Downloading 4od.....is it possible?

Can you point further by name? I did have YouTube downloader but thats no longer working on anything now.

Just Google Video Capture Software. I have Magix Edit Pro which is a full HD/4K video editing programme. More than you need to just capture live video.

Stig · 01-02-2015, 18:44

Quote:

I thought so too. Damned annoying. As daft as BBC cracking down on Radio Downloader which was an excellent little programme which actively encouraged people to listen to programmes they'd normally never have bothered with.

It was totally harmless and completely beneficial, yet BBC told the guy operating to stop. Needless to say the BBC didn't come up with anything themselves to replace it.

Barmy.

Some people obviously have no understanding of licensing and broadcast rights. There is a reason that the BBC and C4 have to protect the content as they have a legal requirement to do so from the copyright holders.

Mr Dos · 01-02-2015, 19:06

Quote:

Originally Posted by grahamlthompson

Some people obviously have no understanding of licensing and broadcast rights. There is a reason that the BBC and C4 have to protect the content as they have a legal requirement to do so from the copyright holders.

Same applies to threads about YouTube downloaders, DVD ripping etc. I'm surpised Digital Spy allows such discussions. The entitlement culture . . .

Bulletguy1 · 01-02-2015, 20:20

Quote:

Just Google Video Capture Software. I have Magix Edit Pro which is a full HD/4K video editing programme. More than you need to just capture live video.

Thanks for that. Much appreciated.

Bulletguy1 · 01-02-2015, 20:35

Quote:

Originally Posted by Mr Dos

Some people obviously have no understanding of licensing and broadcast rights. There is a reason that the BBC and C4 have to protect the content as they have a legal requirement to do so from the copyright holders.

Quote:

Same applies to threads about YouTube downloaders, DVD ripping etc. I'm surpised Digital Spy allows such discussions. The entitlement culture . . .

I used to 'download' the Top20 and a variety of pop music programmes using this identical machine.

Though a cheap brand, any teenager who had one was considered 'rich'. Of course that was over half a century ago now and we've moved on......at least in technology.

Mentioning the copyright issue in this particular case is ludicrous as 1) the programme has already been transmitted and 2) i have a licence as required under section 363 of the 2003 Communications Act.

Otherwise you'd be banning the sale of PVR's and DVD/RW's.

chrisjr · 01-02-2015, 22:28

Quote:

I used to 'download' the Top20 and a variety of pop music programmes using this identical machine.

Though a cheap brand, any teenager who had one was considered 'rich'. Of course that was over half a century ago now and we've moved on......at least in technology.

Mentioning the copyright issue in this particular case is ludicrous as 1) the programme has already been transmitted and 2) i have a licence as required under section 363 of the 2003 Communications Act.

Otherwise you'd be banning the sale of PVR's and DVD/RW's.

All completely irrelevant.

The TV licence only permits you to use equipment to receive broadcast TV programmes. It is not a licence to record and store those programmes. Nor is it relevant whether the programme has already been broadcast or not.

PVRs are only legal if you record programmes to watch at a later time. If you retain the recording on the hard drive to watch repeatedly or copy it to another medium to keep permanently that is illegal.

webbie · 02-02-2015, 00:07

But if you record onto a dvd-r or +r that is pretty permanent. Arguably more permanent than a hard drive. Yet sky encourage it with the use of the copy function (although once you start the copy process Sky tells us to set the VCR to record!)
I would say that VHS is also pretty permanent - I don't think I've ever had a failure of a tape playing back 20+ years after recording.

Bulletguy1 · 02-02-2015, 00:45

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All completely irrelevant.

The TV licence only permits you to use equipment to receive broadcast TV programmes. It is not a licence to record and store those programmes. Nor is it relevant whether the programme has already been broadcast or not.

Actually it is. It's all about 'live TV' which is where some people fall foul of the law. For example, that link i posted is not in the category of 'live tv' (see the TVL legal definition of that below).

