Telefonica considers selling O2

Everything Goes · 24-11-2014, 11:04

BT sold O2 to Telefonica in 2004 for £71.7bn so I wonder what sort of money change hands to buy it back?

plymouthbloke1974 · 24-11-2014, 11:06

Confirmed that BT are in "high level" talks to buy O2 UK

jonmorris · 24-11-2014, 11:09

Quote:

BT sold O2 to Telefonica in 2004 for £71.7bn so I wonder what sort of money change hands to buy it back?

Well given how much money O2 has invested in its network since 2004, I'd say about £71.7bn.

Thing is, O2 has a strong brand (stronger than EE) but EE would be the network to buy. However, I have no idea what it would cost. Presumably all that investment in infrastructure, spectrum etc would make it a much more costly buy - but you'd be getting a solid network from day one.

And it's quite clear that as time goes on both FT and DT seem increasingly keen to get rid, so that could actually help a buyer get it for a good price.

interactiv-uk · 24-11-2014, 11:11

Quote:

Originally Posted by Zee_Bukhari

I wonder who the 2nd mobile company could be?

Looks to be EE according to the releases.

Would be a lot easier for BT to do a deal with Telefonica for O2 as they would have to come to a deal with both DT and FT for EE as they both have a 50:50 stake...

plymouthbloke1974 · 24-11-2014, 11:12

Also, BT recently penned a deal with EE to provide services for BT Mobile....

Wonder how that will pan out? Surely buying EE in this case would be better?

omnidirectional · 24-11-2014, 11:14

Quote:

Originally Posted by plymouthbloke1974

Wonder how that will pan out? Surely buying EE in this case would be better?

Depends on how much they're willng to pay. Buy O2 and get a network in dire need of upgrading, or pay a premium for EE but save on network upgrade costs in the long term.

plymouthbloke1974 · 24-11-2014, 11:17

Quote:

Originally Posted by omnidirectional

Depends on how much they're willng to pay. Buy O2 and get a network in dire need of upgrading, or pay a premium for EE but save on network upgrade costs in the long term.

I'm talking more the legalities of the MVNO deal signed. If BT buy O2 then that cannot go ahead.

moox · 24-11-2014, 11:25

Quote:

Originally Posted by jonmorris

Well given how much money O2 has invested in its network since 2004, I'd say about £71.7bn.

Thing is, O2 has a strong brand (stronger than EE) but EE would be the network to buy. However, I have no idea what it would cost. Presumably all that investment in infrastructure, spectrum etc would make it a much more costly buy - but you'd be getting a solid network from day one.

And it's quite clear that as time goes on both FT and DT seem increasingly keen to get rid, so that could actually help a buyer get it for a good price.

EE also has the spectrum deal with BT and seems to be leaning toward wanting to do rural 4G broadband (as they have done in Cheshire and have announced a plan for Cornwall), which might be a good fit for BT's existing rural broadband plans (some of them are currently pushing customers to satellite internet whereas 4G would be several times better)

Everything Goes · 24-11-2014, 11:27

Reuters is reporting that yet another mobile operator has approached BT for a buyout. The agency cites "a person familiar with the matter" who says that EE, the UK's biggest mobile operator, has held talks with the group.

Its all go

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/live/business-30130459

Everything Goes · 24-11-2014, 11:47

Quote:

Originally Posted by jonmorris

Well given how much money O2 has invested in its network since 2004, I'd say about £71.7bn.

Thing is, O2 has a strong brand (stronger than EE) but EE would be the network to buy. However, I have no idea what it would cost. Presumably all that investment in infrastructure, spectrum etc would make it a much more costly buy - but you'd be getting a solid network from day one.

And it's quite clear that as time goes on both FT and DT seem increasingly keen to get rid, so that could actually help a buyer get it for a good price.

I reckon one of the reasons BT wanted to get rid of O2 in the first place was the cost of that pricey 3G licence which cost them £4.03bn plus they would have to "Invest in 3G network upgrades" clearly that was a bit of a disaster.

