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Alison |
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#51 |
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Forum Member
Join Date: Jun 2006
Posts: 13,434
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Just because someone makes a comment about Alison's weight doesn't mean they don't like her. I worry about her and feel that for the sake of her health she does need to lose weight. There is a lot she can't do because she is so big. There is no denying she is having fun and why shouldn't she but no one wants to see her collapse whilst she is having fun.
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#52 |
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Join Date: Nov 2008
Posts: 201
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Quote:
You might just as well say they shouldn't have old people on there if it's a question of what someone is physically able to do.
It's ridiculous to criticise someone for being fat and then say they have no right to dare doing anything active. |
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#53 |
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Forum Member
Join Date: Oct 2010
Posts: 738
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OP - I think any thread about Alison will inevitably end up talking about her weight. I watched tonight and could only admire her rhythm and ability - but also thought - if only she was 5 stone lighter - what a contestant she would be.
In the meantime - I am a little tired with every Strictly including the token obese dancer. What are they trying to prove? However PC they are being - the facts are there. Anyone carrying that amount of weight is risking damage to their heart and their joints. This is not "weightist" - it is a simple fact. And I am speaking from having lost several stone over the last few years and improved my general health immeasurably - including risks of heart problems and diabetes. In fact there is a lot of independent peer reviewed research that shows obesity can be protective, particularly in older age. There is also independent peer reviewed research that shows continually dieting poses a greater risk to health than obesity. Assuming the person isn't completely sedentary, being obese doesn't 'put strain' on a persons heart, or joints, unless there is already a medical problem. These aren't the best papers, but I link to these as they are the most accessible to the general reader) 1) obesity 2) fat and fit.) Most health improvements one notices when losing weight is often due to being more active. What I do find interesting in threads about Alison and Lisa - and this is not directed at you - is the bigotry dressed up as 'fat concern'. Gheesh, the OP started up a thread about the music choice for Alison's dance, and in comes comments about her weight, both dressed up as 'fat concern' and just outright bigoted, and it was all disproportionate to the topic. Calling her the token fat person is at best, condescending. People exists in all shapes, you can't erase that fact. The BBC are being reflective of the real world! Seeing a big person moving around not only breaks repressive stereotypes, but it IS a role model to put out there and IS something to aspire to. Being active is probably the number one controllable action one can take to increasing their health – REGARDLESS of their size. The science backs this fact up. Oh, and yes OP, it wasn't the best music choice. Sadly, Strictly and music choices have been getting worse for all contestants. |
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#54 |
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Forum Member
Join Date: Apr 2012
Posts: 840
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Actually, that is not a 'fact' at all. There is in fact no independent, peer reviewed research to show that obesity damages a persons heart or joints or puts them at a greater risk of diabetes, in and of itself. There is a lot of independent peer reviewed research to directly show that obesity isn't significantly a greater risk factor to health in terms of heart disease, joints or many other 'obesity related illnesses'. Any 'real' research done has found little evidence. Statistically, 'obesity related illnesses' effects about the same amount of 'healthy weight' people as it does 'obese' people.
In fact there is a lot of independent peer reviewed research that shows obesity can be protective, particularly in older age. There is also independent peer reviewed research that shows continually dieting poses a greater risk to health than obesity. Assuming the person isn't completely sedentary, being obese doesn't 'put strain' on a persons heart, or joints, unless there is already a medical problem. These aren't the best papers, but I link to these as they are the most accessible to the general reader) 1) obesity 2) fat and fit.) Most health improvements one notices when losing weight is often due to being more active. What I do find interesting in threads about Alison and Lisa - and this is not directed at you - is the bigotry dressed up as 'fat concern'. Gheesh, the OP started up a thread about the music choice for Alison's dance, and in comes comments about her weight, both dressed up as 'fat concern' and just outright bigoted, and it was all disproportionate to the topic. Calling her the token fat person is at best, condescending. People exists in all shapes, you can't erase that fact. The BBC are being reflective of the real world! Seeing a big person moving around not only breaks repressive stereotypes, but it IS a role model to put out there and IS something to aspire to. Being active is probably the number one controllable action one can take to increasing their health – REGARDLESS of their size. The science backs this fact up. Oh, and yes OP, it wasn't the best music choice. Sadly, Strictly and music choices have been getting worse for all contestants. |
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#55 |
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Forum Member
Join Date: Nov 2011
Posts: 2,589
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Strictly has been shown time and time again to be one of the best diet programmes there is. Tim Wonnacott lost 2 stone and he only lasted to week 4! It will be doing Alison the world of good.
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#56 |
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Forum Member
Join Date: Dec 2010
Location: Lytham St Annes
Posts: 2,366
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One thing's for sure, if Alison does an American Smooth, there won't be any lifts, unless she lifts Aljaž.
