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The ‘FM death watch' thread...


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Old 01-11-2015, 11:31
MikeBr
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I think Matt is referring to broadcast digital, ie DAB or DRM (rather than internet radio), a group of 80 small commercial stations complained about a forced DSO. And the Radiocentre has finally now acknowledged FM will still have a future, but where most listening will be on DAB (or internet) but for most DAB/FM sets they will be on DAB mode so will rarely be switched to FM mode so the stations remaining on FM might be at a disadvantage. The DRWG suggested a single station list where FM is included in the scan.
No he's not, he's quoting a 41.8% share of listening and stating that means any station not on a digital platform is losing 60% of "the market". It's not comparing like with like. There will be stations in that 41.8% share that are listened to at home on DAB and in the car on FM or AM.

You can overstate the argument that a DAB set will always be in DAB mode. If a local/community station anywhere in the world is on FM only terrestrially people will listen to it if they want to hear the content. I don't see how these commercial stations complaining are suddenly going to lose all their audience overnight if/when the larger stations switch to DAB for terrestrial broadcasts. Where they might lose out is not having the publicity budget the stations intending to switch over to DAB will have. The same argument applies to smaller stations on DAB. Not everyone is constantly flicking through the DAB channels for new stations. DAB household ownership is 53.7% but that doesn't mean that all the available radios in the house/car are DAB. The radio audience is primarily driven by content not platform.
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Old 01-11-2015, 12:55
Vectorsum
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No he's not, he's quoting a 41.8% share of listening and stating that means any station not on a digital platform is losing 60% of "the market". It's not comparing like with like. There will be stations in that 41.8% share that are listened to at home on DAB and in the car on FM or AM...
Not that I feel any particular urge to support any of Matt Degan's points, his argument works better if you insert the word 'advertising' before 'market'.

Your argument is about potential audience/listenership which as you correctly point out will still be a potential 'market' for FM as long as the set used to listen still has the FM waveband. However if I were an advertiser, I'd be inclined to use the 41% and rising share as a big stick to beat down the FM-only station salesman when he comes calling to sell advertising spots.

In the big picture, arguing the toss about digital share, and DAB/+ share of digital is academic. There was probably a point in the 80s or early 90s when the last vehicle was sold in the UK with a non-FM, i.e. MW/LW only tuner. DAB's milestone is something like setting a target date in the late 10s for the last vehicle to be sold without a DAB tuner, my money would be on 2018.

It's conflating arguments (and threads) somewhat, but whether the 'small-commercial-and-community' future for FM comes to pass probably depends on the success or failure of the current minimux trials. If successful and, crucially, cost effective FM's future is probably only for the smallest community stations after DSO.
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Old 01-11-2015, 16:57
anthony david
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So people who have no interest in listening to the commercial stations have to have the display on their radio cluttered up with a load of stations they are never going to listen to? Or will there be an option to hide stations as with TV though it can be a real pain getting rid of all the clutter there.
No, you put the stations you want into presets, on my Honda there are separate preset lists for DAB, FM, AM (MW) and LW. You only see all the stations on DAB if you select "All Ensembles" in the DAB menu.
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Old 12-01-2016, 14:29
DigMorris
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Dutch radio media report that Bauer has switched off the FM transmissions for Kiss and Radio Rock in Norway. They have now become digital-only stations, well before the official DSO in 2017.

Although changes were expected, the timing was a bit sooner than many expected. It will probably be a cost saving measure they can get away with considering analogue radio listening now has a minority share.
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Old 12-01-2016, 14:51
swb1964
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Interestingly going DAB only allows them to drop local programming requirements (google translate of first link from above post)

"What also plays a role is that Bauer Media substantial money saved by stopping the broadcasts of Radio Rock and Kiss FM. Not only in transmission costs, but also to costs for programs. FM had two radio stations namely to broadcast local programs in each city. Via DAB + is broadcast just one national program."
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Old 30-04-2016, 09:16
hanssolo
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Similar to The 'AM death watch' thread, which tracks the switching off of AM broadcasts across Europe, let’s have a thread about the gradual disappearance of FM. LW is almost gone in Europe, AM is following in its footsteps, FM -with its declining listenership- will be next.

