[danbassy]

Telefonica finalises £10bn sale of O2 mobile phone firm
http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/business-32043874

[jchamier]

Quote:

Originally Posted by danbassy

Telefonica finalises £10bn sale of O2 mobile phone firm
http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/business-32043874

Not "done" at all there is now a year (or more) of legals and regulator agreement. However the plan is going ahead.

[Richard_T]

Could be a worrying 12 months or so for O2 and Three employees alike

[hybridtheory]

Hi

How long did it take for the Three and o2 Ireland takeover to go through?

Thanks

Baz

[Thine Wonk]

Quote:

Originally Posted by hybridtheory

Hi

How long did it take for the Three and o2 Ireland takeover to go through?

Thanks

Baz

A while, but this one is going to take longer as the competition concerns are bigger. I would say March 2016 and we'll be at the stage where roaming might be enabled cross network and we'll start to see the networks come together.

Hutchison say they'll keep both Cornerstone / O2's network and Three MBNL live too, although they will almost certainly pool the transmission and allow cross network access.

I strongly suspect the O2 brand will die as although the stronger, is an old Telefonica brand which is dying out due to the Europe wide sale of assets. I should imagine a year from now all O2 users will be moved over to have Three displayed, and there will be a big brand push to reposition Three, rebranding of the arena, big national campaign etc.

Just think a year or 18 months from now you'll do a network search and you'll see:

Vodafone UK
Three UK
BT Mobile UK

I called it on the BT Mobile naming too, people said that the word mobile was old and that it would be called something else, but they are going ahead with BT Mobile.

[Richard_T]

from what i can gather the first real changes in Ireland were the change of sponsor logo on the Rugby team shirts, closely followed by the Dublin O2 becoming the Three Arena Dublin.
only within the last few motnhs has O2 Ireland disappeared - not sure whats happened on the high street - although in the UK there does appear to be an over saturation of phone shops.
I would expect to see the smaller/less profitable O2 and Three stores to close, hopefuly there may be a re design of the three stores as the current ones with the round display tables and LCD display screens are terrible

[plymouthbloke1974]

O2 customers will finally get a proper HSPA+ service on 3G... Although Hutchison may have to spend to boost network capacity...

[tghe-retford]

Quote:

Originally Posted by plymouthbloke1974

Although Hutchison may have to spend to boost network capacity...

That's going to mean more price hikes and/or the abolition of AYCE in the future. Which is going to leave us with a choice of:

- A network operator offering an expensive tariff with minimal data allowance;
- A network operator offering an expensive tariff with minimal data allowance;
- A network operator offering an expensive tariff with minimal data allowance;
- A MVNO offering an expensive tariff with minimal data allowance;
- A MVNO offering an expensive tariff with minimal data allowance;
- A MVNO offering an expensive tariff with minimal data allowance;
- A MVNO offering an expensive tariff with minimal data allowance;
or;
- A MVNO offering an expensive tariff with minimal data allowance.

[Dan Sette]

In reverse could this mean that 3 customers will have access to visual voicemail?

[Thine Wonk]

Quote:

Originally Posted by plymouthbloke1974

O2 customers will finally get a proper HSPA+ service on 3G... Although Hutchison may have to spend to boost network capacity...

It is perfect actually.

Three will get 2G backup
O2 will get really good 3G
Three will get the expansion of 4G coverage
The best of both worlds in terms of MBNL / Cornerstone, both will be kept with no plans to shut of masts so they say

They aren't buying the quadplay argument that BT and Vodafone are betting on, many analysts also agree it isn't what it's cracked up to be, only 6% of Virgin Media customers take all services and they haven't managed to push mobile heavily despite the Virgin Mobile brand being big.

[jaffboy151]

2 networks creeking at the seams for very different reasons destined to join together... Somethings got to give.. Major investment or major data scale back surely?

[enapace]

Think we all knew this was happening. It will be interesting to see if the EU Commission decides this is a good idea or not.

[Thine Wonk]

Quote:

Originally Posted by jaffboy151

2 networks creeking at the seams for very different reasons destined to join together... Somethings got to give.. Major investment or major data scale back surely?