You do not need a TV licence to watch programmes via iPlayer, 4od or any other 'catch up' TV. Yes you have to declare NLN (No Licence Needed) to TVL and yes they will have you jumping through hoops....because in their crazy mind everyone has a television receiver. The last word is important as a television only becomes 'a receiver' when connected to an aerial or dish. TVL will check to see that it isn't.

A friend of mine has been hassled by crackpot TVL inspectors in the past who remain convinced he must have a television. He doesn't own one and hasn't for the past 15 years now, but that still doesn't stop them from turning up.

He's even invited them in his house, which he doesn't have to, to search for the non-existent television receiver. They cannot find what isn't there. They go away happy and content.....for a few months and then rock up once again.

Quote:

Do I need a TV Licence if I only ever watch on demand services (e.g. catch-up TV), DVDs or downloaded programmes?

No you don’t. As you’re not watching or recording live TV, you don’t need a licence.
‘Live TV’ means any programme you watch or record at the same time as it’s being shown on TV or an online TV service.

If you only ever watch ‘on demand’ programmes, you don’t need a TV Licence. On demand includes catch-up TV, streaming or downloading programmes after they’ve been shown on live TV, or programmes available online before being shown on TV.

When don’t I need a TV Licence?

If you never watch or record live TV, you don’t need a TV Licence.

Without a licence you can only:
Watch on demand – including catch-up TV and on demand previews – through services like BBC iPlayer, ITV Player, 4oD, Demand 5, BT Vision, Virgin Media, Sky Go, Now TV, Apple TV, Chromecast, Roku and Amazon Fire TV.
Watch on demand movies from providers like Sky, Virgin Media, BT Vision, Netflix and Amazon Instant Video.
Watch recorded films and programmes either from a disc (e.g. DVD or Blu-ray) or downloaded from the internet.
Watch on demand internet video clips through services like YouTube.
Play video games.

Quote:

PVRs are only legal if you record programmes to watch at a later time. If you retain the recording on the hard drive to watch repeatedly or copy it to another medium to keep permanently that is illegal.

You are totally wrong on this. There is no such law in existence. If there was we'd have 90% of the population banged up in prison cells.

I have recordings of TV programmes as far back as 30 years ago on tape and still have the equipment to view them. I've got audio tape recordings of radio programmes going back even further still!

oilman · 02-02-2015, 07:15

Just ignore all the doomsayers. You would only ever get in trouble if you started selling illegal copies etc. I'll bet all the doomsayers don't strictly adhere to speed limit either.

The best recording software I know is part of the excellent aimersoft suite. You can have any video playing in a small window or large one or full screen and it automatically sizes itself.

Output is in wmv but easily converted to other formats.

Chris Frost · 02-02-2015, 08:26

Quote:

I used to 'download' the Top20 and a variety of pop music programmes using this identical machine.

Though a cheap brand, any teenager who had one was considered 'rich'. Of course that was over half a century ago now and we've moved on......at least in technology.

Mentioning the copyright issue in this particular case is ludicrous as 1) the programme has already been transmitted and 2) i have a licence as required under section 363 of the 2003 Communications Act.

Otherwise you'd be banning the sale of PVR's and DVD/RW's.

Whether the programme has been transmitted or not, the copyright still remains in force. The act of airing a programme does nothing to change that.

You have a licence to view; it's not a licence to record and keep in perpetuity. There is a difference.

I thought it was well established that recording TV is actually illegal. So by extension the process of time shifting for consumption at a more convenient time is also illegal, but is allowed in practise on the basis that the content won't be kept permanently after it has been watched. Hence PVRs, VCRs, DVDRs and their storage media exist in a bubble of tolerance.

All the above being said, there are examples of programmes that were either erased from tape by the broadcaster or simply never recorded because they were live broadcasts where the only surviving example has been found in a home recordist's archive. Several Dr Whos thought lost forever have been rediscovered this way, so exceptions can be made for historical reasons. However, my guess is those situations will rarely reoccur in the modern age of broadcaster archives and endless repeats.

chrisjr · 02-02-2015, 09:13

Quote:

Actually it is. It's all about 'live TV' which is where some people fall foul of the law. For example, that link i posted is not in the category of 'live tv' (see the TVL legal definition of that below).

