Actually not as daft as you may think. In a sort of way that is what is happening.

Dig out Rachel and Vincent's. That probably walked the line best between authenticity and showmanship.

I'd better not look. You know what I'd say. There is show dancing AT and internal Milonguero style AT. Very different as I have shown.

Milonguero Style is very emotionally draining. You hear and feel each other's hearts beat and lungs expand and pump out air. Cheeks, heads and chests are locked together. Glasses are removed ritually before the embrace. And for 12 minutes you don't notice anybody else in the room - especially with glasses removed . A month ago a follower said "Nobody else is dancing". I hadn't noticed. I was dancing for her and for me.

I agree with others who have pointed out that one can hardly expect a celeb to come anywhere close to delivering an authentic AT in just a few days when starting from scratch.

At least Jason nailed the characterisation the judges (rightly or wrongly) require.

As for the example you gave us, a routine danced throughout in 'A-frame' imposes substantial limitations on the footwork.

For me a better comparision is Harry's 'perfect score' routine to another danced predominately out of 'A-frame'.

Harry and Aliona -

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Ftf-SIAU8oE

with -

Chicho y Juana - Mantova TF 2008 -

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Ga1dUZm6lbc

Give it a couple of minutes - it does warm up

Yep more my cup of tea that one.

A couple of clips with Miguel Ángel Zotto and Daiana Guspero that are also easy on the eye

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_4G03HpzArc

http://youtu.be/3TMO2wbXVwg?t=30s

Pretty much all of Pixies dances xxxx

Caroline and Pasha's Rumba
Alison and Aljaz's Foxtrot
Mark and Karen's Samba
Pixie and Trent's Waltz
Caroline and Pasha's Quickstep

These two ATs are also eye-catching. In the first, the girl kicks between the guy's legs like a snake striking. Impressive lift in the second.

Fingers crossed we get the chance to see ATs with appropriate music from all three top girls.

Carlos Barrionuevo and Deborah Quiroga -

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=BbPZpbQzfW8

Carlos Barrionuevo and Mayte Valdes -

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=FEBxvhRLAoI

Looks like AT showdance - like Vincent and Flavia style.

I have never seen a lift in AT above the hip. (sentada = seated).. And seldom seen a one armed hold or even a second out of hold even in Salon Style (Standard embrace).

I prefer for myself Milonguero Style which is 100% in close A-frame hold in very close embrace all of the time and no lifts at all.

Each to their own of course.

Milonguero style of course as has been pointed out does not make for suitable viewing on a stage let alone on mass-market television.

Excellent stuff Salon Style (open embrace much of the time). But note no lifts. Chicho is pretty showy.

I'm surprised how many people are rating Pixie's samba so highly. I really didn't like it and I looove sambas. I just thought it seemed really heavy. She's so great I was expecting a bit more, I guess.

edit: I would rate her quickstep as one of my favourite dances, however. simon's quickstep too. jake's waltz was a highlight for the amazingly characterful performance. I find he can look a bit like a wind up toy sometimes (like he's following orders rather than ~dancing) but he looked so natural in his movements, even if it wasn't the waltziest waltz that ever waltzed.

mark's jive was surprisingly good too imo.

I really liked Frankie's samba. Maybe I should say I loved the music to Frankie's Samba.

BIB Amen!

You are right these are eye catching and i like them. However there is a qualitative difference in these and the clips Henry has been posting. These are both show Argentine Tangos, pre choreographed and rehearsed.

The ones that Henry posted are probably choreographed and rehearsed too to be honest, but they needn't have been. They are constructed entirely from steps and figures that could have been led. In other words everything in them could be choreographed spontaneously and transmitted in real time to the follower through the basic principles of lead and follow.

These two could not have been led. There are elements where unless the lady knew what was going to happen at that point in the music she wouldn't be able to follow the intentions of the man.

The essence of AT is the manner in which the dance can be improvised in the moment. Because of the ability of the lead to silently communicate his intentions to the follower, so she can interpret that invitation to/for the next few steps, the dance can live in the moment and be a reflection of what the partnership is feeling as inspired by the music (and other stuff)

I guess what you're referring to is the dancers dancing for themselves rather than for the spectators. But is there any fundamental difference between the man leading an AT as opposed to leading a Salsa?

