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Ballroom and Latin American Dance Questions |
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#1326 |
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Join Date: May 2010
Posts: 141
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In the following video is Sebastian Achaval 'pushing out of the floor'?
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=cr_3pNlzkjY |
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#1327 |
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Join Date: Aug 2012
Posts: 16,124
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Quote:
Because you teach, I'm interested in trying to understand your comment that "pushing out of the floor doesn't apply to AT" - because I think it does. Most AT teachers I know use the expression "use your standing leg to generate movement" surely that's exactly the same. If I'm correct then "pushing out of the floor" is essential to good AT technique from both lead and follower.
Happy to continue learning, so really interested in your comment. This is why I was hoping for some Karen Hardy wisdom. I can tell you its different. I can demonstrate the difference. I can tell if you are employing the difference. But to describe it in words that everyone understands I am afraid defies me. |
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#1328 |
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Join Date: Aug 2012
Posts: 16,124
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Quote:
I remember one teacher once saying to imagine that you were actually trying to push against a place a foot below the surface of the floor. To me, as an image that made a lot of sense, as you got an idea of 'depth' and movement in a more extended line. The floor wasn't the end of the story - you were kind of trying to push the floor itself against a lower point so it was all part of a connection - sink into it, push out of it. Use it - it's not a stagnant thing but a tool. Obviously not suitable for all moves at all times, but it did give an extra dimension to the way I thought about things.
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#1329 |
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Forum Member
Join Date: Aug 2012
Posts: 16,124
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Quote:
In the following video is Sebastian Achaval 'pushing out of the floor'?
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=cr_3pNlzkjY |
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#1330 |
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Join Date: Apr 2015
Posts: 3,056
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Quote:
Nice clear example of tango walks. I don't see the pushing out of the floor in the salsa sense. Not that I expect to. But notice how he keeps his steps low to the floor, barely lifting them up for each step and how when he is simply walking he places the ball of his foot first. That is something leads find very difficult and unnatural to do , especially when combined the A frame (carpa) posture.
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#1331 |
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Forum Member
Join Date: Dec 2005
Location: South East
Posts: 3,273
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Quote:
Yes that makes absolute sense to me for salsa. Its as if the floor is a sort of spring board. But its not something I would do in AT. You do however push off from the standing leg but if you didn't you wouldn't go far.
Quote:
Nice clear example of tango walks. I don't see the pushing out of the floor in the salsa sense. Not that I expect to. But notice how he keeps his steps low to the floor, barely lifting them up for each step and how when he is simply walking he places the ball of his foot first. That is something leads find very difficult and unnatural to do , especially when combined the A frame (carpa) posture.
Building off the beautiful video of the tango walk, I think Pablo and Naomi have a great video that explains how to use the floor to create the tango walk - also finishes with a useful close-up of the leaders forward step (unweighted ball onto heel). However, I have been taught by teachers who land on the ball of their foot. I'd also question Naomi's comment about bringing her foot to a point as she closes, but that is her particular style. https://vimeo.com/154343634 Edit Saw posts on another thread : I'm quite the tango nerd! my own credentials are 10 years dancing AT (in recent years both as follower and leader). Two lessons per week plus regular private lessons. Practise sessions and milongas. Danced ballroom and latin for a number of years and loved it but found dance schools really reluctant to allow me to "pick and choose" the styles I wanted to learn - even in private lessons. As this is a latin/ballroom thread, apologies for these posts and will now desist! (Love all the discussion about technique etc). |
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#1332 |
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Forum Member
Join Date: Sep 2012
Posts: 3,283
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Quote:
Yes that makes absolute sense to me for salsa. Its as if the floor is a sort of spring board. But its not something I would do in AT. You do however push off from the standing leg but if you didn't you wouldn't go far.
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#1333 |
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Forum Member
Join Date: Aug 2012
Posts: 16,124
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Quote:
I know so little about salsa, I don't know if they have a specific technique that falls outside the fundamental need to push out of the floor to create a dance step.
Building off the beautiful video of the tango walk, I think Pablo and Naomi have a great video that explains how to use the floor to create the tango walk - also finishes with a useful close-up of the leaders forward step (unweighted ball onto heel). However, I have been taught by teachers who land on the ball of their foot. I'd also question Naomi's comment about bringing her foot to a point as she closes, but that is her particular style. https://vimeo.com/154343634 Edit Saw posts on another thread : I'm quite the tango nerd! my own credentials are 10 years dancing AT (in recent years both as follower and leader). Two lessons per week plus regular private lessons. Practise sessions and milongas. Danced ballroom and latin for a number of years and loved it but found dance schools really reluctant to allow me to "pick and choose" the styles I wanted to learn - even in private lessons. As this is a latin/ballroom thread, apologies for these posts and will now desist! (Love all the discussion about technique etc). Point taken about going off topic. Probably best to come onto the NATS thread to talk AT. I've been told off before for talking AT in here. So apologies all - gone!
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#1334 |
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Forum Member
Join Date: Nov 2013
Posts: 3,524
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Quote:
I happened to find this while looking for something else. I think it is quite a good clear clip describing how Cuban motion - the hip action in salsa is created. Note how she talks about putting pressure on the balls of the feet when stepping. That is the drive through the floor thing. AT is more of a sleek gliding across the floor. Also the clip shows how the salsa hip action comes from the use of feet and legs and not by random 8 shaped revolutions.