You do not need a TV licence to watch programmes via iPlayer, 4od or any other 'catch up' TV. Yes you have to declare NLN (No Licence Needed) to TVL and yes they will have you jumping through hoops....because in their crazy mind everyone has a television receiver. The last word is important as a television only becomes 'a receiver' when connected to an aerial or dish. TVL will check to see that it isn't.

A friend of mine has been hassled by crackpot TVL inspectors in the past who remain convinced he must have a television. He doesn't own one and hasn't for the past 15 years now, but that still doesn't stop them from turning up.

He's even invited them in his house, which he doesn't have to, to search for the non-existent television receiver. They cannot find what isn't there. They go away happy and content.....for a few months and then rock up once again.

I wasn't talking about the whys and wherefores of whether you need a TV licence or not. I was referring to your assertion that somehow having a TV licence gave you the right to use TV programmes as you saw fit. As though that somehow gave you rights to copyright material that you don't in fact have.

Quote:

Originally Posted by oilman

You are totally wrong on this. There is no such law in existence. If there was we'd have 90% of the population banged up in prison cells.

I have recordings of TV programmes as far back as 30 years ago on tape and still have the equipment to view them. I've got audio tape recordings of radio programmes going back even further still!

I refer you to this

Quote:

A recording of a broadcast can be made in domestic premises for private and domestic use to enable it to be viewed or listened to at a more convenient time.

The making of a recording of a broadcast for purposes other than to time-shift a programme for you or your family is likely to be illegal.

https://www.gov.uk/exceptions-to-copyright

So it is only fully legal to make a recording of a TV programme for timeshifting purposes.

webbie · 02-02-2015, 12:55

That's OK then A more convenient time for me will be in 30 years time when I retire.

Bulletguy1 · 02-02-2015, 15:48

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Just ignore all the doomsayers. You would only ever get in trouble if you started selling illegal copies etc. I'll bet all the doomsayers don't strictly adhere to speed limit either.

Bang on the button re.copyrighting law there (bib).

Quote:

Originally Posted by oilman

The best recording software I know is part of the excellent aimersoft suite. You can have any video playing in a small window or large one or full screen and it automatically sizes itself.

Output is in wmv but easily converted to other formats.

Thank you.....appreciated.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Chris Frost

Whether the programme has been transmitted or not, the copyright still remains in force. The act of airing a programme does nothing to change that.

It does and it's there to protect ownership of the content profiting via unlicenced sources such as public venues showing films for profit (all Cinemas etc are licenced to screen to the public). Screening for profit or making copy to sell on is illegal.....viewing at a later date in your own home is not. You can invite as many friends as you like round to view a movie, but if you charged them 50p each you'd be breaking the law though i've yet to hear of anyone being taken to Court over something as petty and extreme as that!

Quote:

Originally Posted by Chris Frost

You have a licence to view; it's not a licence to record and keep in perpetuity. There is a difference.

There is no law in existence stating such. Let me know when you find that in black and white from either TVL website or similar (not some quotes off an obscure website or forum!).

Quote:

Originally Posted by Chris Frost

I thought it was well established that recording TV is actually illegal. So by extension the process of time shifting for consumption at a more convenient time is also illegal, but is allowed in practise on the basis that the content won't be kept permanently after it has been watched. Hence PVRs, VCRs, DVDRs and their storage media exist in a bubble of tolerance.

No this is not correct. You thought wrong! Read the TVL website.

Quote:

I wasn't talking about the whys and wherefores of whether you need a TV licence or not. I was referring to your assertion that somehow having a TV licence gave you the right to use TV programmes as you saw fit. As though that somehow gave you rights to copyright material that you don't in fact have.

No assertions on my part at all. Typically a subject like this often gets skewed so i wasn't in the least surprised when one or two 'Police' jumped in.

I'm viewing a programme which has already been transmitted so doesn't even fall into the category of 'live tv' (few programmes actually do now anyway).

Because i missed the broadcast i was unable to save it on my PVR, hence my initial query post which has been answered.