Norway
Most notable is the situation in Norway. The majority of radio listening is now digital and as of October the majority of households now own a DAB+ set. With over 90% coverage (and 99.5% for the public broadcaster) it exceeds the switchover requirements and exceeds FM coverage. Considering the FM shutdown requirements are met it is expected that this year the minister will decide that the national FM networks will be switched off in 2017. That would make Norway the first country to abandon using FM for national radio in favour of DAB+. Earlier this year they started putting warning stickers on FM radios in stores to warn people that FM receivers can only be used for local broadcasts in the near future.

Switzerland
Switzerland is probably the world’s most successful DAB country where DAB+ share of listening has grown to 30% within just 5 years. Last year the government has recently decided that from 1 January this year commercial radiostations are allowed to stop broadcasting on FM if their DAB+ coverage meets their current FM coverage. Radio stations had requested this to give them more flexibility to devise their broadcast strategies around actual demand. The current roadmap suggests to switch off the last FM transmitter in 2024.
Looks like Norway are still on track to switch the first of 6 national FM networks in January 2017 despite an ESA complaint!
http://digitalradioinsider.blogspot....close-dab.html
Bjørgan points out that complaints relating to possible unlawful state aid can be passed on directly to the EFTA Court, even if the ESA does not consider the case to be sufficiently serious. Deputy Director at NRK Øyvind Vasaasen says to Dagens Næringsliv that he considers a ESA complaint as a serious issue, but that the plan to close the FM network still is in order.
http://radio.no/2015/04/norway-to-sw...ff-fm-in-2017/

noticed an update on Wohnort
April 29th
In Switzerland, the public-service broadcaster SRG/SSR will end the parallel broadcasting of the last remaining services to use both DAB+ and "original-flavour" DAB on November 15th. From that date, the released capacity will be used to make each language region's third radio network available in DAB+ throughout Switzerland - SRF 3, Couleur 3 and Rete Tre. The complete switch-over from DAB to DAB+ has taken ten years. According to the broadcaster, if all goes according to plan, Switzerland will begin, progressively, to decommission its FM networks beginning 2020.
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Old 30-04-2016, 12:10
Glenn A
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Most car radios are still analogue, and you can still buy cheap analogue radios, so I can't see FM being wound down for several years. What will probably happen is the BBC will move a popular network like Radio 1 to DAB only in a bid to improve digital take up. I'd imagine once DAB's market share reaches 60 per cent, possibly by the end of the decade, the BBC will start moving its music stations across.
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Old 17-05-2016, 08:54
MikeBr
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Flanders is targeting a switchover to DAB+ and closure of FM when 50% of listening is digital.
http://www.telecompaper.com/news/fla...years--1143530

This is the original report
http://www.standaard.be/cnt/dmf20160513_02287697

Google translate says he wants to switch national channels off FM two years after the 50% digital listening threshold is reached. Not clear about the plan for local and "rural" radios.
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Old 18-05-2016, 05:26
buglawton
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Does anyone agree with me, that the inability of the UK to take up DAB+ is the single biggest reason holding up a popular migration from FM to DAB?
I for one have no interest in DAB for car or serious portable listening on a personal DAB radio so long as so many key stations are in low bitrate mono. My favourite car/personal sources are now BBC iPlayer Radio downloads.

At the moment DAB's only fit for purpose for the kitchen and bedside radio alarm.
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Old 18-05-2016, 10:27
derk weasel
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my problem with in car is that the coverage is not as good as fm and is patchy to say the least and not everyone can afford to just chuck 50 odd quid at a in car adapter and the sound quality is pretty poor.
admittedly i do have a dab radio at home but the only way i will go for in car is if its dab+ and the price comes down
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Old 18-05-2016, 10:41
Vince800
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my problem with in car is that the coverage is not as good as fm and is patchy to say the least and not everyone can afford to just chuck 50 odd quid at a in car adapter and the sound quality is pretty poor.
admittedly i do have a dab radio at home but the only way i will go for in car is if its dab+ and the price comes down
You have got to be joking! Around here FM is next to useless unless you want to listen to BBC 3CR or Heart all the time. DAB is perfect on all muxes which are receivable. Perhaps the problem is those adaptors & rubbish stick on aerials. A proper DAB radio with an external aerial is absolutely perfect when driving around.