Another one of your joke posts I see...

[jchamier]

Quote:

Originally Posted by Thine Wonk

I called it on the BT Mobile naming too, people said that the word mobile was old and that it would be called something else, but they are going ahead with BT Mobile.

but that's as an MVNO isn't it? The EE acquisition team is probably still deciding what they'll rebrand that as. No guarantees that BT Mobile customers will be merged as they may want to run multiple brands/tariffs. (Kinda like O2 running GiffGaff)

[sethpet]

Interesting decision for three coming up.

Do they

A) piss off the legacy three customers by making their tariffs far more expensive and lose AYCE data

Or

B) devalue the asset they have purchased by bringing O2 customers down to the Three tariff plans of cheaper line rental and AYCE

[Thine Wonk]

Quote:

Originally Posted by jchamier

but that's as an MVNO isn't it? The EE acquisition team is probably still deciding what they'll rebrand that as. No guarantees that BT Mobile customers will be merged as they may want to run multiple brands/tariffs. (Kinda like O2 running GiffGaff)

The MVNO is to get them up and running under a wholesale agreement, it is a new brand and setup, it is designed to begin to get them up and running in time for when the regulators approve the EE sale. They won't re-brand again, this plan has been long running.

http://www.uswitch.com/broadband/new...th_bt_mobile_/

Quote:

BT is expected to announce its return to the UK mobile sector this week, by launching its own 4G network.

The broadband provider - which sold mobile network O2 to Telefónica in 2005 - has long been planning a return to the industry as it gears up to introduce quad-play bundles.

With BT's takeover of mobile operator EE ongoing, the firm is planning to introduce mobile voice, SMS and broadband services under its own branding.

The Financial Times says existing customers will be able to sign up for inexpensive mobile deals to complement fixed-line broadband, TV and home phone.

The new service - which is expected to be called BT Mobile - will use EE's network under a wholesale agreement signed in 2014.

It will enable BT customers to sign up for mobile services before the company's intended acquisition of EE receives regulatory approval.

I would be gob-smacked if they tried to launch 2 new mobile brands over the next 12 months. The MVNO is new and it is only to carry them over until the MNO sale goes through, it is all part of the same mobile plan / project.

[Thine Wonk]

Quote:

Originally Posted by sethpet

Interesting decision for three coming up.

Do they

A) piss off the legacy three customers by making their tariffs far more expensive and lose AYCE data

Or

B) devalue the asset they have purchased by bringing O2 customers down to the Three tariff plans of cheaper line rental and AYCE

There will be elements of pulling the best from each company and offering a range of different plans. Yes unlimited data may go, but we're talking a year before anything like that happens, there will be winners and losers.

[Aye Up]

Quote:

Originally Posted by Thine Wonk

A while, but this one is going to take longer as the competition concerns are bigger. I would say March 2016 and we'll be at the stage where roaming might be enabled cross network and we'll start to see the networks come together.

Hutchison say they'll keep both Cornerstone / O2's network and Three MBNL live too, although they will almost certainly pool the transmission and allow cross network access.

I think in respect of this development your presumptions are accurate. This potential tie up has far more implications than the BT/EE deal. If both providers were sharing the same infrastructure it would be relatively straightforward, but they aren't. I don't think cross network roaming would be enabled until about 18-24mths of the merger completion date. EE took its time with the Orange/T-Mobile network roaming, so I don't think the rollout will be any faster.

There are a lot of invested parties to this deal, Vodafone and EE/BT will alomst certainly try to sabotage this tie up. OFCOM, CMA, Government will also be looking at this both from revenue concerns (from spectrum licensing) and also competition. That's before it gets to the European Commission who will almost certainly have a word or two to say about it. My only concern is whether UK authorities show opposition in addition to the other networks, and the EC tramples all over them.

The killer is that 41% market share, they already handed one provider a monopoly position, I just can't fathom why this merger would be allowed to proceed. The reduction to possibly 3 operators has been done in other markets in the EU, however the end result has always been that each MNO are broadly similar in size (by customers and revenue). There is a lot more to it, I should think this deal will suffer more scrutiny than the BT/EE merger.

