with a HDMI cable and naively I used this, this caused no end of problems:
smaller RGB colourspace (16-235) which was easy to fix!
however as the desktop is never turned off (just the monitor) every time I turned the monitor back on it would default back to 16-235!
I also started to notice interlaced artifacts on 90% of the SD channels.
Out of desperation I decided it was an Nvida HDMI problem (Google it) and decided to go for a clean OS install using the DVI instead.

I did this and installed my TV card along with FFDshow and Haali media splitter (all I have ever used) and on a clean install the interlacing was still there, it is now even more blatant in SD recordings rendering them unwatchable.
I have tried different renderers, filters, forcing deinterlace etc etc (in MPC HC) and NOTHING WORKS.

Can anyone shed any light as to why a bloody monitor has caused me all this crap? and more importantly how to bloody fix it?

I have tried WMP (same result) VLC player (same result) and even KMP player (which installed malware, nice (did not work either)

I am far from a n00b, but this has really stumped me.

OS is Win7 HP x64, all updates etc installed

Last edited by tony-w : 26-08-2014 at 13:10. Reason: added DVI info
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Old 26-08-2014, 13:30
chrisjr
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You don't say what make and model of monitor you have.

Anyway, on the basis that the only change made is the display device the prime suspect must be the new monitor.

Do you have your old monitor (assuming it is in a working state) to put back on temporarily to see if that still performs as it did? If it does then that further reinforces the suspicion that the new monitor is causing the issues.
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Old 26-08-2014, 14:21
tony-w
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Hi Chris, and thank you for replying!
I too also thought it could be the monitor, but surely if this was the case then all interlaced SD would be showing signs of interlacing?
Currently 'Challenge' on FV is the worst culprit although many others look decidedly poor too.

The monitor is a BenQ 27" VA panel (HDMI ,DVI & VGA)
Unfortunately I do not have the old monitor (24" dell lcd) which I have given to a friend to replace his aging 19" CRT

As far as my limited knowledge goes, the correct displaying of video relies on just 3 factors:
1. a splitter to demux both the video and audio (Haali Media Splitter. Lav Splitter etc)
2. filters to decode the audio/video (.ax files etc)
3. a renderer to display the resulting output (EVR, VMR9 etc)

I fail to see how this chain could involve the monitor, even over HDMI (which I am not using)
This is also a clean install over DVI so HDMI should not even be part of the equation at all, that was my thinking regards the problems.
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Old 26-08-2014, 14:25
grahamlthompson
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One possibility

Old monitor was capable of 50Hz refresh.

New monitor is only capable of higher than 50Hz. Commonly min refresh is 56Hz.
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Old 26-08-2014, 14:35
chrisjr
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The monitor can have a very significant part to play in how images are displayed.

What is the native resolution of the panel and what video format are you sending it? If the panel has to process the video signal significantly to produce an image then the quality of that processing will obviously have a significant impact on the quality of the final picture.

I've seen plenty of monitors that produce radically different results to others, even when fed from exactly the same PC graphics output without changing a single parameter on the PC. So the monitor does play an important part in the final result.

HDMI is derived from DVI. You can convert DVI to HDMI or HDMI to DVI with a simple bit of wire with the appropriate plugs at each end. So in theory there should be no difference at all between the two at the same resolution and frame rate.
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Old 26-08-2014, 14:55
tony-w
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One possibility

Old monitor was capable of 50Hz refresh.

New monitor is only capable of higher than 50Hz. Commonly min refresh is 56Hz.
The previous monitor (24" Dell) was natively 1080p (1920 X 1080 at 60hz), this is the default setting I used for over 3 years with no problems whatsoever from the DVB-T2 card

This is the exact same specification of the new monitor, natively 1080p (1920 X 1080 at 60hz)

I am sure this monitor supports 1080p @ 60hz, 59hz, and 50hz, so I will try at 50hz and report back, although I highly suspect it is a filter/rendering problem.
Thanks for the input and suggestion Graham

Chris,
Thank you for your continued input my friend, the native resolution is as stated above (1080p 1920 X 1080 at 60hz)
I am sending the output direct from DVBViewer Pro (either 1080i HD or 576i SD).
The HD plays flawlessly, it almost appears progressive rather than de-interlaced but SD is where my problems lie. some channels (especially 'Challenge' looks ghastly but ITV SD for example, still has a slight appearance of interlaced artifacts but it is much better)
Old SD recordings look the worse,
they exhibit this behaviour (combing) (see first screenshot of the Janitor)
https://trac.handbrake.fr/wiki/Decomb
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Old 26-08-2014, 15:08
tony-w
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UPDATE:
I was able to select 50hz as the output, I tried this and it did not cure the interlaced artifacts on SD content,
A friend suggested disabling all filters in MPC HC, I did this and now SD recordings play back de-interlaced.
So that issue is certainly related to a filter/splitter/codec.

I suppose I will need to report it as a bug to the DVBViewer developers, oh well.
Thank you Graham & Chris for your help and advice/input!
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Old 26-08-2014, 15:26
chrisjr
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It might be you've alleviated a symptom rather than cured the disease. If you feed 576i to the monitor it has to scale it to fit full screen so it might be the scaler isn't doing a very good job compared to the Dell you had previously.

If the option is available in your set up it might be interesting to try upscaling on the PC so you send the monitor a fixed 1080i signal regardless of the source.
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Old 26-08-2014, 15:59
tony-w
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That is a very valid and good point Chris,
Even though the old Dell was 1080P, it was a 24", where as the new monitor is 1080P but 27", obviously this means the pixel pitch is larger.
I suppose it could very well be either the upscaling is poor on this monitor, or the larger pixel pitch is making artifacts more pronounced.
I am not as young as I used to be, maybe the old 'mince pies' are failing.....Not so much 'should have gone to specsavers' as time to go to specsavers

Thanks you both for your help anyway!
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Old 26-08-2014, 20:40
tony-w
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With determined perseverance I have diagnosed and fixed the problem
The reason was as simple as FFDShow in 32bit or 64bit flavours,
Because I performed a clean install (I usually use a macrium refelct image with all programs/drivers installed) I had to manually download and install to get my system back to normal.
I made the mistake of downloading the 64bit version of FFDShow, I needed 32bit due to the version of DVBViewer I am running only support 32bit filters.
Installed those and everything is back to normal,
[thread closed]
officially solved
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