Really? She is releasing a new album in the New Year which is her 13th and her last album in 2012 was number 1 and she was the highest grossing artist in that year! Not exactly irrelevant really.

If this is the case then it's no surprise she isn't appearing on TXF, she'll no doubt do the rounds when the album is actually out, appearing on Graham Norton etc.

Not sure if two mins is well in, the Pointless titles were going up at 7.02 last night.

The issue is they set the show length weeks in advance, we now have Radio times out covering the SCD live final, but until the dress rehearsal they do not know how long it actually will be, last night the unknown was a gap between the last sole dance by Frankie and Kevin and the group waltzAthon.

I assume they have a dress rehearsal, and inform the channel controllers how long they will run for snd if thier quicker than the alloted slot SCD starts a few mins later. Clearly last night in addition the launch of Christmas and Christmas idents was 7pm the BBC1 announcer Duncan said do during the week, but for somereason it was kicked back past SCD.

She doesn't tend to do circuit promotions these days. More likely she'll choose a big event in the US and do a small exclusive concert. However, she did hint that she might like to appear on The Graham Norton Show again because he made her feel "comfortable".

However, her new song "Living For Love" is ready to release and features a gospel choir, so she could have gone on the X-Factor if she chose to.

its the same turgid crud year on year. Mel B has basically become the Bo Selecta parody shouting and being rude all through the series. The rest its just rinse repeat of all the other clichés Cowell promised a new start and its the same rubbish as before that's one good thing its blown the theory him and Cheryl coming back would save the show.

But not relevant to the majority of the XF audience surely.

My thoughts exactly.

Probably not, XF viewers tend to listen to tuneless thuds with no lyrics don't they? But, that said, Cowell did want her to perform in the final because she is still a major star regardless as to whether any of us are fans or not. (I am a fan by the way - not that you'd guess!)

You wouldn't think Cher was either would you? But the results show she appeared in was the highest rated last year?

I'm shocked at how low X Factor is.

7 Million for a semi final.

That is probably the lowest rating semi final rating in the history of the show.

SCD on fire with nearly 10 Million. It will end up being the 2nd most watched reality show this year after BGT.

Perfect!

The final always seems to rate lower these days don't they? It's too padded out now with it being 2 hours a night.

For some reason it's acceptable to slag Madonna off and make comments like she should stop doing what she loves or she's irrelevant and so on. That policy doesn't apply to any other female artist.

I guess first within Cowell's sights for the chop will be Cheryl - he probably expected her return with his would recreate the old 'magic'. They'll probably make it out to be her leaving either way though. Then he probably wouldn't lose any sleep over getting rid of Mel, and probably Louis now too. And what about bland Dermot? Next year should be interesting.

Perhaps most of all what X Factor needs is a new perspective behind the scenes - many of the same execs have been involved for 11 series now. Mark Sidaway the main one on Twitter labelled Strictly a borefest. Lol.

I don't think it would help completely as the format is running out of steam (like most formats do) but a complete overhaul of the judging panel would be best I think, just to give it a shot of new blood.

Trying to bring back judges of former series (Danni, Sharon, Cheryl etc.) just feels desperate, whilst younger audiences look to younger alternatives for their idols.

That will be regarded as one of the great ratings achievements of this multichannel age-and rightly so. Unfortunately it only serves to show the starkness of the decline, and Im sure it was accelerated by the about-turn transformation after 2010 when three of the panel left at the highest peak of its success. It still amazes me that happened tbh.
It seems astonishing that we were once speculating on 20 million peaks the XF final.

The younger judges oversaw the downfall - the 2011 series, post auditions, saw the biggest declines year-on-year of any series. If I recall correctly the 2012 launch didn't even pull in 9m viewers.

The X Factor cannot have ad breaks after every single act; there's enough of them as it is. And, just as the viewers want to know the celebrities on Strictly they want to know the singers on The X Factor too. Just having them sing results in a lack of depth.

Both shows could go back to basics with the VTs instead of the rubbish they churn out now but they are needed.

*Gets into DS mode*

Cancel it! Cancel it now!

