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Old 03-02-2015, 16:03
mmpfb
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LOL and she somehow influenced what we've seen too.
What have you seen? Because it seems to be fundamentally different to what I have seen.
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Old 03-02-2015, 16:08
Jules_Thornley
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About Alicia, Hopkins said, "If she was smarter I'd leave her alone".

The goading of Nadia and Perez, where they said nothing, in the bedroom would be another example of bullying, in my view. The isolation and Katie's encouragement of others (Nadia and Alicia) to isolate Perez is typical of a bully in my opinion. She gets away because Nadia and Perez were deemed "acceptable" targets for whatever reason. Oh and apparently she's "witty".
The Alicia thing was bordering on bullying. I almost agree. However, her opinion that Alicia seemed a little - lets say 'naive' was probably justified somewhat. And mostly she chatted to Alicia about it all - maybe pulling a few grimaces in the process. But Hopkins didn't go all out of her way to make fun of her. I think sometimes she was genuinely bamboozled by her lack of knowledge on certain things or her priorities with regards to her own body and perhaps working on some of these 'knowledge' issues.
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Old 03-02-2015, 16:12
Jules_Thornley
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Does it revert back to just as bad as each other though. If you are not happy with someone you think is a bully...to me doesn't make it acceptable for you to do the same.

Does it require will power to walk away when someone is kicking off? Absolutely but it can be done. She doesn't give Perez the chance to walk away though...how many times has she followed him around the house digging away at him.
Almost yes, they are as bad as each other. Maybe. Right? Perhaps not. But taken in the context of how things developed you can understand.

As I said, I think Katie H wanted to give Perez a run for his money - give him a little bit of his own medicine. Perez encouraged it. He wanted Katie to react. Just like he encouraged the 'horror' at the Jeremy situation and the 'Ken' situation and wanted to get a reaction from Alex.

I sometimes wish Katie wouldn't react to Perez - because that is pretty much what he is aiming for.
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Old 03-02-2015, 16:14
bobbyd
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I think with this situation Katie most probably taking the approach 'what's good for the goose is good for the gander'. She most probably believed in giving people a taste of their own medicine. Whether she took it too far eventually? As in it became tired. Maybe. But it wasn't bullying because of the context. Perez encourage it and gave it out just as much.
That's the way I see it. She acted a part to mimic her view of Perez, but she really wasn't very adept at it. I don't think it sat well with her, she was awkward. There were many comments on here at the time about how she wasn't as intimidating as people thought before.
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Old 03-02-2015, 16:18
vald
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I'm behind the times re the forum so forgive me if I cover old ground but didn't Perez start this war of words with Katie Hopkins, he told everyone that didn't know her that she was the most hated person in Britain etc and then didn't he attack her first (quite aggressively) about her affair?
Didn't he then go on to pretty much alienate himself from everyone else with his constant childish attention seeking behaviour and using the rule book get people in to trouble with BB?
With that in mind isn't the best thing to do with a trouble making child ignore them and isn't that what she was saying to do?
I'm not defending Perez, because he is an ass, but KH is proud of these two facts and I'd imagine every person watching already knew, even if one or two HMs didn't.

I think if she'd stuck at making attacks on Perez that would have been fair enough, he deserved it, and lets face it they both enjoy it, but she didn't. She had to win and the only thing she could come up with was to demand his isolation (while following him around herself). IMO that is not the behaviour of a mature woman, it's straight out of the manual of playground bullying.

Strangely these two have done each other a favour...Perez has made her look better than she is, and she has made him look better than he is. And now we are left with two unpleasant people each getting 'the sympathy vote'. Whichever one wins will win because the other is disliked more.

I'd rather someone like Keith won but I fear the days of the good guy, who's kept his head in all this madness, winning are over.
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Old 03-02-2015, 16:18
Penny Crayon
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The Alicia thing was bordering on bullying. I almost agree. However, her opinion that Alicia seemed a little - lets say 'naive' was probably justified somewhat. And mostly she chatted to Alicia about it all - maybe pulling a few grimaces in the process. But Hopkins didn't go all out of her way to make fun of her. I think sometimes she was genuinely bamboozled by her lack of knowledge on certain things or her priorities with regards to her own body and perhaps working on some of these 'knowledge' issues.
You say naïve.

Hopkins chose to say thick - on a number of occasions.

There is no point in dressing it up. Hopkins was cruel and spiteful and poked fun at her lack of knowledge behind her back even though she 'always says it to your face'.
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Old 03-02-2015, 16:18
humpty dumpty
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Almost yes, they are as bad as each other. Maybe. Right? Perhaps not. But taken in the context of how things developed you can understand.