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#57 |
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Forum Member
Join Date: Jul 2007
Posts: 5,288
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Quote:
Actually, that is not a 'fact' at all. There is in fact no independent, peer reviewed research to show that obesity damages a persons heart or joints or puts them at a greater risk of diabetes, in and of itself. There is a lot of independent peer reviewed research to directly show that obesity isn't significantly a greater risk factor to health in terms of heart disease, joints or many other 'obesity related illnesses'. Any 'real' research done has found little evidence. Statistically, 'obesity related illnesses' effects about the same amount of 'healthy weight' people as it does 'obese' people.
In fact there is a lot of independent peer reviewed research that shows obesity can be protective, particularly in older age. There is also independent peer reviewed research that shows continually dieting poses a greater risk to health than obesity. Assuming the person isn't completely sedentary, being obese doesn't 'put strain' on a persons heart, or joints, unless there is already a medical problem. These aren't the best papers, but I link to these as they are the most accessible to the general reader) 1) obesity 2) fat and fit.) Most health improvements one notices when losing weight is often due to being more active. What I do find interesting in threads about Alison and Lisa - and this is not directed at you - is the bigotry dressed up as 'fat concern'. Gheesh, the OP started up a thread about the music choice for Alison's dance, and in comes comments about her weight, both dressed up as 'fat concern' and just outright bigoted, and it was all disproportionate to the topic. Calling her the token fat person is at best, condescending. People exists in all shapes, you can't erase that fact. The BBC are being reflective of the real world! Seeing a big person moving around not only breaks repressive stereotypes, but it IS a role model to put out there and IS something to aspire to. Being active is probably the number one controllable action one can take to increasing their health – REGARDLESS of their size. The science backs this fact up. Oh, and yes OP, it wasn't the best music choice. Sadly, Strictly and music choices have been getting worse for all contestants. I think this has been proven on many weight loss shows such as The Biggest Loser where the person losing weight gets a really good level of fitness maybe even after just a month on the regime even though they are still very overweight. |
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#58 |
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Forum Member
Join Date: Oct 2010
Location: in the Sun (ツ)
Posts: 11,223
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Yes! I totally agree with what you are saying. It is not obesity in itself that causes problems it is inactivity. Better to be an active overweight person than an inactive thin smoker for example.
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#59 |
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Forum Member
Join Date: May 2004
Posts: 403
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Alison just doesn't seem to be enjoying it so much now.
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#60 |
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Forum Member
Join Date: Dec 2008
Posts: 11,311
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I think Caroline and Pasha had by far the worst music actually and yet they danced a really good Paso.
By worst music, I mean that it did not appear to have any Paso rhythm to it at all (phrasing of eight beats) and so I don't know how Caroline managed to dance some decent Paso steps. Alison didn't dance well at all so the whole package wasn't as good. |
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#61 |
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Forum Member
Join Date: Nov 2011
Posts: 606
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She was awful and should have gone before the lovely Thom
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#62 |
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Forum Member
Join Date: Sep 2011
Posts: 18,808
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Quote:
Actually, that is not a 'fact' at all. There is in fact no independent, peer reviewed research to show that obesity damages a persons heart or joints or puts them at a greater risk of diabetes, in and of itself. There is a lot of independent peer reviewed research to directly show that obesity isn't significantly a greater risk factor to health in terms of heart disease, joints or many other 'obesity related illnesses'. Any 'real' research done has found little evidence. Statistically, 'obesity related illnesses' effects about the same amount of 'healthy weight' people as it does 'obese' people.
In fact there is a lot of independent peer reviewed research that shows obesity can be protective, particularly in older age. There is also independent peer reviewed research that shows continually dieting poses a greater risk to health than obesity. Assuming the person isn't completely sedentary, being obese doesn't 'put strain' on a persons heart, or joints, unless there is already a medical problem. These aren't the best papers, but I link to these as they are the most accessible to the general reader) 1) obesity 2) fat and fit.) Most health improvements one notices when losing weight is often due to being more active. What I do find interesting in threads about Alison and Lisa - and this is not directed at you - is the bigotry dressed up as 'fat concern'. Gheesh, the OP started up a thread about the music choice for Alison's dance, and in comes comments about her weight, both dressed up as 'fat concern' and just outright bigoted, and it was all disproportionate to the topic. Calling her the token fat person is at best, condescending. People exists in all shapes, you can't erase that fact. The BBC are being reflective of the real world! Seeing a big person moving around not only breaks repressive stereotypes, but it IS a role model to put out there and IS something to aspire to. Being active is probably the number one controllable action one can take to increasing their health – REGARDLESS of their size. The science backs this fact up. Oh, and yes OP, it wasn't the best music choice. Sadly, Strictly and music choices have been getting worse for all contestants. Obesity has been associated with many other illnesses, either as a cause or a trigger for worsening symptoms: Diabetes. Obesity is strongly correlated with diabetes. ... Cancer. ... Sleep apnea. ... Osteoarthritis. ... Gallbladder disease. ... Fatty liver disease. ... GERD. ... Gout. Are their years of medicical study and experience of dealing with chronically overwight people wrong
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#63 |
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Forum Member
Join Date: Nov 2007
Posts: 20,483
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Then why are doctors telling us that obesity can cause the following:
Obesity has been associated with many other illnesses, either as a cause or a trigger for worsening symptoms: Diabetes. Obesity is strongly correlated with diabetes. ... Cancer. ... Sleep apnea. ... Osteoarthritis. ... Gallbladder disease. ... Fatty liver disease. ... GERD. ... Gout. Are their years of medicical study and experience of dealing with chronically overwight people wrong![]() apparently the earth is flat, too. |
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#64 |
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Forum Member
Join Date: Jun 2008
Posts: 21,517
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Quote:
Then why are doctors telling us that obesity can cause the following:
Obesity has been associated with many other illnesses, either as a cause or a trigger for worsening symptoms: Diabetes. Obesity is strongly correlated with diabetes. ... Cancer. ... Sleep apnea. ... Osteoarthritis. ... Gallbladder disease. ... Fatty liver disease. ... GERD. ... Gout. Are their years of medicical study and experience of dealing with chronically overwight people wrong![]() Activity and a healthy diet are more important than size when it comes to health. It is just that being overweight can be a sign that you are doing neither. |
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#65 |
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Forum Member
Join Date: Sep 2011
Posts: 18,808
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Associates with and correlated with are not the same as causes. Inactivity can cause obesity, so can overindulgence, too much sugar etc.