EE at least have a network that is worth buying as they have spent some money on it. BT I suspect culturally more like O2 and their dead slow and stop pace of doing things is more akin to BT. Invest as little as possible and drag it out as long as you can.

plymouthbloke1974 · 24-11-2014, 11:58

Also, if BT bought EE, what would happen to EE's landline/broadband business?

My head hurts....

jonmorris · 24-11-2014, 12:05

Quote:

Originally Posted by plymouthbloke1974

My head hurts....

See? Mobiles DO give you headaches!

moox · 24-11-2014, 12:05

Quote:

Originally Posted by plymouthbloke1974

Also, if BT bought EE, what would happen to EE's landline/broadband business?

My head hurts....

IIRC EE already contracts BT to run that for them, so it would probably be a simple move to put them onto either of BT's ISPs

http://www.choose.net/media/guide/ne...rce-to-bt.html

omnidirectional · 24-11-2014, 12:07

I think it'd be absorbed in to BT Broadband.

800,000 broadband customers might add to the attraction of EE for BT.

plymouthbloke1974 · 24-11-2014, 12:13

Quote:

Originally Posted by moox

IIRC EE already contracts BT to run that for them, so it would probably be a simple move to put them onto either of BT's ISPs

http://www.choose.net/media/guide/ne...rce-to-bt.html

EE just lease the space from BTO like most other ISP's. BT don't run the business...

moox · 24-11-2014, 12:15

Quote:

Originally Posted by plymouthbloke1974

EE just lease the space from BTO like most other ISP's. BT don't run the business...

I'm aware of what many ISPs do, but does EE actually have a network of their own?

"In March 2010 Orange announced that they were handing over the management of their network to BT Wholesale and starting to sell a wholesale, or non-LLU, product.

Maybe EE "run the business" but BT appears to be doing the leg work to provide the service?

(just like how BT provided a "white goods" broadband service for the Post Office before they moved to TalkTalk - BT provided the service from end to end, the PO did the billing and customer services and decided what to charge)

Grouty · 24-11-2014, 12:32

.. B2 .

jonmorris · 24-11-2014, 12:34

Bee Tee

(forum won't let me do that all caps!)

Aye Up · 24-11-2014, 12:52

Whilst I knew BT was sniffing around for potential aquisitions, I didn't expect it to include EE. I honestly thought it would have been someone like AT&T or another american arm who would have bid for them. The fact that these two companies (Telefonica and EE Parents) have approached BT directly makes it sound like they really want to get rid, if anything this puts BT in a rather delicious position, they can effectively demand the price and what terms they are sat at. Never in a million years did I picture it happens this way.

Of the two the most likely aquisition would be O2, purely because of the spectrum allocation. It is likely BT would have to divest its 2600 spectrum if it was to take over EE. Where as with O2 it would free from those concerns. things are starting to get interesting now....what with vodafone now entering the quadplay segment from early next year and BT potentially getting back into the mobile market, we really are in for a treat.

iGeek2014 · 24-11-2014, 13:09

I'm old enough to remember the days of BT Cellnet and Genie so it'll be interesting to see what becomes of o2 if BT acquire the business once again.

At least phones have come on leaps and bounds since then!

http://i3.minus.com/ibtqKnnaXSSikC.jpg

enapace · 24-11-2014, 13:15

It was obvious to me after AT&T brought lusacell they they were going to be focusing on Mexico and not a European prescence for a while it is a better economic fit for them specially with them being able to bid for the breaking up of America Movil that has to happen.

Must say I am surprised BT is considering to buy O2 they apparently can't find money to pay FTTP in a lot of areas like was originally said but can somehow find money to buy a mobile operator.

moox · 24-11-2014, 13:25

Quote:

Originally Posted by enapace

It was obvious to me after AT&T brought lusacell they they were going to be focusing on Mexico and not a European prescence for a while it is a better economic fit for them specially with them being able to bid for the breaking up of America Movil that has to happen.

Must say I am surprised BT is considering to buy O2 they apparently can't find money to pay FTTP in a lot of areas like was originally said but can somehow find money to buy a mobile operator.