As I said, I think Katie H wanted to give Perez a run for his money - give him a little bit of his own medicine. Perez encouraged it. He wanted Katie to react. Just like he encouraged the 'horror' at the Jeremy situation and the 'Ken' situation and wanted to get a reaction from Alex.

I sometimes wish Katie wouldn't react to Perez - because that is pretty much what he is aiming for.
If its all about a reaction to Perez, why is she now encouraging her gang to leave the room that Katie P and Keith are in, badmouthing them behind their backs and sharing her 'game' plans with them? (the game is to leave the room whenever they are in it and she clearly wants her group to do the same).

Its nothing to do with reaction or 'giving people a run for their money'....its very similar to her behaviour with Perez - only difference Katie P and Keith have done nothing wrong. Perhaps one might concude that this whole isolating/ostracizing/encouraging others to ostracize/mocking them behind their backs is far more an indication of Katies mean spirited and cruel nature than Perezs annoying characteristics.
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Old 03-02-2015, 16:20
MargMck
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She didn't debate it. She called him a grumpy old bastard and immediately fled the room. This is what she does...attack and retreat. The same with all her rather unpleasant tweets, all done safely from a distance. Now if I saw her have a face to face debate with the Palestinians, the Muslims or ebola victims I might find some respect for her.
Yes, she likes to challenge, but from as safe a place as possible. In the house of course, it's hard to escape The Perez Show, but she builds safety in numbers, aided by henchwomen like Michelle. Isolating him is all part of that. A tactic now used against Pricey and Keith.
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Old 03-02-2015, 16:24
Jules_Thornley
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You say naïve.

Hopkins chose to say thick - on a number of occasions.

There is no point in dressing it up. Hopkins was cruel and spiteful and poked fun at her lack of knowledge behind her back even though she 'always says it to your face'.
Ha ha yes.. Thick.

But still, it was her opinion she was - and considering she came across a little naive about certain things perhaps Katie should be allowed to have that opinion.

The raising of eyebrows, and grimaces are all part of Katie's make up. I don't have a problem with that unless she didn't speak her opinion alongside.
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Old 03-02-2015, 16:24
planets
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Yes, she likes to challenge, but from as safe a place as possible. In the house of course, it's hard to escape The Perez Show, but she builds safety in numbers, aided by henchwomen like Michelle. Isolating him is all part of that. A tactic now used against Pricey and Keith.
i see her seed ideas then wind the keys in peoples backs kick it off then retreat and let everyone else do the shouting then after the event she can console and condemn for bonding purposes
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Old 03-02-2015, 16:26
Jules_Thornley
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If its all about a reaction to Perez, why is she now encouraging her gang to leave the room that Katie P and Keith are in, badmouthing them behind their backs and sharing her 'game' plans with them? (the game is to leave the room whenever they are in it and she clearly wants her group to do the same).

Its nothing to do with reaction or 'giving people a run for their money'....its very similar to her behaviour with Perez - only difference Katie P and Keith have done nothing wrong. Perhaps one might concude that this whole isolating/ostracizing/encouraging others to ostracize/mocking them behind their backs is far more an indication of Katies mean spirited and cruel nature than Perezs annoying characteristics.
I haven't really seen any evidence she is ostracising Katie P or Keith. Yes, she has said that she thinks Katie P hasn't been fiery etc and Keith has been grumpy etc..

Update me if I've missed something.
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Old 03-02-2015, 16:27
planets
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I haven't really seen any evidence she is ostracising Katie P or Keith. Yes, she has said that she thinks Katie P hasn't been fiery etc and Keith has been grumpy etc..

Update me if I've missed something.
there are whole threads with vts in from yesterday

eta HERE you go
more information becomes available as the thread moves on
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Old 03-02-2015, 16:27
leelee69
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They did. Paranoia was rife. They really did believe Perez's pronouncements that he called all the shots. That he would break them one by one. Katie herself didn't isolate him, she took him on - full on wrecking ball stylee.

Just my opinion
KH should have just refused to talk to Perez. Blanked him and removed herself from his influence. Telling others to isolate him was wrong. If the others got so fed up of him they did the same then fair play.
Perez is playing the irritant, attention seeking and trying to get a reaction, KH responding gives him what he wants. Ideally I'd like them both to go too far and both be evicted.
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Old 03-02-2015, 16:28
Jules_Thornley
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i see her seed ideas then wind the keys in peoples backs kick it off then retreat and let everyone else do the shouting then after the event she can console and condemn for bonding purposes
Nah. I really don't see this. She makes cutting remarks but is happy to defend those remarks. Openly.