[Thine Wonk]

It isn't a killer, 41% isn't even that high compared to other markets with 2 or 3 main companies or when compared to other non UK markets. If there are 3 competitors like there are with many EU mobile markets 40/30/30 is perfectly ok, you're never going to get a perfect 33/33/33. The key thing is the transmission network will span both BT and Vodafone.

Voda can certainly pack a punch being the worlds largest mobile group by revenue, they won't be threatened by a company that is 7% bigger. BT won't either as they have a spread of assets and markets they operate in, nobody is in a weak position in the market and they are all fit and capable, I think you're making a bigger deal than there really is with this 41% thing.

Voda will be happy in the sense that they will still have a Cornerstone partner, BT will be happy as they will still have an MBNL partner, HWL would otherwise exit the UK anyway, which would be undesirable.

[jchamier]

Quote:

Originally Posted by Aye Up

The killer is that 41% market share, they already handed one provider a monopoly position, I just can't fathom why this merger would be allowed to proceed. The reduction to possibly 3 operators has been done in other markets in the EU, however the end result has always been that each MNO are broadly similar in size (by customers and revenue). There is a lot more to it, I should think this deal will suffer more scrutiny than the BT/EE merger.

O2 & Three together also have far too little spectrum for the combined number of customers. The biggest network could therefore become the most congested. (well if some of that 45% of O2 customers still on feature phones upgrade to smartphones).

[Aye Up]

Quote:

Originally Posted by Thine Wonk

They aren't buying the quadplay argument that BT and Vodafone are betting on, many analysts also agree it isn't what it's cracked up to be, only 6% of Virgin Media customers take all services and they haven't managed to push mobile heavily despite the Virgin Mobile brand being big.

I don't think "Quadplay" is the aim per se, I think "multiplay" is the aim.

How many of Virgin Media's customers have broadband/TV/phone? I would bet over 2/3 of people. You are right quadplay isn't that successful, though other markets like France and Spain counter your arguement. It all comes down to loyalty, give someone what they think is a good deal, they will buy more services and as BT knows to its benefit, less likely to leave.

There is unlikely to be a revolution in quadplay, having seen Vodafone's plans they think so as well. BT, Vodafone, Sky, Virgin Media, will become multiplay providers like they already are now (excluding Vodafone))

[Thine Wonk]

Quote:

Originally Posted by jchamier

O2 & Three together also have far too little spectrum for the combined number of customers. The biggest network could therefore become the most congested. (well if some of that 45% of O2 customers still on feature phones upgrade to smartphones).

How is that different to where they are now? it isn't and soon the government is planning to have another auction anyway.

I don't agree by the way, I think combined, and with the 2nd lot of 1800Mhz coming over this years they've got enough to last the 2 years to the next auction / release.

You've got to get out of your head that everybody needs 100Mb/s speeds, that's a mobile forums on DS thing. EE will have that market, if you want that you'll pay the premium for EE, it isnt the mainstream market though.

[Thine Wonk]

Quote:

Originally Posted by Aye Up

There is unlikely to be a revolution in quadplay, having seen Vodafone's plans they think so as well. BT, Vodafone, Sky, Virgin Media, will become multiplay providers like they already are now (excluding Vodafone))

It is whether the mobile phone enters the quadplay market in a big way. I suspect it might not be as big as some of those companies are betting.

[jchamier]

Quote:

Originally Posted by Thine Wonk

I would be gob-smacked if they tried to launch 2 new mobile brands over the next 12 months. The MVNO is new and it is only to carry them over until the MNO sale goes through, it is all part of the same mobile plan / project.

Point taken. The question will be if they scrap the EE brand after acqusition completes, or keep it as they've done with Dabs / BT Shop.

http://shop.bt.com
http://www.dabs.com

[jchamier]

Quote:

Originally Posted by Thine Wonk

It is whether the mobile phone enters the quadplay market in a big way. I suspect it might not be as big as some of those companies are betting.

Agreed - VirginMedia's mobile service hasn't taken large numbers of subscribers from others.