BT's FTTP rollout verges on random, yesterday I saw a rural farmhouse that could get FTTP (the telegraph pole that has the fibre on it being basically for their sole exclusive use), and in other places I've seen half of the street have FTTP and half have FTTC

Everything Goes · 24-11-2014, 13:28

Quote:

Originally Posted by enapace

It was obvious to me after AT&T brought lusacell they they were going to be focusing on Mexico and not a European prescence for a while it is a better economic fit for them specially with them being able to bid for the breaking up of America Movil that has to happen.

Must say I am surprised BT is considering to buy O2 they apparently can't find money to pay FTTP in a lot of areas like was originally said but can somehow find money to buy a mobile operator.

BT spunked a shit load of money on Football rights. They will be quite happy to do the same on a Mobile Network. Yeah BT know where their priorities are and its not on Fibre or any sort of broadband infrastructure for consumers

Rich_L · 24-11-2014, 13:31

£71 BILLION?

Are you sure?

Not £7.1 billion?

omnidirectional · 24-11-2014, 13:34

Quote:

Originally Posted by Rich_L

£71 BILLION?

Are you sure?

Not £7.1 billion?

The original sale price was £17bn. I think there was a typo in one of the earlier reports.

24-11-2014, 11:09	#53
jonmorris Forum Member Join Date: Jul 2002 Location: a land filled with trolls Posts: 12,018	Quote: Originally Posted by Everything Goes BT sold O2 to Telefonica in 2004 for £71.7bn so I wonder what sort of money change hands to buy it back? Well given how much money O2 has invested in its network since 2004, I'd say about £71.7bn. Thing is, O2 has a strong brand (stronger than EE) but EE would be the network to buy. However, I have no idea what it would cost. Presumably all that investment in infrastructure, spectrum etc would make it a much more costly buy - but you'd be getting a solid network from day one. And it's quite clear that as time goes on both FT and DT seem increasingly keen to get rid, so that could actually help a buyer get it for a good price.

24-11-2014, 11:04	#51
Everything Goes Forum Member Join Date: Mar 2002 Location: In the future.... Posts: 11,259	BT sold O2 to Telefonica in 2004 for £71.7bn so I wonder what sort of money change hands to buy it back?

24-11-2014, 11:06	#52
plymouthbloke1974 Forum Member Join Date: Aug 2001 Location: Destination: Hard Brexit Posts: 6,368	Confirmed that BT are in "high level" talks to buy O2 UK

24-11-2014, 11:11	#54
interactiv-uk Forum Member Join Date: Jan 2007 Posts: 587	Quote: Originally Posted by Zee_Bukhari I wonder who the 2nd mobile company could be? Looks to be EE according to the releases. Would be a lot easier for BT to do a deal with Telefonica for O2 as they would have to come to a deal with both DT and FT for EE as they both have a 50:50 stake...

24-11-2014, 11:12	#55
plymouthbloke1974 Forum Member Join Date: Aug 2001 Location: Destination: Hard Brexit Posts: 6,368	Also, BT recently penned a deal with EE to provide services for BT Mobile.... Wonder how that will pan out? Surely buying EE in this case would be better?

24-11-2014, 11:14	#56
omnidirectional Forum Member Join Date: Jul 2007 Posts: 10,879	Quote: Originally Posted by plymouthbloke1974 Wonder how that will pan out? Surely buying EE in this case would be better? Depends on how much they're willng to pay. Buy O2 and get a network in dire need of upgrading, or pay a premium for EE but save on network upgrade costs in the long term.

24-11-2014, 11:17	#57
plymouthbloke1974 Forum Member Join Date: Aug 2001 Location: Destination: Hard Brexit Posts: 6,368	Quote: Originally Posted by omnidirectional Depends on how much they're willng to pay. Buy O2 and get a network in dire need of upgrading, or pay a premium for EE but save on network upgrade costs in the long term. I'm talking more the legalities of the MVNO deal signed. If BT buy O2 then that cannot go ahead.