Activity and a healthy diet are more important than size when it comes to health. It is just that being overweight can be a sign that you are doing neither.
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#66 |
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Inactive Member
Join Date: May 2011
Location: On the ground
Posts: 3,686
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Overmarked again, she was awful.
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I thought it was really, really bad. She is so hampered by how flat footed she is. It always appears as though she is shuffling along in a pair of old slippers.
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Hang on, I'm not talking about her dancing........ But the producers MUSIC choice diabolical
Can the pro dancers object if they don't think the music is right? Do we know for sure the pro dancers don't choose the music? |
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#67 |
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Inactive Member
Join Date: May 2011
Location: On the ground
Posts: 3,686
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Quote:
She was awful and should have gone before the lovely Thom
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#68 |
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Inactive Member
Join Date: May 2011
Location: On the ground
Posts: 3,686
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Isn't that contradictory
![]() Its very clear. It could be an indication but it is not necessarily the case. |
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#69 |
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Forum Member
Join Date: Oct 2011
Location: Liverpool
Posts: 9,508
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I'll put it out there, the music is okay for a Tango. They used it on DWTS and it worked fine!
Difference is the celeb in America was Charlie White. He could dance well. Alison can't, and Aljaz's routine took 45 seconds to even look like a Tango. It was worse than Tim's Charleston. Deserved no more than 3s or 4s... |
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#70 |
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Forum Member
Join Date: Oct 2011
Location: Liverpool
Posts: 9,508
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but not before scott or judy, so you must have a prejudice.
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#71 |
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Forum Member
Join Date: Sep 2011
Posts: 18,808
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No, how can you not understand?
Its very clear. It could be an indication but it is not necessarily the case. |
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#72 |
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Forum Member
Join Date: Nov 2013
Location: Lanarkshire
Posts: 942
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Alison does have rhythm but is terribly flat footed.
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#73 |
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Join Date: Nov 2006
Posts: 1,013
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Well, I just don't, moreover I don't think it is very clear at all.
If you are obese AND fit, you aren't particularly at risk from all the fat-person diseases. If you are thin AND unfit, you are at risk for all the diseases thought of as fat-person diseases. It's slightly more complicated than that, obviously, because all sorts of things interact to cause disease: not just weight, not just fitness, not just genetics, not just environment. Public health efforts have to communicate very simple messages, otherwise people ignore them. Unfit people are much more likely to be fat. Fat people are more likely to diet than unfit people are to exercise. Therefore the public health message centres on the simple mantra of DON'T BE FAT. |
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#74 |
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Forum Member
Join Date: Dec 2010
Posts: 102
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[quote=henrywilliams58;75356074]Here is a fat guy dancing. Pretty good. So much better than the skinny Dad Dancers at the back.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=YPhXZQFBeEE Aaargh! Speedo warning!!! |
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#75 |
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Forum Member
Join Date: Jul 2007
Posts: 5,288
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Isn't that contradictory
![]() Someone who is skeletal but lives in the pub and smokes like a chimney will not be healthier than a larger person who exercises regularly. I was diagnosed with diabetes 7 years ago, since then although my weight hasn't decreased very much my activity has. I exercise regularly and have done a 50 mile mountain treks three times. I eat a reasonably healthy diet and every check I have had in the last five years has shown my blood sugars as normal. So much so that the Diabetic Practitioner is now disputing the original diagnosis. Saying diseases are related to obesity is a bit of a lazy way of putting it - those diseases are linked to an unhealthy lifestyle and lack of exercise, and often people who fit that are obese. However not all obese people have unhealthy lifestyles. |
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Are their years of medicical study and experience of dealing with chronically overwight people wrong