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Old 30-03-2015, 09:18
chrisy
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Which, being translated, means that the space has been taken by the Horror Channel.
Only the SD space. The HD space looks like it is going to be taken over by QVC.
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Old 30-03-2015, 09:40
jimbo
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Only the SD space. The HD space looks like it is going to be taken over by QVC.
Sorry if this is in the wrong place but are you saying the QVC is moving to COM 7 and if so, when?
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Old 30-03-2015, 10:53
chrisy
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Sorry if this is in the wrong place but are you saying the QVC is moving to COM 7 and if so, when?
No, I'm saying QVC HD looks like it's on the agenda.
http://www.ofcom.org.uk/static/radio...3ba6qvc1hd.htm

Although I'm not sure why it's a +1...!
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Old 30-03-2015, 10:54
Mickey_T
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He seems to be implying that QVC is going HD on Com7

As to when, I have no idea, and frankly nor do I care!
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Old 30-03-2015, 20:28
Colin_London
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No, I'm saying QVC HD looks like it's on the agenda.
http://www.ofcom.org.uk/static/radio...3ba6qvc1hd.htm

Although I'm not sure why it's a +1...!
Well my wife is thrilled by this prospect. Can't say I am as enthused
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Old 21-07-2015, 11:22
Sexbomb
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Has there been a change in something here, my tv scanned it this morning as a new ch on 63 and another on 800.
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Old 21-07-2015, 11:31
chrisy
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Has there been a change in something here, my tv scanned it this morning as a new ch on 63 and another on 800.
Looks like it has just moved back to COM5.
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Old 21-07-2015, 21:04
chrisy
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Looks like it has just moved back to COM5.
The PQ has taken a dive, and Dave is looking worse too.
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Old 22-07-2015, 10:14
clewsy
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Yes the PQ looks bad on Really as well - is that on the same multiplex? If they can get 15 streams out of the DVB format then does that mean 30 is going to be possible from DVB T2?

I wonder what is going to have the Com 7 space?
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Old 22-07-2015, 10:36
ntscuser
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The PQ has taken a dive, and Dave is looking worse too.
I was going to ask where the space is coming from but you appear to have answered me already?
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Old 22-07-2015, 11:37
lotrjw
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Yes the PQ looks bad on Really as well - is that on the same multiplex? If they can get 15 streams out of the DVB format then does that mean 30 is going to be possible from DVB T2?

I wonder what is going to have the Com 7 space?
Remember that there is about 16Mbps more space on a DVB-T2 MUX then on a DVB-T MUX, so by my reckoning they could squeeze 48-49 SD channels at the same compression rate but in MPEG4/AVC/h.264.
That is a net gain of 18-19 more due to the extra space! In fact because of the fact you get twice as much the gross gain is 33-34 more channels than the current 15 they are squeezing onto the DVB-T!

This is hypothetical of course as it might be a while before broadcasters consider actually doing things like this! They are likely going to leave it better quality for a while until DSO 2 to entice people to upgrade.
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Old 22-07-2015, 13:09
AngusMast
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This channel has moved so many times, maybe it's aimed at the Traveller Community.
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Old 22-07-2015, 14:07
clewsy
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And with the constant improving compression methods who is to say we stop there? T2 will deffo see more new compression methods before the time comes so just imagine how many channels in theory could be possible. I guess at least the cost to get on freeview must be falling now?

Also doesn't this channel get the space free ? Could this be like a tester channel and then this space will be later farmed out to this new channel that is rumoured to launch?

Also who is going to want that com 7 space? Maybe one of the broadcasters on a local scale at the moment looking to do a motors TV and get a bit wider scale?
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Old 22-07-2015, 14:48
chrisy
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Yes the PQ looks bad on Really as well - is that on the same multiplex?
Yes, it is.
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Old 22-07-2015, 16:03
kev
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Remember that there is about 16Mbps more space on a DVB-T2 MUX then on a DVB-T MUX, so by my reckoning they could squeeze 48-49 SD channels at the same compression rate but in MPEG4/AVC/h.264.
That is a net gain of 18-19 more due to the extra space! In fact because of the fact you get twice as much the gross gain is 33-34 more channels than the current 15 they are squeezing onto the DVB-T!

