First of all I must say how good all the non English speaking Professionals are at speaking English. Non only can they speak the language but they can crack jokes and understand jokes in English as well, how difficult must that be?

What I always wonder is if they ever speak to each other in their own language, I was thinking of Russian in particular. ( Before anyone says I haven't a problem if they do ) Perhaps they want to speak English while they are here to save confusing themselves I always wonder if someone speaks a 2nd language what language they think in. I just find that fascinating. Anyone I have asked say they think in the language they are speaking, again how difficult must that be - at least to me it would be.

You think in your own language for a long time but slowely when speaking a second language more than the first you start thinking in the second
What you never do is Maths in your head in a second language !! Calculations are always in first one

This is very true, just checked with my German partner!

How does that work then? If you had to work out 15% of 30 mentally how would it be different? Or is that not a good example? I'm genuinely curious.

Counting and swearing are said to be tasks we revert to our mother tongue to do. I believe it is pretty universal when giving birth too but I count that as a variant on swearing!

Not the basic "one, two, three" type of counting. But anything that involves working things out - yes, mother tongue.

Swearing - not necessarily. I can swear in other languages. But, if it's kneejerk reaction swearing - for example, when you've hit your thumb with a hammer - then that's mother tongue swearing!

Giving birth - soooo glad that I didn't have to do that in another language. Not because I wanted to swear. I just had too many other things to concentrate on at the time!

I'm really pleased to see a thread which recognises how well the non-native speakers can interact in English. Teaching, joking, explaining, understanding, etc can be difficult enough in your own language.

Doing all of that in a second (or third, or fourth...) language is deserving of praise.

Perhaps depends on the range of swear words available. At university in Wales I lived in hall near some very strong Welsh nationalists. We rarely had any contact with them and they only tended to speak to us non-Welsh students when they were drunk, they exclusively used the conventional English (or perhaps should say Anglo-Saxon) swear words because apparently Welsh has few swear words.

I can swear In Spanish but it gives me no satisfaction. There are things that I find so offensive that I can barely bring myself to articulate them in English, but the Spanish equivalents trip of the tongue without a hesitation. As it happens the really offensive expressions in Spanish are not the things we would put at the top of the English most sweariness list, but the same applies they don't provide the expletive impact for me. I therefore feel cursing has no power if it isn't in the mother tongue.

When I worked in Spain, I did once find myself counting up, in twos in Spanish. I got to about 20 something when I had a WTF moment and switched to English, to the amusement of my Spanish co-worker. In fact I think it was his bemused expression listening to me trying to count people in Spanish that sparked the WTF moment.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=l3R-W_Etm2g

How interesting. I wonder if it really doesn't have swear words and if so I wonder what that tells us about the people; cheerful, easy going and never cross perhaps? . I find it hard to believe that historically the Welsh had no swear words, surely they had as much to get cross about as any other ancient people - arguably more having been pushed off their land by Saxons et al. Maybe its just that Welsh had a full range of swear words that fell into disuse when the use of the language was repressed. Maybe they just need reviving.

There's a list of Welsh curse words here:

http://www.youswear.com/index.asp?la...h#.VDSBABbp9_E

Some are pretty rough! (I dare not repeat!!)

I wonder if music can help engrain a language's sounds and structures. While dabbling over the summer with learning Norwegian (don't ask!) I found that Grieg, a composer I've never quite got, suddenly made sense and sounded like he was composing in the Norwegian language, particularly his short piano pieces. I could hear words where there weren't any. There seemed to be grammar or structure, or something, in it that made both the language and the music more immediate.

Didn't get very far with it though and fear it is about to become one of the many languages I've started learning 'for fun' and gave up too easily


The swearing thing has to be the limbic system. Maybe the emotional force of breaking the taboo needs your earliest memories (in your mother tongue)

I never ever swear in English - only in Spanish. Doesn't feel so bad. Especially co*o which I say even on my own when I drop something. Maybe because I associate swearing in English with getting a caning.

In terms of counting and maths it depends on the context. I sometimes talk to myself in Spanish. I have even talked to my mother in Spanish - to her wide-eyed bemusement.




People who keep translating to and from their mother tongue find it difficult to learn languages.

You have to think in the language you are speaking.

Can't say I had to learn anything Norwegian to feel the Dawn breaking in http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gH1JMdWpJ54

Thanks, and very interesting reading all your comments.

I would love to speak another language fluently. I often know what to say in my head but when I open my mouth it comes out all wrong. Knowing this often stops me trying.

You say divide 30 by one hundred is naught point 3 , multiplied by fifteen is four point five
If for example your first language is German you say Driessig durch hundert ist null comma drei , mal funfzehn ist vier comma funf !!!!

The absolute best way to learn another language is to live it., In shops , TV , listeing to others etc

Many years ago I read a book about a POW camp in WWII (can't remember if it was Colditz but could have been). One prisoner spent a lot of time with the French POWs and learnt to speak fluent French including a full range of swear words. Many years later he was stopped by a French police car for something or other, he swore at the police officer using his full vocabulary of swear words (some of which the police officer had never heard before) and so impressed the police officer that he was sent on his way with no charges!

Perhaps an apocryphal story but I read once of someone who learnt Japanese from a Japanese girl friend but discovered later that it was the language used by geisha and quite different normal normal Japanese.

Nowadays I do not swear in my first language, it's all English or German So that's easy I would say. As for math, if you can do that in your 2nd language you are really good, you live and breath that language. You have to think in the language, use its idioms. You should not translate to and from in your head. What I still find difficult is parsing out spoken words, especially in accented English. My ear is still tuned to the first language and I cannot relax the same way I'd do with the first language. If you speak the first language and somebody mumbles the words, your brain will often fills them in. For me it still does not work with other languages. I need more effort or just have to ask if possible.

Ha! I was going to relate something similar. I learnt Spanish from a girl-friend and her sisters so I picked up a number of feminine expressions which I was teased about.

On language, there is a thread on "outfits". I know there are / were men's "outfitters" in Harley Street but I don't recall a man ever using the word "outfit" in relation to clothes. There are male and female words.

Just thinking about the maths issue here is a test:

5 x 12 =

23 + 43 =

98 - 19 =

I don't have a problem with these in a few languages without thinking in English.

I have a problem with the maths

I'll pop over to help any Pet in Distress

Oh that doesn't quite count as "maths". More like "sums".

Proper "Maths" doesn't involve any numbers.

Interestingly most mathematicians love languages - it is all coding and algebra and order.

Ah, interesting. Algebra was the one bit of maths that came naturally to me.

My number problem is spreading though. Things in sequences can produce a panic in me because I know there's a sort of number process going on behind the scenes. Pathetic!! 3 and 8. If I'm not concentrating, I think three should be half of eight because it is visually. Truly truly hopeless.