Your profile there says you're near Peterborough, I've experienced no problems with DAB travelling around Cambridgeshire.
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Old 18-05-2016, 10:50
derk weasel
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You have got to be joking! Around here FM is next to useless unless you want to listen to BBC 3CR or Heart all the time. DAB is perfect on all muxes which are receivable. Perhaps the problem is those adaptors & rubbish stick on aerials. A proper DAB radio with an external aerial is absolutely perfect when driving around.

Your profile there says you're near Peterborough, I've experienced no problems with DAB travelling around Cambridgeshire.
around my area its not too bad but i do travel alot and thats when fm comes into its own when dab fails.

i maybe wrong but their aint much else apart from 3cr and heart as well as a few ultra local stations in hearts?

not sure where in hearts you are but when i travel to and from london i never seem to have any probs with fm at all, maybe i have a good fm system and decent antenna in my car then? no probs with 3cr, bob or vibe. dont care about heart as tbh i cant stand it.
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Old 18-05-2016, 10:53
Vince800
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around my area its not too bad but i do travel alot and thats when fm comes into its own when dab fails.

i maybe wrong but their aint much else apart from 3cr and heart as well as a few ultra local stations in hearts?

not sure where in hearts you are but when i travel to and from london i never seem to have any probs with fm at all, maybe i have a good fm system and decent antenna in my car then? no probs with 3cr, bob or vibe. dont care about heart as tbh i cant stand it.
Parts of Hertfordshire have issues with FM due to the hills. There are parts where you can get the BBC Nationals from Wrotham, Crystal Palace, Oxford & Bow Brickhall. All receivable but none good enough for consistent interference free reception for more than a few seconds.
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Old 18-05-2016, 23:04
MikeBr
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The French speaking part of Belgium has now allocated 5.4 million euros for the introduction of DAB+ in 2017.
https://www.worlddab.org/news/6218/b...-digital-radio
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Old 18-05-2016, 23:45
hanssolo
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Does anyone agree with me, that the inability of the UK to take up DAB+ is the single biggest reason holding up a popular migration from FM to DAB?
I for one have no interest in DAB for car or serious portable listening on a personal DAB radio so long as so many key stations are in low bitrate mono.
But most FM transmissions R1,2,3 and 4, Classic FM, Heart, Capital, Smooth and Bauer's City network are also on Stereo DAB at 128k (192k r3) and sounding good. DAB listening is growing and FM declining, going DAB+ is currently not important for these stations.
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Old 18-05-2016, 23:53
lundavra
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But most FM transmissions R1,2,3 and 4, Classic FM, Heart, Capital, Smooth and Bauer's City network are also on Stereo DAB at 128k (192k r3) and sounding good. DAB listening is growing and FM declining, going DAB+ is currently not important for these stations.
I suspect that a large proportion of listeners have never heard of DAB+.
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Old 19-05-2016, 05:59
hanssolo
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I suspect that a large proportion of listeners have never heard of DAB+.
At least now the UK has 3 national DAB+ stations, Jazz FM now has over a million listeners which will help DAB+ take-up.
Magic Chilled and Fun Kids, (plus Chris Country in some places) will grow by word of mouth.

http://radiotoday.co.uk/2016/05/raja...6-infographic/
Digital listening is now 44.1% with DAB 70% of the total, so the UK is getting close to the 50% figure when a radio FM/AM switchoff date for main stations can be announced.
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Old 19-05-2016, 13:25
derk weasel
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i think they should just set a date and tell the stations (apart from local community stations) that they got until this date (example 01/01/2020) to switch all your services over to dab. if any of your stations are receivable on FM after this date you will be fined and have your broadcast license revoked.
put a bit of pressure on the stations and their owners and they will no doubt follow suit.
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Old 19-05-2016, 14:15
hanssolo
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i think they should just set a date and tell the stations (apart from local community stations) that they got until this date (example 01/01/2020) to switch all your services over to dab. if any of your stations are receivable on FM after this date you will be fined and have your broadcast license revoked.
put a bit of pressure on the stations and their owners and they will no doubt follow suit.
The Government has said it must be listener lead so until digital listening goes over 50% no dates can be set, they could follow Norway to get warning labels put on new analogue only radio sets (and there are a lot on sale) to say they may not get all stations in the future.
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Old 19-05-2016, 14:48
derk weasel
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The Government has said it must be listener lead so until digital listening goes over 50% no dates can be set, they could follow Norway to get warning labels put on new analogue only radio sets (and there are a lot on sale) to say they may not get all stations in the future.
so global and the rest can just drag their heels over it and it could take years. better to get a date in now so everyone in the radio industry has a date to work to and the public know they got untill a set date to replace all their audio radio equipment thats analogue
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Old 20-05-2016, 10:23
DigMorris
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The Government has said it must be listener lead so until digital listening goes over 50% no dates can be set, they could follow Norway to get warning labels put on new analogue only radio sets (and there are a lot on sale) to say they may not get all stations in the future.
As Matt Deegan writes in response to the latest RAJARs:
But that 44.1% is still yet to included any digital audience boost from the addition of the new D2 stations and Heart Extra – we’ll find out about those in the next quarter. Suddenly that 50% digital listening mark doesn’t seem that far away!