This is hypothetical of course as it might be a while before broadcasters consider actually doing things like this! They are likely going to leave it better quality for a while until DSO 2 to entice people to upgrade.
Remember when DSO2 comes there will be fewer multiplexes available (IIRC 5+Local) so there will be reduced capacity.

Some will be cancelled out by the lack of a need to simulcast (i.e. only one BBC ONE),

IIRC Ofcom are predicting 8 HD channels by DSO 2, so (for example) you could have the following

MUX1 : BBC ONE HD, BBC TWO HD, CBBC HD / BBC Red Button 2 HD, BBC Red Button 3 / BBC FOUR HD, BBC News HD, CBeebies HD / BBC Red Button 4 HD, BBC Red Button (HD in England, SD in Scotland/Wales), S4C/BBC Alba and BBC Radio

MUX2: ITV 1 HD, ITV 2 HD, ITV 3 HD, ITV 4 HD, Channel 4 HD, Film Four HD, More 4 HD, E4 HD

MUX3 : Five HD, 5USA HD, 5* HD, All SD Services from SDN, All SD Services from Multiplex 2, All SD Services from COM 4

MUX4: All SD Services from COM 5, COM6, COM7 and a few new channels

MUX5: COM8

(Obviously there are many other permutations in that - e.g. more SD channels from ITV would give Freeview Lite even more services, and inevitably some channels would move around)
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Old 22-07-2015, 17:01
eladkse
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MUX1 : BBC ONE HD, BBC TWO HD, CBBC HD / BBC Red Button 2 HD, BBC Red Button 3 / BBC FOUR HD, BBC News HD, CBeebies HD / BBC Red Button 4 HD, BBC Red Button (HD in England, SD in Scotland/Wales), S4C/BBC Alba and BBC Radio

MUX2: ITV 1 HD, ITV 2 HD, ITV 3 HD, ITV 4 HD, Channel 4 HD, Film Four HD, More 4 HD, E4 HD

MUX3 : Five HD, 5USA HD, 5* HD, All SD Services from SDN, All SD Services from Multiplex 2, All SD Services from COM 4

MUX4: All SD Services from COM 5, COM6, COM7 and a few new channels

MUX5: COM8
Not to get drawn too much into discussion hypothetical arrangements, but why do you have four Red Button channels timesharing with the main services? Surely two full-time channels would make more sense (assuming the space had to be used).

Pigs will fly the day ITV and Five provide HD outside of PSB. Five doesn't even do it for PSB yet. (Channel 4 I could reasonably see doing given their current track record.)
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Old 22-07-2015, 18:10
a516
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In the meantime, there is the issue of what's going to fill the Community Channel downtime of 01:00 to 11:00 (there must be something about to happen for Arqiva to have cut the hours with the move) and then there's also a 12 hour slot on Arq B from 00:00-12:00 - the BT Sport Showcase downtime. And is something about to fill COM7?
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Old 22-07-2015, 18:10
ntscuser
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And with the constant improving compression methods who is to say we stop there? T2 will deffo see more new compression methods before the time comes so just imagine how many channels in theory could be possible.
I presume you mean DSO2?

My guess is that compression methods will be restricted to what existing T2 receivers can handle. Mine for example can't do H265. It would be politically unacceptable to make any existing T2 receiver obsolete.
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Old 22-07-2015, 18:26
chrisy
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And is something about to fill COM7?
Moving Community back gives enough space for an HD channel on COM7, doesn't it? (it previously had Community HD and I think SD channels are back to the same level). Although I don't really get the point of the jiggery-pokery when there's plenty of space on COM8.

Hmm, when are C5 rebranding? Would be a good time to launch in HD...
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Old 22-07-2015, 19:41
lotrjw
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Remember when DSO2 comes there will be fewer multiplexes available (IIRC 5+Local) so there will be reduced capacity.