It would appear that since the switch to two songs or just the loss of Stevi (possibly OTY) XF does seem to have been dragging its feet to the end. The shorter run times haven't really helped at all because the 8pm hour seems to be down a bit (reflected in lower peaks).

It's a pretty poor figure considering Saturdays had been relatively fine this year and I guess anything below 7.5m looks that bit worse.

Last years semi posted an unusual rally then the final rated badly (vs trend). In 2012, the semi final dipped to 7.8m but the final rated better (vs trend) than the series as a whole. So who knows what it will do next weekend.


So the main show drops against Strictly. The fluff in between most likely flops. The results do less than they would on a Sunday. They get half an hour less out of the show by cutting the results show. And the BBC starts winning the 8pm Sunday slot with ease as the ITV replacement flops. Millions of pounds have been lost and audience share is down sharply. Get David Bergg back. You're fired.

Was the format ever that revolutionary in the first place, I put XF's success down to an accumulation of things over the years, namely a soap opera with the judges and a good mix of quality and jokey acts in between. The press getting fully behind it really helped too - "Cheryl Cole the nation's sweetheart for instance" puke... I think a lot of things went right for XF over the years, though the editing, lighting, styling etc has always been pretty on fire.

First if SC did actually understand viewer habits is to axe himself he is far too old for a show targeted at teenagers they do not connect with him.

To label SCD a bore fest when week in week out it gets over 40% of the share, shows how out of touch they are, SCD is slick, streamlined, no bloating, you can't fast forward it as you miss something, XF my wife who likes it FF the first bit until the first singer that can be around even minutes in.


The format is past its sell by date or use by date, the judges well two of them on today's music are past thier sell by dates, you need younger pop icons that the teenagers of today can connect with.

The teenagers today do not talk about XF as they did a few years back, it's no longer event Tv it is considered, not cool, and contrived, and who simon wants to win, will win, so pointless watching.

Simon failed in the USA on his XF there, he has failed on many formats Red or Black, a Food Glourious food, he is out of touch with viewers, his Midas touch is limited to BGT and even the it's the show and David Walliams that carry it now not SC.

Out of interest, oathy, what did you expect/want out of the show this year?

.............well there is always Barry Manilow. (Iv heard he does a duet with Louis Armstrong )

Yep. Quite a bit of complacency there by all concerned! But to be fair even those on this thread didn't seem to think this was as big a deal as it clearly was.

I wonder where XF would be now if it had to continue developing naturally from a high and new judges were slotted in every couple of years rather than losing three big hitter judges and most importantly Cowell - ironically leaving and setting up X Factor USA really hit Cowell's reputation (in TV terms at least) and he came back to far less respect. It's been a disaster all round if you look at things from a TV, non monetary angle. If not, then he's still made a lot more money out of both Fox and still ITV then he probably would have done - but making money on its own isn't necessarily an indication of actual success imo.

Agreed, I thought he was still important to these shows but I was clearly wrong. Maybe now all the hype has worn down, these formats aren't actually all that great by themselves? Never!

He had his time, his golden touch is tarnished, more living off other people's ideas, XF as we know ( and settled out of court) is a rip off of Pop Idol. Created by Simon a Fuller 2001/2003, SC changed it a little, but same idea, same slot, same type of contest just change the judges a little. Cowell was the main judge and reinvented the wheel, and Fuller took him to court and SC had to be a judge in the USA on PI and not start XF USA there for a few years.

It's not his idea it was fullers, and BGT SC purchased the UK rights after seeing the success in the USA.

XF we all know, we have all seen it coming, is past its use by date and over milked over bloated now hence viewers leaving it, as they all know they can see a better pantomime at their local theatre, and on both we know in advance who will win.

Simon cared more about the USA show than the UK show. It was imperative the former took off and if the latter took a hit then so be it - though I don't think he expected such a hit.

Then again, for all the finger pointing at the panel the production for 2011 was atrocious and exaberared the decline - the 'point and laugh' final audition, the saga of Frankie Cocazza taking over boot camp, axing four acts, including the pre-live favourite, without a public vote in the first live show... it was a complete mess and never recovered.