Not saying I agree with those remarks from time to time.
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Old 03-02-2015, 16:29
planets
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Nah. I really don't see this. She makes cutting remarks but is happy to defend those remarks. Openly.

Not saying I agree with those remarks from time to time.
you can't be looking then
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Old 03-02-2015, 16:29
Jules_Thornley
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there's whole threads with vts in from yesterday

eta HERE you go
more information becomes available as the thread moves on
So we will see it tonight then?

Otherwise I just haven't seen her ostracising Keith/Katie P.
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Old 03-02-2015, 16:29
Moo_Chops
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sigh, I understand everyone's opinion that it is out and out bullying, but given the circumstances and his refusal to act in any other way, I would treat him in the exact same way..........

In the outside world KH is rightly taken to task, Inside this house Without a safe escape from the maniac Perez, you have to do what you must... defending in numbers and refusing him the opportunity to stir the pot (as muc as you can) prevents him repeating his rule book party tricks.

it's too bad that it is generally the perpetrators of actions that require defence from the natural conséquences. He cries foul for thingshe does himself!
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Old 03-02-2015, 16:30
MargMck
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I haven't really seen any evidence she is ostracising Katie P or Keith. Yes, she has said that she thinks Katie P hasn't been fiery etc and Keith has been grumpy etc..

Update me if I've missed something.
There has been vid on here of KH deliberately leaving rooms if they are in them and summonsing her crew to do the same. Then she celebrates with a little dance in the bedroom over leaving behind 'the bores'. Pricey clocked it and discussed it with Keith. Michelle complained to KH that she didn't want to be part of it, but KH was enjoying it.
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Old 03-02-2015, 16:30
Jules_Thornley
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you can't be looking then
Maybe I watched CBB with an open mind.. not looking for issues with Katie H ?
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Old 03-02-2015, 16:31
mmpfb
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Ha ha yes.. Thick.

But still, it was her opinion she was - and considering she came across a little naive about certain things perhaps Katie should be allowed to have that opinion.

The raising of eyebrows, and grimaces are all part of Katie's make up. I don't have a problem with that unless she didn't speak her opinion alongside.
Then she could have used the word naive, but she decided to go with the nastier and more hurtful option to score points.

Naivety and stupidity are two very different things. Alicia demonstrated on several occasions she arguably posses a lot more emotional intelligence than Hopkins, for example.
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Old 03-02-2015, 16:31
Jules_Thornley
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There has been vid on here of KH deliberately leaving rooms if they are in them and summonsing her crew to do the same. Then she celebrates with a little dance in the bedroom over leaving behind 'the bores'. Pricey clocked it and discussed it with Keith. Michelle complained to KH that she didn't want to be part of it, but KH was enjoying it.
I really haven't seen that one. I will have to go and have a look. So fair enough for now. If it happened like that then doesn't seem great on Katie H's behalf.
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Old 03-02-2015, 16:33
Jules_Thornley
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Then she could have used the word naive, but she decided to go with the nastier and more hurtful option to score points.

Naivety and stupidity are two very different things. Alicia demonstrated on several occasions she arguably posses a lot more emotional intelligence than Hopkins, for example.
Yes but I still don't think she was bullying.

I think many people probably have a higher emotional intelligence than Hopkins!

Generalisation there - but just an opinion and no I am not bullying Hopkins
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Old 03-02-2015, 16:34
mmpfb
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i see her seed ideas then wind the keys in peoples backs kick it off then retreat and let everyone else do the shouting then after the event she can console and condemn for bonding purposes
It amazes me people refuse to see this. It's interpersonal Divide & Conquer, effectively.
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Old 03-02-2015, 16:34
planets
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So we will see it tonight then?

Otherwise I just haven't seen her ostracising Keith/Katie P.
sadly i am not a producer so i have no idea if it will be shown, they might not show it at all if you had gone to the link i provided you with you would have seen her deploying her ostracising KP and Keith and then running giggling into the bedroom to tell Callum all about it ,,,,further on in the thread there is another vt where she is explaining this plan to Michelle.
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Old 03-02-2015, 16:35
Jules_Thornley
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It amazes me people refuse to see this. It's interpersonal Divide & Conquer, effectively.
I know of this..

But I do not believe that she does it. I think she voices her opinion - either hangs around for the debate - or walks off after moaning about something. That's about it. She will talk about it if people want to talk about it.
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