Some will be cancelled out by the lack of a need to simulcast (i.e. only one BBC ONE),

IIRC Ofcom are predicting 8 HD channels by DSO 2, so (for example) you could have the following

MUX1 : BBC ONE HD, BBC TWO HD, CBBC HD / BBC Red Button 2 HD, BBC Red Button 3 / BBC FOUR HD, BBC News HD, CBeebies HD / BBC Red Button 4 HD, BBC Red Button (HD in England, SD in Scotland/Wales), S4C/BBC Alba and BBC Radio

MUX2: ITV 1 HD, ITV 2 HD, ITV 3 HD, ITV 4 HD, Channel 4 HD, Film Four HD, More 4 HD, E4 HD

MUX3 : Five HD, 5USA HD, 5* HD, All SD Services from SDN, All SD Services from Multiplex 2, All SD Services from COM 4

MUX4: All SD Services from COM 5, COM6, COM7 and a few new channels

MUX5: COM8

(Obviously there are many other permutations in that - e.g. more SD channels from ITV would give Freeview Lite even more services, and inevitably some channels would move around)
I would have said that the plan is for 6 MUXs come DSO 2 1 regional one including:
BBC 1 HD (fully rationalised)
BBC 2 HD
ITV HD (fully rationalised)
Channel 4 HD
Channel 5 HD
BBC radios
BBC Alba/S4C/(possibly local TV if they regionalise the MUX right down) in HD
BBC News HD
BBC Parliament HD
The last two might be replaced by other regional services if there is any.

Then 5 single frequency networked national MUXs:

1 BBC MUX (likely what was BBC B) including channels such as:
BBC 4 HD/Cbeebies HD
CBBC HD
BBC RB 1 HD
Community channel HD
Then either 3 other HD channels or up to 15 SD channels (which may include extra temporary BBC red button feeds )

An ITV/C4 MUX that will likely replace D3&4 with channels such as:
Channel 4 + 1 HD
4Severn HD
E4 HD
More 4 HD
Film 4 HD
ITV +1 HD (possibly SD)
ITV 2 SD
ITV 3 SD
ITV 4 SD
CITV SD

Then 3 COM MUXs with all other channels up to 147 between them.

If however there is only 5 MUXs then one COM MUX will likely go, meaning there could still be about 18 HD channels and up to 166 SD with 6 MUXs or 117 SD channels with 5 MUXs
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Old 22-07-2015, 19:46
lotrjw
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I presume you mean DSO2?

My guess is that compression methods will be restricted to what existing T2 receivers can handle. Mine for example can't do H265. It would be politically unacceptable to make any existing T2 receiver obsolete.
H.265 might happen if UHD1 phase 2 actually comes to DTT though!
It could also happen later in 2020something for SD and HD channels too but not immediately after DSO 2. By that time DVB-T2 capable receives might well be sold that could decode H.265.
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Old 22-07-2015, 20:07
kev
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Not to get drawn too much into discussion hypothetical arrangements, but why do you have four Red Button channels timesharing with the main services? Surely two full-time channels would make more sense (assuming the space had to be used).

Pigs will fly the day ITV and Five provide HD outside of PSB. Five doesn't even do it for PSB yet. (Channel 4 I could reasonably see doing given their current track record.)
Allows extension to BBC 4 and Cbeebies hours.
Of course I forgot BBC Parliament...
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Old 22-07-2015, 21:41
clewsy
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It interesting though as that space is being freed up for something.
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Old 27-07-2015, 13:45
DragonQ
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8 HD channels in 40 Mb/s using AVC is a joke, I don't care what Ofcom says.

By the way, is there a more up-to-date version of a516's Freeview multiplex guide (http://www.a516digital.com/2014/11/d...y-guide.html)?
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Old 27-07-2015, 14:11
jimbo
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8 HD channels in 40 Mb/s using AVC is a joke, I don't care what Ofcom says.

By the way, is there a more up-to-date version of a516's Freeview multiplex guide (http://www.a516digital.com/2014/11/d...y-guide.html)?
Not yet - and not trying to give this as a replacement but I am putting together a spreadsheet. I notice by the way that it is not as simple as that list you refer to makes out because the PIDs are different for some channels - even for those listed as time-sharing capacity.

It is rather complicated but I will sort something in the next week or so. I will let you know when it is ready.
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