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Another black man shot dead in USA by police officer |
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#351 |
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Perhaps it also would depend what the Police Service want to do with him, they may want to make an example / defuse tensions and co operate with the prosecution. It's an easier prosecution than most and could be Politically expedient.
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#352 |
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Sorry but that seems like a complete straw man to me.
I see nothing in this incident which reflects "gun culture" at all. |
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#353 |
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Except that it shows that a *traffic* officer was armed with a gun! In the UK, armed response is for situations that pose a threat to public security.
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#354 |
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Most police forces across Europe routinely arm their officers, but that doesn't reflect their respective country's gun culture in fairness.
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#355 |
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Dash cam has been released apparently . I have not seen it but it's been released.
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#356 |
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Most murder victims are not killed by instruments of the justice system. The police officer is a government employee meant to uphold justice, but he decided on a summary, extra-judicial execution of a non-violent offender instead. This case is not just some random killing, it's the justice system itself gone haywire. The state has more culpability here than in a typical murder, yet a clear history of showing leniency in similar cases. If you care so much about preserving the proper forms of law and order, then you really need to care about law and order not being flouted by the people meant to administer it. The possibility of the state getting away with yet another murder of one of it's citizens should be far more concerning to you than the possibility that somehow this guy who did shoot and kill someone for no reason is "innocent" on a technicality but suffers poor public relations.
The point is that the poster's priorities are demented. He cares too much about blatant murderers who are caught dead to rights in plain sight and hiding behind government corruption, and not enough about innocent victims. Without public scrutiny, this trial would never have happened, and without ongoing scrutiny it could fade away at any point in the process, like it has so many times before. Police have gotten away with countless killings like this one and hardly ever face any legal consequences. Some people are far too concerned about the media attention possibly making the trial unfair for the murderer, when the media attention is the only reason that there even is a fair trial. Given the circumstances and the context, they should far be more concerned about a lack of attention making it unfair for the victim. Nobody ever said there won't be a trial. It's a strawman argument creating a false dichotomy between having a trial and media attention. We don't have to choose just one. Media attention and a fair trial can coexist, and in a case like this, a trial with media attention is the only way it will be fair. There will be a trial now, but only because of the media. Nothing wrong with public scrutiny, I'm all for it when done correctly however you said if justice isn't done then they will take to rioting, I will never agree with that. You also said that since the victim didn't gt a trial why should the officer and I said because it's part of his human rights and it's the right of an individual to have their side heard. I'm not putting a nurderer before a victim, I just ask that justice is done properly and fairly and not by mob rule. Out of interest, if he is found guilty of manslaughter and gets say 10 years, would that suffice or will the result in riots? |
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#357 |
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Dash cam has been released apparently . I have not seen it but it's been released.
Doesn't really paint a picture of somebody who was fleeing in terror at the inevitable prospect of being treated badly by a white cop. The cop was reasonable and polite, took his details and wandered off back to his car (presumably to check what he'd been told) when Scott decided, quite bizarrely, to flee. Fundamentally, the only issue I can see is still the fact that US cops sometimes fail to consider that "it's not worth killing somebody over" is a valid choice to make in these situations. Nothing yet particularly suggests there was any racist motive for this, rather than simply a cop who couldn't think beyond using his gun to fix whatever problem faced him. |
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#358 |
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Dash cam has been released apparently . I have not seen it but it's been released.
So we know he ran away before being tasered. |
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#359 |
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Just watched it on CNN.
Doesn't really paint a picture of somebody who was fleeing in terror at the inevitable prospect of being treated badly by a white cop. The cop was reasonable and polite, took his details and wandered off back to his car (presumably to check what he'd been told) when Scott decided, quite bizarrely, to flee. Fundamentally, the only issue I can see is still the fact that US cops sometimes fail to consider that "it's not worth killing somebody over" is a valid choice to make in these situations. Nothing yet particularly suggests there was any racist motive for this, rather than simply a cop who couldn't think beyond using his gun to fix whatever problem faced him. anyway, this video pretty much confirms that Slager cannot reasonably have been in fear for his life. Scott was clearly just trying to get away. he had quite a head-start on Slager too, and yet still managed to get caught by the time the incident was captured on video. Slager could easily have caught him again when he managed to break free and run, but chose to shoot and kill him instead. |
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#360 |
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it's not really relevant whether or not there was an obvious racist motive for the shooting...
If there's a danger of creating a situation where it's impossible to police black people without being branded as a "racist" than, frankly, things are going to go all to shit very quickly. |
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#361 |
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Join Date: Oct 2010
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Quote:
Just watched it on CNN.