Point taken about going off topic. Probably best to come onto the NATS thread to talk AT. I've been told off before for talking AT in here. So apologies all - gone! ![]() |
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#1335 |
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Forum Member
Join Date: Sep 2015
Location: London
Posts: 1,663
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We all share a love of dance and I for one, love reading all dance related posts even though I can't contribute 're salsa and AT
In my view it is interesting to compare the different types of dances and technique used. So it is lovely to see An Thropologist, Gritty and others posting here. The thread was set up by Jennifer and so I can't comment for her, but for me it only becomes a problem if the discussion runs away with itself and the main purpose of the thread is forgotten. . Also as Jennifer says, the expertise on this thread is mainly Ballroom and Latin. |
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#1336 |
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Join Date: Nov 2013
Posts: 3,524
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Quote:
I have to echo this. Although I have danced quite a lot of AT in the past, I haven't commented on the recent discussion because it was very unlikely I would know more than An Thropologist who teaches it or Gritty who has danced it longer than me.
In my view it is interesting to compare the different types of dances and technique used. So it is lovely to see An Thropologist, Gritty and others posting here. The thread was set up by Jennifer and so I can't comment for her, but for me it only becomes a problem if the discussion runs away with itself and the main purpose of the thread is forgotten. . Also as Jennifer says, the expertise on this thread is mainly Ballroom and Latin. Shame I'm going to miss the next 2 weeks SCD so will have to catch upwhen I can. Keeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeep dancing! |
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#1337 |
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Forum Member
Join Date: Sep 2015
Location: London
Posts: 1,663
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Quote:
Thanks Ann
Shame I'm going to miss the next 2 weeks SCD so will have to catch upwhen I can. Keeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeep dancing! Whatever you are doing, have a nice break! |
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#1338 |
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Forum Member
Join Date: Nov 2013
Posts: 3,524
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Quote:
Are you off to the Nationals on the 17th?
Whatever you are doing, have a nice break! |
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#1339 |
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Join Date: Sep 2015
Location: London
Posts: 1,663
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Yes I am. I'm in Portugal visiting family at the moment then up to Blackpool next weekend for the 3 days of competition, then staying on for the World Professional Ballroom Championships.......front row seats!!!!!
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#1340 |
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Forum Member
Join Date: Sep 2015
Location: London
Posts: 1,663
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Re rumba hip movement: this video (from someone who I know is an ex competitor and qualified teacher) tells you something about the relationship between feet and hips. However, it only (deliberately) tells you part of the story since there is also a relationship between body (including rib cage) and feet, in that there is an alternate compression of each side of the body as the hips move which contributes to the rotation.
www.youtube.com/watch?v=LoQKpGFwjB8 This is a slightly more sophisticated description from Horst Beer which talks about being 'in the floor'. www.youtube.com/watch?v=pqBJAZXhd58 |
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#1341 |
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Forum Member
Join Date: Aug 2015
Location: Land of Glitter
Posts: 2,573
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Hi ballroom/latin smarties!
Is there a name for the sweeping leg step sometimes used in the jive? I've seen it in Danny's, Louise's, Jay's and a few others (limited to more capable celebs) |
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#1342 |
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Forum Member
Join Date: Nov 2013
Posts: 3,524
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Quote:
Hi ballroom/latin smarties!
Is there a name for the sweeping leg step sometimes used in the jive? I've seen it in Danny's, Louise's, Jay's and a few others (limited to more capable celebs) |
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#1343 |
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Forum Member
Join Date: Sep 2015
Location: London
Posts: 1,663
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Yes, a time reading for the video might help too, Nina, since I couldn't obviously see what you meant in Danny or Louise's.
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#1344 |
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Forum Member
Join Date: May 2008
Posts: 13,160
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Is it the one where the knee looks dislocated
in Danny's at about 1.25?
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#1345 |
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Forum Member
Join Date: Sep 2015
Location: London
Posts: 1,663
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Quote:
Is it the one where the knee looks dislocated
in Danny's at about 1.25? I think kaycee or bendymixer might be better placed to comment on these. (They look very good though!) I'm off to a dance workshop this morning and so won't be posting. I'm not sure if Jennifer only had limited access this week. However hopefully someone will be able to answer the above questions. |
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#1346 |
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Forum Member
Join Date: Sep 2014
Posts: 383
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Quote:
Hi ballroom/latin smarties!
Is there a name for the sweeping leg step sometimes used in the jive? I've seen it in Danny's, Louise's, Jay's and a few others (limited to more capable celebs) |
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#1347 |
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Forum Member
Join Date: Aug 2015
Location: Land of Glitter
Posts: 2,573
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Quote:
Are you looking at the video on the BBC site, aggs, where he and Oti are doing flicks across the line of the standing leg? I can see what you mean in that the nature of the flick is different from the preceding ones, but I don't know enough to comment much more than that.
I think kaycee or bendymixer might be better placed to comment on these. (They look very good though!) I'm off to a dance workshop this morning and so won't be posting. I'm not sure if Jennifer only had limited access this week. However hopefully someone will be able to answer the above questions. Jay does it at 1:24 too: https://youtu.be/0m6MjsMXZ8I |
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#1348 |
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Forum Member
Join Date: Aug 2015
Location: Land of Glitter
Posts: 2,573
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Quote:
I'm not a ballroom/Latin expert so this might be completely wrong and I'm sure it's not the proper name but I've heard this move described as a 'broken leg' (which makes sense as like you said, it looks a bit like their knee has dislocated)
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#1349 |
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Forum Member
Join Date: Sep 2007
Posts: 8,434
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Quote:
As this is a latin/ballroom thread, apologies for these posts and will now desist! (Love all the discussion about technique etc). So why don't you start an AT thread? I'm sure there's other AT dancers who would be glad of it. |
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#1350 |
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Forum Member
Join Date: Sep 2007
Posts: 8,434
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Quote:
Hi ballroom/latin smarties!
Is there a name for the sweeping leg step sometimes used in the jive? I've seen it in Danny's, Louise's, Jay's and a few others (limited to more capable celebs) |
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in Danny's at about 1.25?