Hitting that target kicks off a load of discussion for the plans to transition off analogue radio. Indeed, in the BBC White Paper the Government have mandated that the BBC will help lead that process.

http://www.mattdeegan.com/2016/05/18...les-listeners/
digital radio listening has jumped quite a bit to 44.1% in the first quarter of 2016 and that doesn't include the expected increase in digital listening since the launch of Digital 2.

I would be very surprised if analogue listening in the UK is still above 50% by the end of the year. As soon as it has dropped to a minority we'll see more movement towards moving away from FM.

As I've said before, I expect a "soft DSO" to happen irrespective of any "hard DSO". Stations will simply do the sums and notice that it becomes less interesting to keep spending the bulk of their distribution budget on a method that attracts less than half of their listeners. This could mean some stations decide to go digital-only with a relatively small impact on their audience figures.
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Old 20-05-2016, 14:39
Vectorsum
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...Stations will simply do the sums and notice that it becomes less interesting to keep spending the bulk of their distribution budget on a method that attracts less than half of their listeners. This could mean some stations decide to go digital-only with a relatively small impact on their audience figures.
The equation is probably more favourable to DAB than 50%, which is the DCMS DSO announcement threshold. You're assuming that a station switching off FM means the OPEX is saved, but the revenue-per-pop in the FM listening area is lost. In reality many FM listeners will be in the joint coverage area and able to switch to listening on digital, at a higher revenue-per-pop due to DAB's lower distribution costs.
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Old 20-05-2016, 15:38
Tony Richards
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i think they should just set a date and tell the stations (apart from local community stations) that they got until this date (example 01/01/2020) to switch all your services over to dab. if any of your stations are receivable on FM after this date you will be fined and have your broadcast license revoked.
put a bit of pressure on the stations and their owners and they will no doubt follow suit.
Harsh but I do agree. AM should go a year earlier. There is an incredible waste of resources in the duplication of platforms in the UK. Some BBC stations are on AM, FM, DAB, Freeview, Freesat, Sky, Virgin and on line and some commercials almost as bad. Surely this is not necessary? There should be a ban on marketing radios not carrying DAB+ as we need to improve DAB quality as soon as possible by going DAB+.
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Old 21-05-2016, 10:16
derk weasel
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Harsh but I do agree. AM should go a year earlier. There is an incredible waste of resources in the duplication of platforms in the UK. Some BBC stations are on AM, FM, DAB, Freeview, Freesat, Sky, Virgin and on line and some commercials almost as bad. Surely this is not necessary? There should be a ban on marketing radios not carrying DAB+ as we need to improve DAB quality as soon as possible by going DAB+.
the selling of radios with AM and FM should be fazed out along with DAB only radios. the selling of DAB+ radios should be pushed as they can also receive original DAB as well as in the end more stations can be pushed onto a mux on DAB+ so the mux operaters will see pound signs in moving to DAB+ as if they get more stations on their mux they get more money.
to be honest i cant see the point of having radio on freesat, sky and virgin but freeview should be just left to have the bbc nationals on there to pick up the slack where DAB and DAB+ still cannot reach.
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Old 21-05-2016, 11:54
DigMorris
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The equation is probably more favourable to DAB than 50%, which is the DCMS DSO announcement threshold. You're assuming that a station switching off FM means the OPEX is saved, but the revenue-per-pop in the FM listening area is lost. In reality many FM listeners will be in the joint coverage area and able to switch to listening on digital, at a higher revenue-per-pop due to DAB's lower distribution costs.
Fair point. There are likely a fair amount of listeners who currently listen to FM who could just as easily switch to another form of listening to the same station with a simple press of a button.
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