The Daleks As A Threat

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rhynoGB

06-09-2014

The Daleks in the classic series were always scary and always seemed a genuine threat to the Doctor and those around him.
Since the series came back in 2005, they seem to have lost their edge. They always seem to just pop up in episodes, then vanish at the end without much of a lasting impression.

In my opinion they need to kill the doctor to get their mojo back. I love the Daleks as much as everyone else but for me they don't have the fear factor they once had.

Have they lost their edge?

trollface

06-09-2014

I think the issue might be that you are now older than you once were.

Hypnosss

06-09-2014

The Dalek action in the latest episode was so boring, it seemed to drag on for ages in stupid slow motion, they killed a few random nobodies and that was it.

The writing and direction is the problem, absolutely no sense of tension or peril, very disapointing.

rhynoGB

06-09-2014

Originally Posted by Hypnosss:
“The Dalek action in the latest episode was so boring, it seemed to drag on for ages in stupid slow motion, they killed a few random nobodies and that was it.

The writing and direction is the problem, absolutely no sense of tension or peril, very disapointing.”

That's what I was trying to say. They don't seem to be able to come up with anything that would put people in genuine peril.
I know they can't kill the Doctor or Clara, but killing nobodies doesn't make them scary or a threat.

emby2

06-09-2014

Perhaps one thing that may stop them being scary is, like the Cybermen, they announce very loudly and clearly that they are coming to get you. Compare that to the Weeping Angels, for example, who can quite often come out of nowhere with no warning and are considering quite scary for doing so.

If two Daleks silently sneaked up on you from both sides, like Velociraptors, that would be pretty frightening.

Not likely to happen, though. We know the Daleks like their catchphase!

Xmas_Trenzalore

06-09-2014

I don't think the Daleks necessarily need to be scary, but they do need to be more compelling in order to be the staple foe of the series.

What made them good.

Spoiler

Where they got iffy.

Spoiler

Into the Dalek

Spoiler

Lord Smexy

06-09-2014

In my opinion, I think Dalek episodes work a lot better when they're not trying to force the Daleks' 'threateningness' (not sure that's a word) down the viewers' throats, constantly reminding us that they're super dangerous and the most evil thing in existence, without really showing us why. Last week's episode felt like a breath of fresh air for me because it didn't try and over-dramatise how deadly the Daleks are, with the Doctor spending the entire episode crying about how angry they make him.

garbage456

06-09-2014

I loved victory of the Daleks. Apart from the stupid talking to the bomb.
Even evolution was ok.
But I know what you mean there seems very little genuine scared. But at least into the Dalek seemed very similar to Dalek in that they were going through the ship saying exterminate everyone. No prisoners etc etc.

TheSilentFez

06-09-2014

I think the Daleks are effective when they're in an actual Dalek story. When you shoehorn them into an episode which already has other enemies in it, they become less effective
ie. Time of the Doctor and to a slightly lesser extent, Day of the Doctor.

I'm not sure the stone Dalek in The Big Bang was totally necessary either.

Antimon_Bush

06-09-2014

Daleks were deffinitely frightening and great enemies when they were created. But in the modern era, when we have all this CGI stuff and special effects, Daleks don't give such impression any more. Also, most of Dalek stories in New Who are more-less poor and there isn't a single Dalek story that stands out. Into the Dalek is a little bit better, probably because it is a different type of Dalek story, but still it doesn't stand out.

Of course, it is important to keep the most iconic enemies of Doctor Who, but maybe it would be better to make them sth like supporting characters (like in Pandorica Opens / The Big Bang). Instead of craeting stories focused on Daleks.

Originally Posted by TheSilentFez:
“I think the Daleks are effective when they're in an actual Dalek story. When you shoehorn them into an episode which already has other enemies in it, they become less effective
ie. Time of the Doctor and to a slightly lesser extent, Day of the Doctor.

I'm not sure the stone Dalek in The Big Bang was totally necessary either.”

I don't think that they are effective even in Dalek stories. I think the only way we could keep them is to include them in non Dalek stories as supporting characters.

icemetallica8

06-09-2014

Is there not a rights issue that means the Daleks have to be used in some capacity o retain the Daleks? Or did I imagine that?

The problem with the Daleks being less scary these days is their over use, by over using them, we have seen the Doctor defeat them quite a few times.

Evil Genius

06-09-2014

Originally Posted by rhynoGB:
“The Daleks in the classic series were always scary and always seemed a genuine threat to the Doctor and those around him.

Have they lost their edge?”

Really? I thought they were a bit wank from Destiny onward (and some of the older ones I've seen on DVD).

They used to wobble terribly when they used to trundle around on location. They were voiced by the guy who did Zippy so whenever they spoke all I heard was Zippy being really angry.

The operators inside seemed to be under the impression that just because they had appendages they all had to be in motion all the time.
Based on that I'm surprised they could look to aim with the eyestalk being whipped left and right, and up and down. Not to mention being amazed they could actually hit anything with their guns constantly waving about.. It was like the Daleks all had Parkinsons.

I'm sorry, but the old Daleks were terribly brought to life. They were a bit shit.