24-11-2014, 11:25	#58
moox Forum Member Join Date: Oct 2004 Posts: 14,645	Quote: Originally Posted by jonmorris Well given how much money O2 has invested in its network since 2004, I'd say about £71.7bn. Thing is, O2 has a strong brand (stronger than EE) but EE would be the network to buy. However, I have no idea what it would cost. Presumably all that investment in infrastructure, spectrum etc would make it a much more costly buy - but you'd be getting a solid network from day one. And it's quite clear that as time goes on both FT and DT seem increasingly keen to get rid, so that could actually help a buyer get it for a good price. EE also has the spectrum deal with BT and seems to be leaning toward wanting to do rural 4G broadband (as they have done in Cheshire and have announced a plan for Cornwall), which might be a good fit for BT's existing rural broadband plans (some of them are currently pushing customers to satellite internet whereas 4G would be several times better)

24-11-2014, 11:27	#59
Everything Goes Forum Member Join Date: Mar 2002 Location: In the future.... Posts: 11,259	Reuters is reporting that yet another mobile operator has approached BT for a buyout. The agency cites "a person familiar with the matter" who says that EE, the UK's biggest mobile operator, has held talks with the group. Its all go http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/live/business-30130459

24-11-2014, 11:47	#60
Everything Goes Forum Member Join Date: Mar 2002 Location: In the future.... Posts: 11,259	Quote: Originally Posted by jonmorris Well given how much money O2 has invested in its network since 2004, I'd say about £71.7bn. Thing is, O2 has a strong brand (stronger than EE) but EE would be the network to buy. However, I have no idea what it would cost. Presumably all that investment in infrastructure, spectrum etc would make it a much more costly buy - but you'd be getting a solid network from day one. And it's quite clear that as time goes on both FT and DT seem increasingly keen to get rid, so that could actually help a buyer get it for a good price. I reckon one of the reasons BT wanted to get rid of O2 in the first place was the cost of that pricey 3G licence which cost them £4.03bn plus they would have to "Invest in 3G network upgrades" clearly that was a bit of a disaster. EE at least have a network that is worth buying as they have spent some money on it. BT I suspect culturally more like O2 and their dead slow and stop pace of doing things is more akin to BT. Invest as little as possible and drag it out as long as you can.

24-11-2014, 11:58	#61
plymouthbloke1974 Forum Member Join Date: Aug 2001 Location: Destination: Hard Brexit Posts: 6,368	Also, if BT bought EE, what would happen to EE's landline/broadband business? My head hurts....

24-11-2014, 12:05	#62
jonmorris Forum Member Join Date: Jul 2002 Location: a land filled with trolls Posts: 12,018	Quote: Originally Posted by plymouthbloke1974 My head hurts.... See? Mobiles DO give you headaches!

24-11-2014, 12:07	#64
omnidirectional Forum Member Join Date: Jul 2007 Posts: 10,879	I think it'd be absorbed in to BT Broadband. 800,000 broadband customers might add to the attraction of EE for BT.

24-11-2014, 12:13	#65
plymouthbloke1974 Forum Member Join Date: Aug 2001 Location: Destination: Hard Brexit Posts: 6,368	Quote: Originally Posted by moox IIRC EE already contracts BT to run that for them, so it would probably be a simple move to put them onto either of BT's ISPs http://www.choose.net/media/guide/ne...rce-to-bt.html EE just lease the space from BTO like most other ISP's. BT don't run the business...

24-11-2014, 12:15	#66
moox Forum Member Join Date: Oct 2004 Posts: 14,645	Quote: Originally Posted by plymouthbloke1974 EE just lease the space from BTO like most other ISP's. BT don't run the business... I'm aware of what many ISPs do, but does EE actually have a network of their own? "In March 2010 Orange announced that they were handing over the management of their network to BT Wholesale and starting to sell a wholesale, or non-LLU, product. Maybe EE "run the business" but BT appears to be doing the leg work to provide the service? (just like how BT provided a "white goods" broadband service for the Post Office before they moved to TalkTalk - BT provided the service from end to end, the PO did the billing and customer services and decided what to charge)

24-11-2014, 12:32	#67
Grouty Forum Member Join Date: Oct 2011 Location: The Nth East Posts: 21,598	.. B2 .

