Shirley suggested Dean go to York which is where Carly is.

That's kind of what I was saying. There are only 2 people who know the truth but she is definitely uneasy about Dean's version of events and she has now allowed herself to consider that he may have done it, personally I think she does believe that he did infact do it though, when Mick called him a 'rapist' she didn't deny it, just countered that with the ticket and when Dean said to her about her believing him, she didn't say she did, when prior to this she would have backed him to Mick and to his face. And she was also uneasy about Dean spending time with Lola, someone she genuinely cares for...

I think she knows but I don't think she wants to verbalise it because that would make it real.

I agree.

Because she knew in her heart of hearts that Lola may have been in danger.

She's also trying to protect Dean - she realises that while he is in Walford, or even in Londn, he is very much in danger from Lee and Mick, and anything that raises his profile, like taking Lola to the Albert, increases that danger.

And that's new. Up 'til now she has been telling him not to hide, show his face, go back to work and don't run. Now she wants him to keep a low profile and in fact run.

Shirley has always had a good relationship with Lola. She was being cruel to be kind as she now has doubts about Dean. When she threatens to have Lexi taken away to hide a drug addiction then we can call her out on it.

Shirley's still in a difficult position with Dean firstly as his mum and because she feels an enormous amount of guilt for abandoning him (something that has been evident since 2007). This is what allows him to get inside her head and it's what stops her from turning on him. Her only thought process was getting him out of the square and what she perceives as immediate harm's way (finger pointing from the locals; the threat of attack from Mick & Dean) the ticket to York isn't something she had thought through properly.

The only way for her to look bad in sending him to Carly is if she's 100% convinced of Dean's guilt and has considered the possibility that he could harm Carly. Clearly neither of those things are the case.

I've said since it all started Shirley has known it was true. She just can't bring herself to turn against Dean because she has done time after time. She's weak, that's always been her.

I agree that Shirley's known Dean raped Linda since Mick first told her, and that she is going to such lengths to protect him and proclaim his innocence because of her own guilt. I don't think this necessarily makes her weak, but her guilt often negatively influences her actions in a BIG way.

I don't agree. It has sunk in bit by bit since she spoke to Linda, but it was her conversations with Dean that convinced her in the end. Mothers know when their children are lying, although you wouldn't have needed to be his mother to realise he was....the cop certainly picked up on it, not enough to prosecute him, but it was there in his face.

I don't think she has known all along. How could she? She didn't even speak to Linda initially, all she had to go on was a plausible story from Dean. It's only been since she's spoken to Linda (& Stacey) and Dean has provided a fuller account that we've seen her wavering. There's a reason why we now see her conflicted and didn't before.

Perhaps not weak in the conventional sense. But weak in that she hasn't got the strength to admit it fully to herself or others.

She has known since it was contested by Linda when they were both sat at the kitchen table. Can't remember it word for word but they had an exchange:
"I know my son"
"Do you?"
Shirley looked terrified.

Like others have said, Shirley was being cruel to be kind. I dislike Shirley a lot but I can understand why she did it. She does really care for Lola.

I think she's known the truth since she first heard given her reaction to Mick (stunned silence and the look of fear) when he told her. She also knows just how angry Dean is at women and at life in general, and she knows how violent he can be due to his attack on her just before he left Walford initially.

If Shirley had thought Mick's story was BS, she'd have shot him down (or tried) immediately. She clammed up because it immediately clicked that Dean capable and likely to have done it. When Shirley went to find Dean on Christmas Day, it was the beginnings of her attempt to convince herself otherwise. She succeeded, somewhat. It's become more and more evident to her over time that Dean actually did it, but Shirley's always known.

BIB She didn't shoot him down because for all she knew Dean may have done it and would admit to it. Once she'd heard his very plausible explanation she believed him, telling him not to hide, not to run. Now we see telling him to keep his head down and even run....this proves that she no longer believes him. Her realisation has been gradual.

Just because Dean has been violent towards her in the past it doesn't follow that he would end up raping someone. She probably felt she deserved it for being a rotten mother.

I agree with you, Vald.

Her realization of what Dean has done has been gradual, she didn't know at the beginning.

It's completely plausible to me either way, but I still think Shirley has known all along and she's fought so hard to proclaim Dean's innocence because she's desperately wanted it not to be true. In my mind, Shirley is telling Dean to leave now because she's finally acknowledged to herself that he is guilty and because she's scared that one of Linda's supporters will go for vigilante justice.

Regardless of what Shirley knew when, I think her motivations have been the same. She wants to support Dean because she's been such a crap mother before, and because she feels guilty for her perceived role in the situation.

It may be plausible, but it's not what we've seen playing out. We've seen doubts creeping in gradually until she no longer believes Dean. If they wanted to show her doubting him all along then we'd have been shown that, at least in her private moments.

Like I said, I can see your points about Shirley gradually realizing Dean is guilty. I just don't see it that way.

Fair enough But we can only decide on what we see.

I just think Shirley didn't want her at any risk at all

I asked one of the writers and apparently Shirley suspects but is torn. So she has gone from adamantly defending and believing Dean, to wavering on his innocence, the next stage will be for her to fully realise/accept the truth.

We can easily comment because we know what happened but if they hadn't shown the rape and we didn't know either, we would probably find it difficult to know which side to come down on.

Thanks for that Eliie. I must admit I was confused last night because I thought she was 100% there already.

No problem. I wasn't 100% so I thought I would ask but apparently she is wavering between the two and is torn. She doesn't believe him but she doesn't disbelieve him either.

It's going to be tough for her when it comes out, just hope it is sooner rather than later..

I'm quite enjoying watching Shirley being conflicted. I think it is her best s/l to date.

She did managed to surprise me last night though. I thought she'd give up and hit the vodka after her row with Mick. Instead we got 'I'm you're muvva, get used to it' or WTTE..I thought it was magnificent.