It is not just this dance that is "faked". Every single dance by every single couple is. There is no lead and follow, they are ALL choreographed routines, this AT is no different so no reason as to why it is singled out.

Brendan and Sunetra AS so far...

None what so ever in my view. Salsa too has a language to facilitate spontaneously improvised choreography (and I am not sure if you can use that term to describe this sort of instant interpretation - choreography for me is synonymous with something planned).

The salsa language (the things that are done to transmit the lead) is completely different to the AT language of course. But in the way that Chinese and Spanish while totally different are both used to communicate what their speakers are feeling or thinking at that moment in real time.

Whether this is the same for ballroom and international Latin I can't say but I am hoping someone will (Jennifer seems to suggest above that it is similar). I think it is for Charleston, Lindy, Swing etc.

Its interesting that you talk of dancers dancing for themselves rather than an audience because I know many salseros in particular who dance for an imaginary audience. So although they are making it up as they go along they are still visualising the total dance as it is seen through the eyes of an onlooker and making choices to enhance the overall visual effect. I am not one of these though.

I perceive two schools of thinking in this respect. I once went on a weekend course where the workshops were lead by a very eminent teacher and seasoned dancer. At one point she said " It doesn't matter how it feels its how it looks that matters"

Personally I couldn't have disagreed with her more. I dance because of the way it makes me feel. I would like to think it looks good too but that is secondary. (and in my case doubtful) For me it is like a drug and the high comes from seeking out those rare moments where you dance the right track, with the right man and all the elements come together. The two of you connect so perfectly that it feels like you are one organism (please note the NI ). That feeling is sublime. So for me dancing is a quest to find that 'hit' again and again.

this series, so far:

simon and kristina's quickstep.

I just would like to clarify a comment I made in an earlier post. Someone had singled out Simon and Kristina's AT as being " Fake", ie not actually lead and followed - in reality goodness knows how some expect this after a matter of days! - I pointed out that this is not the only dance where this happens, NONE of the dances are lead and followed, they are ALL choreographed routines. By this I am meaning the couples on this show, not real life dancers that can dance properly.
None of these dancers on the show have the ability or experience to lead or follow. They are all dancing set steps to a set piece of music, and take instruction from their Pro as to how to execute those steps.
Competitive and social dancers can and do, lead and follow, and I can recall dancing a Waltz at Blackpool in the National Championships not knowing what my partner was going to dance, The floor was flooded with couples so he had to use his floorcraft skills and literally make it up as he went along so I had to follow throughout.

The routines on SCD are set routines to set music. None of the celebs would be able to go to a studio or social event, be asked to dance, and be able to dance with a complete stranger to music they had not even heard before.

Well said.

It's been a very underwhelming series so far, but if I had to pick a few dances as favourites:

Jake & Janette's Salsa (the only dance this series that has made me go 'wow')
Mark & Karen's Jive
Frankie & Kevin's Tango (despite the music being all wrong and the faffing at the end)
Pixie & Trent's Foxtrot

I think it was me who said they were faking it. Not that it was fake and for me there is a difference. And of course I know they have to cut corners. It takes ages to learn how to lead and follow AT and I am sure any other dance. I didn't mean it disparagingly.

The BIB is spot on. None of them are learning to dance ( well a bit I hope) . The task in hand is to learn to a routine.

However when I made the point it was because the illusion had not been created. When a step in real dancing is led by one part of the leaders anatomy coming into contact with a part of the followers anatomy, the copy (if you like) has to at least have bodily contact. So when the SCD duo appear to achieve the same step and the parts of their anatomy in question are 6 inches apart it is clear they are pretending.

Not a criticism just an observation. (Although whether it should then merit a 10 is moot) And to make the distinction between the performances on SCD and real dancing even at a very rudimentary social level.

Similar in ballroom when you can drive a truck between them.

Frankies paso and tango

Yes, and then some, in some cases ! But understandably at this level, it takes years of practice and skill to be able to have correct and good enough contact to be able to follow precisely what your partner is leading. Easy when you dance a set routine but not so, if its spontaeous and all off the cuff.
As I have said before, on the whole they all do a great job overall, its not easy.