Corwin

06-09-2014

Originally Posted by icemetallica8:
“Is there not a rights issue that means the Daleks have to be used in some capacity o retain the Daleks? Or did I imagine that?
”

The rumour is that they have to appear in every series.

It's never been stated officially that this is the case but going back to 2006 people have been saying and repeating it and many now think of it as Fact.

The Fact that the Daleks cameoed in Waters of Mars and The Wedding of River Song meaning that they have appeared every year does lead some weight to the rumour.

Sophie ~Oohie~

06-09-2014

Yeah they should make them more scary! Presumably because of a recent accident, they edited out a flashback scene where a Dalek deliberately breaks some kind of factory pipes and sprays boiling oil all over a crowd of Time Lords, causing at least one to fall off a bridge and get crushed in some machinery Final Destination style. They then shoot all the others while they're trying to regenerate.

icemetallica8

06-09-2014

Originally Posted by Corwin:
“The rumour is that they have to appear in every series.

It's never been stated officially that this is the case but going back to 2006 people have been saying and repeating it and many now think of it as Fact.

The Fact that the Daleks cameoed in Waters of Mars and The Wedding of River Song meaning that they have appeared every year does lead some weight to the rumour.”

That's what makes me believe the rumours to be true, ideally for the Daleks to be considered evil and formidable opponents, they need to be shelved for a while and come back with a bang.

icemetallica8

07-09-2014

EDIT - double post

codename_47

07-09-2014

I've always wanted to write a scene where we see a completely dark, night battle with the Daleks and Humans where they're taking pot shots at the human army, but losing precious Daleks because they're seemingly unable to fire without shouting "EXTERMINATE!"
Then as they work this out they communicate the fact their speech lights are giving their positions away and making them vulnerable they're continually destroyed until the one remaining Dalek learns how to shut up and fire for a change

Still, I've never really seen The Daleks as a big, scary threat. I do think the (2005+ era obv) Daleks are cool as hell and think they're fascinating to watch when they're on screen.
I wish we could see a lot more of them tbh, hoping they'll still turn up in the finale this year, though not exactly too hopeful on that one.

Also the Daleks have properly exterminated The Doctor twice since the return of the series. Sadly both Daleks in question didn't live long to tell the tale.
Pretty effective threat tbh, more than they managed in 30+ years of original series Daleks anyway

Mr_XcX

07-09-2014

I do agree. The fact they're so popular and hence always re-appear does kinda make them look less menacing as a villain for the Doctor. They can be evil etc but in the end you just know the Doctor will find a way to defeat them.

The Gatherer

07-09-2014

Originally Posted by Evil Genius:
“Really? I thought they were a bit wank from Destiny onward (and some of the older ones I've seen on DVD).

They used to wobble terribly when they used to trundle around on location. They were voiced by the guy who did Zippy so whenever they spoke all I heard was Zippy being really angry.

The operators inside seemed to be under the impression that just because they had appendages they all had to be in motion all the time.
Based on that I'm surprised they could look to aim with the eyestalk being whipped left and right, and up and down. Not to mention being amazed they could actually hit anything with their guns constantly waving about.. It was like the Daleks all had Parkinsons.

I'm sorry, but the old Daleks were terribly brought to life. They were a bit shit.”

The second part of your username is a bit misleading.

The Gatherer

07-09-2014

Originally Posted by codename_47:
“I've always wanted to write a scene where we see a completely dark, night battle with the Daleks and Humans where they're taking pot shots at the human army, but losing precious Daleks because they're seemingly unable to fire without shouting "EXTERMINATE!"
Then as they work this out they communicate the fact their speech lights are giving their positions away and making them vulnerable they're continually destroyed until the one remaining Dalek learns how to shut up and fire for a change

Still, I've never really seen The Daleks as a big, scary threat. I do think the (2005+ era obv) Daleks are cool as hell and think they're fascinating to watch when they're on screen.
I wish we could see a lot more of them tbh, hoping they'll still turn up in the finale this year, though not exactly too hopeful on that one.

Also the Daleks have properly exterminated The Doctor twice since the return of the series. Sadly both Daleks in question didn't live long to tell the tale.
Pretty effective threat tbh, more than they managed in 30+ years of original series Daleks anyway ”

I assume you haven't seen Daleks Masterplan.

Mr_XcX

07-09-2014

Originally Posted by The Gatherer:
“I assume you haven't seen Daleks Masterplan.”

Unless recovered we will never see it.

Did listen to the audio tapes though. Perhaps one of the best Dalek stories they did along with Evil.

Lord Smexy

07-09-2014

I have to say, I do find the way Daleks can zombify people with eye stalks that extend from their foreheads, without them even remembering they're dead, extremely creepy.

codename_47

07-09-2014

And they were terribly hammy, darling.

And they looked down the lens a lot too, totally breaking the 4th wall.

Anddddd....they didn't do stairs.

Phoenix Lazarus

07-09-2014

More of a threat now that, in Nu Who, they can levitate. In olden times, it seemed you could escape if you could go up stairs in a liftless building, or a slope without a flat or gently-sloped spiral path.

codename_47

07-09-2014

And they used to hide behind sofas....to get you.......or something.....

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