I am not making copy with the intention of profiting, selling on or charging people to view as a commercial business....it's purely for my own personal use and nobody else. All this is clearly explained on the TVL website from which i quoted.....yet apparently you seem to disregard that despite it being legally binding and just make up your own 'laws' as you go along!

Quote:

I refer you to this;

Quote:

A recording of a broadcast can be made in domestic premises for private and domestic use to enable it to be viewed or listened to at a more convenient time.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Mr Dos

The making of a recording of a broadcast for purposes other than to time-shift a programme for you or your family is likely to be illegal.

Apart from 'private and domestic', the other key words are 'viewed or listened to at a more convenient time'.

As one poster mentioned, in his case 'a more convenient time' will be when he retires in 30 years.

Mr Dos · 02-02-2015, 17:21

pretty easy to rattle the freetards' cages . . .

Stig · 02-02-2015, 19:21

Quote:

pretty easy to rattle the freetards' cages . . .

Indeed.

Think about this: what if the BBC replaced iPlayer with a torrent based site where you could download a high definition version of any films after they are broadcast. Says it's the Marvel Avengers movie.

How many DVDs/Blu-Rays of the movie would sell after that?
How much would Netflix, Amazon etc. pay for the streaming rights?
How many other UK networks would want to purchase broadcast rights?

If the studios can't make their money from these sources, they will just put up the price in cinemas etc.

It's not greed, it's economics.

webbie · 02-02-2015, 19:30

Once it's been broadcast by the BBC the film is 2-3 years old.
Most people who were interested in the film would already have bought it on blu-ray etc.
After being broadcast, the price of the blu-ray/dvd drops anyway. If the makers haven't made a profit on the film by then....

Bulletguy1 · 02-02-2015, 20:28

Quote:

Indeed.

Think about this: what if the BBC replaced iPlayer with a torrent based site where you could download a high definition version of any films after they are broadcast.

It's not greed, it's economics.

To be frank iPlayer and various other 'on demand' facilities are simply working toward 'pay to view' television, and the current TV licence will become a thing of the past. It's quite archaic and draconian anyway and more of a British 'peculiarity' than anything....almost like the days when after spending a small fortune on any new electrical appliance, you had to buy a 3 pin plug before you could use the damn thing.

I'm old enough to remember when everyone with a transistor radio or 'set top' wireless was required by law to have a licence. That ended 44 years ago in 1971.

More people are now using iPlayer and 'on demand' services. Personally i rarely watch any television programmes transmitted on the day.

2Bdecided · 03-02-2015, 12:06

Quote:

Originally Posted by 2Bdecided

Indeed.

Think about this: what if the BBC replaced iPlayer with a torrent based site where you could download a high definition version of any films after they are broadcast. Says it's the Marvel Avengers movie.

How many DVDs/Blu-Rays of the movie would sell after that?
How much would Netflix, Amazon etc. pay for the streaming rights?
How many other UK networks would want to purchase broadcast rights?

It could be worse. The BBC could pay for space on a satellite that covers half of western Europe, stream that movie on that satellite, widely and freely advertise ahead of time when the stream will be available, and send the stream completely in the clear so that anyone within the satellite's footprint can just grab an HD copy of the movie. People wouldn't even need an internet connection. They wouldn't have to pay for the bandwidth in any way. Even if (hypothetically) every single person chose to grab a copy of every single thing the BBC broadcasts, the stream wouldn't get overloaded. Every one could get a perfect copy, and no one would have paid for it.

Frankly, if the BBC did that, I doubt anyone would even bother making movies, and obviously all the things you mention would just collapse. Anything that had ever been broadcast by the BBC, even once, would never be seen anywhere ever again, because there would be no commercial value in it.

Oh, hang on...

Stig · 03-02-2015, 12:52

Quote:

Oh, hang on...

Yes, very funny.

However, the BBC and Channel 4 (remember this thread started about 4OD) have to pay for streaming rights, and have to make sure they make it secure. The same does not necessarily apply to terrestrial and satellite broadcasts.

grahamlthompson · 03-02-2015, 17:05

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