Doesn't really paint a picture of somebody who was fleeing in terror at the inevitable prospect of being treated badly by a white cop. The cop was reasonable and polite, took his details and wandered off back to his car (presumably to check what he'd been told) when Scott decided, quite bizarrely, to flee. Fundamentally, the only issue I can see is still the fact that US cops sometimes fail to consider that "it's not worth killing somebody over" is a valid choice to make in these situations. Nothing yet particularly suggests there was any racist motive for this, rather than simply a cop who couldn't think beyond using his gun to fix whatever problem faced him. He has disarmed the cop (to protect himself) and ran off again. The cop has resorted to his gun as his final option and shot him (as per your last paragraph). In my mind the intent isn't there for myrder but it is an unlawful killing as at no stage was there any threat to his life. He made a very bad decision, one that will cost him. |
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#362 |
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If it's already been covered then apologies, but I found the news reports tonight interesting in that this whole issue has raised the requisite use of body cameras. Really an excellent idea and surely not too difficult to implement. Protection all round.
As for the question of corrupt officers in the UK, there are 129,584 rank officers according to this publication, as of 2013. 5% would make near enough 6,500; more than enough to damage real justice significantly across the country. |
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#363 |
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I saw a video of a witness...
Some malcontent shows up, willing to go on camera and say that he saw whatever suits his personal agenda, and people are forced to respond to it as if it was a fact. Gone are the days when people could be relied upon to simply speak the truth so that justice might be done, in whoever's favour. These days it's more about people simply advocating their prejucides, whether it be that dumb-as-a-brick Jabba the Hutt lookalike in the Zimmerman case or people claiming to see things that didn't happen in the Michael Brown case.
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#364 |
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If it's already been covered then apologies, but I found the news reports tonight interesting in that this whole issue has raised the requisite use of body cameras. Really an excellent idea and surely not too difficult to implement. Protection all round.
As for the question of corrupt officers in the UK, there are 129,584 rank officers according to this publication, as of 2013. 5% would make near enough 6,500; more than enough to damage real justice significantly across the country.
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#365 |
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Is there any evidence that 5% of police are corrupt or unethical in some way?
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#366 |
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#367 |
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Great news.
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#368 |
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No evidence indeed that 5% are corrupt. Could in fact be 2%. Could in fact be 10%.
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#369 |
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No evidence indeed that 5% are corrupt. Could in fact be 2%. Could in fact be 10%.
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#370 |
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There's two very different numbers of corrupt cops. There are the ones who will do stuff like shoot unarmed suspects, take bribes from criminals, and other forms of overt corruption. And then there are the "good" ones who will not personally do that, but look the other way and protect their colleagues, even when they are doing those things. Cops who are completely corrupt are probably a small minority, but cops who will police corrupt coworkers are probably a minority too. Until good cops consider it their duty to protect against bad cops, then there is a serious problem.
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It's enough to keep you awake at night, making wild guesses, isn't it?
Suggest you refer to those earlier in the thread who made the original percentage conjecture. I was responding to them. |
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#371 |
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Does seem strange the low number of black cops in a mostly black area, what could be the cause of this anomaly ?
A good well paid career, with a large pension and lots of benefits, plus the respect of your peers. Surely black people are as law abiding and public spirited as other ethnic groups. |
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#372 |
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Does seem strange the low number of black cops in a mostly black area, what could be the cause of this anomaly ?
A good well paid career, with a large pension and lots of benefits, plus the respect of your peers. Surely black people are as law abiding and public spirited as other ethnic groups. |
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#373 |
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I'm unclear what your issue is. I was taking the 5% figure suggested by others, and simply demonstrating what that would mean in terms of actual numbers. You seem to be pretty defensive about it. Ex-copper perchance?
Suggest you refer to those earlier in the thread who made the original percentage conjecture. I was responding to them. I responded to your post because it was you that I saw do it. Nothing more. |
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#374 |
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My issue is that pulling a random number out of your arse and then speculating about how bad it'd be if it was real is the height of futility.
I responded to your post because it was you that I saw do it. Nothing more. Quote:
I like to believe that Will Bee's figure of 5% on corrupt officers is not far out. That's still 5% too many though.
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#375 |
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Got the two police threads mixed up. My error. But still:
So, not only speculation but speculation that is in an entirely different thread, about an incident completely unrelated to this one and on a different continent? The credibility just keeps on mounting up. |
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