24-11-2014, 12:34	#68
jonmorris Forum Member Join Date: Jul 2002 Location: a land filled with trolls Posts: 12,018	Bee Tee (forum won't let me do that all caps!)

24-11-2014, 12:52	#69
Aye Up Forum Member Join Date: Mar 2001 Location: North West Posts: 4,885	Whilst I knew BT was sniffing around for potential aquisitions, I didn't expect it to include EE. I honestly thought it would have been someone like AT&T or another american arm who would have bid for them. The fact that these two companies (Telefonica and EE Parents) have approached BT directly makes it sound like they really want to get rid, if anything this puts BT in a rather delicious position, they can effectively demand the price and what terms they are sat at. Never in a million years did I picture it happens this way. Of the two the most likely aquisition would be O2, purely because of the spectrum allocation. It is likely BT would have to divest its 2600 spectrum if it was to take over EE. Where as with O2 it would free from those concerns. things are starting to get interesting now....what with vodafone now entering the quadplay segment from early next year and BT potentially getting back into the mobile market, we really are in for a treat.

24-11-2014, 13:09	#70
iGeek2014 Guest Join Date: Jan 2014 Posts: 572	I'm old enough to remember the days of BT Cellnet and Genie so it'll be interesting to see what becomes of o2 if BT acquire the business once again. At least phones have come on leaps and bounds since then! http://i3.minus.com/ibtqKnnaXSSikC.jpg

24-11-2014, 13:15	#71
enapace Forum Member Join Date: Mar 2013 Posts: 4,249	It was obvious to me after AT&T brought lusacell they they were going to be focusing on Mexico and not a European prescence for a while it is a better economic fit for them specially with them being able to bid for the breaking up of America Movil that has to happen. Must say I am surprised BT is considering to buy O2 they apparently can't find money to pay FTTP in a lot of areas like was originally said but can somehow find money to buy a mobile operator.

24-11-2014, 13:25	#72
moox Forum Member Join Date: Oct 2004 Posts: 14,645	Quote: Originally Posted by enapace It was obvious to me after AT&T brought lusacell they they were going to be focusing on Mexico and not a European prescence for a while it is a better economic fit for them specially with them being able to bid for the breaking up of America Movil that has to happen. Must say I am surprised BT is considering to buy O2 they apparently can't find money to pay FTTP in a lot of areas like was originally said but can somehow find money to buy a mobile operator. BT's FTTP rollout verges on random, yesterday I saw a rural farmhouse that could get FTTP (the telegraph pole that has the fibre on it being basically for their sole exclusive use), and in other places I've seen half of the street have FTTP and half have FTTC

DS Forums

Telefonica considers selling O2

24-11-2014, 13:28	#73
Everything Goes Forum Member Join Date: Mar 2002 Location: In the future.... Posts: 11,259	Quote: Originally Posted by enapace It was obvious to me after AT&T brought lusacell they they were going to be focusing on Mexico and not a European prescence for a while it is a better economic fit for them specially with them being able to bid for the breaking up of America Movil that has to happen. Must say I am surprised BT is considering to buy O2 they apparently can't find money to pay FTTP in a lot of areas like was originally said but can somehow find money to buy a mobile operator. BT spunked a shit load of money on Football rights. They will be quite happy to do the same on a Mobile Network. Yeah BT know where their priorities are and its not on Fibre or any sort of broadband infrastructure for consumers

24-11-2014, 13:31	#74
Rich_L Forum Member Join Date: Nov 2005 Posts: 5,653	£71 BILLION? Are you sure? Not £7.1 billion?

24-11-2014, 13:34	#75
omnidirectional Forum Member Join Date: Jul 2007 Posts: 10,879	Quote: Originally Posted by Rich_L £71 BILLION? Are you sure? Not £7.1 billion? The original sale price was £17bn. I think there was a typo in one of the earlier reports.