I know it's a tv show and so of course has to be jazzed up, but it's gone beyond ridiculous now in my opinion. First of all...20 candidates!!! It's impossible to gain an idea of whether someone is good or not or even get to know them all enough in just 12 weeks. It's just stupid and has all been done just for entertainment purposes..."ooohh will Alan fire 2 this week". It's just stupid. Second issue is the candidates themselves...each year it's becoming less and less about their businesses and what they've done in their lives and more about their personality/character and whether they would make good tv. If you went back to the first few series, yes there were a couple o exceptions, but the majority did have good experience of business etc. Next thing is the producers desperation to make the show funny...it's so cringy hearing the candidates say these lines such as "I'm a duracell bunny in business" or similar things...if the candidates had actually thought these up themselves and were beign serious then it might be funny, but ti's so obvious that they've been asked to think up a crazy, funny line. I mean, on last night's show nearly every single candidate had one of these lines.

Finally, and the biggest issue of all...the prize. When the prize was that the winner was Alan's apprentice, the show had meaning and every episode and the tasks meant something. Now though, they mean nothing as he just picks the winner based on whether or not he likes their business plan. He knows their business plan's from the start, so to have candidates there right until the end and then decide to get rid of them because he doesn't like their business plan is ridiculous...he could have got rid of them in the first episode. It's just pointless. A perfect example is when Leah won. There were candidates who had performed far, far, far better than her throughout the series and had been far more consistent, yet because Alan liked her business plan, she won. What was the point in any of the others even entering the show? They need to make the show about business again and less about making a funny programme with fake lines.

I don't think he does know all the details of their business plans at this stage - he said last night in the introductory session that he'd read the "headlines" of them or something, and would go into them fully in the later stages.

I'm sure that all of them have something to offer that he would be interested in developing (or maybe not - given how quickly Jedi Jim and Jade were kicked out once their full BPs were known). But TBH, in terms of start up money, his £250k for a 50% stake in a business is a bit ludicrous these days! I wouldn't mind betting that he doesn't have 50% of Susan Ma's Tropic Skincare unless he paid a lot more than that. I'm not entirely convinced that he really wanted to go into the cosmetic surgery business with Leah last year, but I think he had his doubts about Luisa's business acumen and her slightly questionable morals, and he had no option ( mind you you could drive a bus through the holes in Luisa's proposition, whilst Leah's had been properly thought out and costed.

These guys do the show for a potential of 12 weeks free advertising on National TV

I like it this way.

More humor, more potential Celebrity Big Brother contestants, and a way better prize than being an "Apprentice".

I'd prefer it it was actually a bit more real instead of being so constructed and set-up.

Didn't they change the prize because it became clear that previous winners were being hired to do nothing, and usually quit after five minutes? I'm not sure it's any more fake to compete for an investment than for a pretend job.

The only one who claimed it was a pretend job was Stella, and considering that her lawsuit against Lord Sugar was rejected, I'm not entirely inclined to believe her. In any case, 4 out of the first 6 winners worked for Sugar for two years or more.

Hm. I didn't think it was just her who called it a non-job. Why did they switch to the new prize, then?

I don't think the fact that its increased to 20 candidates means that its "fake and pointless" now! If anything, the fact we see more candidates on TV you could suggest that its less fake.

There were other winners who have been very positive about their experiences. Yasmina, for instance, was very vocal about her contempt for what Stella did, saying that it was ridiculous that someone had been given that opportunity and was so ungracious about it. Yasmina herself of course left the job pretty quickly, but that was to do with personal situations (she became pregnant twice in a short period of time). She has said plainly that she and Lord Sugar are still on good terms, and there was no bitterness about her departure.

As for why it was changed to a business investment - from reading these forums, there seems to be a common belief that this was to do with what happened with Stella. I can say categorically, without a shadow of a doubt, that it has absolutely nothing to do with this at all. How do I know? Well, because none of the winners went to work with Lord Sugar until after their series was broadcast, to avoid leaks to the press. Therefore, Stella (whose series was broadcast in late 2010) didn't begin work until early 2011. Series 7 began broadcasting in May of that year, and almost certainly was already filmed by that point. In fact, even if you imagine that Series 7 was filmed after Series 6 (which I am reasonably sure didn't happen, but more like 90% rather than 100% certain) there are a few major flaws in that theory. Firstly, it assumes that Lord Sugar realised that there was a problem with Stella immediately as she came to work. Secondly, it would mean that they'd have to change the prize after everyone in Series 7 had applied and been accepted, which is pretty unreasonable for such a major format change. Thirdly, I remember very well that the announcement of the prize change came before Series 6 had ended. If you look at the Wikipedia article's edit history and look back at the edition in late 2010, you will see that it already states that the format will change. So unless Stella was working with Lord Sugar before broadcast of her series (which I am almost certain didn't happen) there is no possible way that it could have had anything to do with the change of format at all.

As for why it did happen, don't take this as gospel because I don't think it's been confirmed anywhere, but I've always thought that it is because Lord Sugar is now semi-retired, doesn't have all his companies anymore and the scope to take on an apprentice. At this stage in his life, investing in a new business deal makes more sense for him.

Not sure why you think this amount is ludicrous. The typical Dragons' Den pitch is for a lot less and they often give away 33%-40%. £250k is a healthy amount of seed money and there is nothing to stop the new business then obtaining investment from others or an overdraft. I think you are assuming that he is buying into an established and profitable business; it is clear that nearly all of the contestants would be starting up something new based heavily on their own efforts and £250k is a wonderful stake in such circumstances

Actually, back in the days of the job, the Final 2 used to work for one of Lord Sugar's companies for the 6 months-a year between filming and broadcast, so it wouldn't surprise me if he realised that it was becoming more difficult to find an appropriate job. Whilst I don't think that Stella directly affected his decision to change the prize, I do think he was struggling to find jobs for the winners and around Series 5, he seemed to stop having jobs in mind for the winners. Tim, Simon and Lee were all hired, IMO, because he had an idea for the job in mind, whilst Stella, in particular was hired for being the best candidate in her year, but he didn't have a job in mind for her which made it difficult.

Oh yes, I get that much. I meant that she didn't start working for him as an official job until after broadcast. But I think he shouldn't have let her win in any case. She was way overqualified for the position.

Its simply Big Brother in suits, and has been for some time now. They are all celeb wanabees and very unlikeable. Such a shame. I've been watching the early series from the beginning and they are fantastic, even 8, 9 and 10 years on.

You still had characters and hunour back then, but you also had genuine business people.

Actually, the differences between The Apprentice and Big Brother are quite broad. Whilst they both have tasks and involve people living together, they are vastly different programmes. First and foremost, Big Brother involves a public vote, whereas the winners and losers of this programme are chosen by Lord Sugar himself. The prize for winning Big Brother is merely cash, whereas money won on The Apprentice must be invested into a business. Secondly, Big Brother rarely involves dealing with professionals - the candidates on The Apprentice have to deal with them quite frequently. The tasks on Big Brother are there for entertainment purposes, and whilst there is obviously an element of that on The Apprentice the latter programme does at least emphasise a candidate's skills in the world of business to a certain extent. Also, Big Brother is generally about people's personal lives and their relationships with one another, whereas The Apprentice is more about candidates' capabilities or the lack of them.

Whilst certain people will naturally gain fame and/or notoriety from both shows and may benefit from that, I think it is unrealistic to suggest that everyone will, or indeed that all of them wish to. I auditioned for Big Brother a couple of years ago, and I actually got quite far - I didn't want or expect fame from it, I just really wanted the experience of being in the House, as I felt it would be a challenge and a learning curve for me that I'd take with me throughout my life. I'd like to give The Apprentice a try, but realistically I never would as the world of business is not my thing. I think that's the thing that sets them apart - The Apprentice is part of a candidate's professional life and is only suited to people interested in the business world, whereas pretty much anyone could give Big Brother a try.

I've not been impressed so far; there's been very little business thread so far for a business show. No talk whatsoever about budgeting, pricing or profit yet. I still don't understand how the first task worked in terms of this; the men's team spent lots of money on guacamole, cheese etc and it wasn't even considered in terms of a spend or anything and there was no set cost value to the products so they could have made a loss especially as money was thrown away at t-shirt printers. Also Roisin and her team made a £90 loss on t-shirts and sold a lot of potatoes and lemons for £50 which doesn't sound that profitable, Sarah's team didn't sell cleaning products etc. In terms of second task, no questions about margins, pricing or volume in pitches (which was big thing in Series 8 household gadget task); maybe this wasn't focused on as they got it right and show usually focuses on what goes wrong. I hope this weeks is a big improvement as I'd probably stop watching otherwise as it's never been like this before.

Of course it's fake, and the most obvious reason is this -

It is just not feasible that every single task set by Sugar will go wrong in some way... every week, in every series.

In this way, it has similarities with Big Brother - conflict has to be manufactured, people are sent in with set agendas and instructions to create that conflict.

If they didn't, who would watch a bunch of people sitting around all day getting on with each other?

In the same way, I am sure the tasks set to apprentice contestants are manipulated to ensure something goes wrong, which in turn will lead to conflict within the group and ultimately to the usual back-biting and bitchiness in the boardroom at the end.

But not every task involves one or both teams failing. Sometimes they both sell well but of course one will always sell more than the other so there is a losing team and therefore in, terms of the "process", a failing team. You don't need to invoke a conspiracy by the producers - the way the show works, there will always be a winning team and a losing team.

Just the fact that the teams have such a short timeframe in which to do the task, combined with the fact that a lot of the members won't have any experience in whatever field the task involves, guarantees by itself that sooner or later things are gonna go pear-shaped.

Also, the time when there are mostly capable candidates left is around the time when past performances are taken into account. The later tasks usually go better than the earlier ones, because the early tasks are an easy way of getting rid of baggage. However, once you get to those, there will still be a losing team by default, and at that point they can start looking not so much at who is bad, but at who isn't as good as the remaining candidates.