Wow Joel is appalling at setting boundaries

2 of 2

Cat-

29-05-2015

Originally Posted by Hosai:
“That's truely the nail on the head. They had become somewhat of a double act, and in previous episodes Joel had been seeming to enjoy his role as the 'straight' character. Thats why I just feel he needed to say "ENOUGH", because the jokey "go back to your bed now Aaron", seemed akin to the 'role' he'd been playing for weeks as straight man to Aaron's craziness, rather than "Your actually making me very uncomfortable now/ seriously f off now".”

In fairness to Joel, it most likely felt he was no longer in control with a very drunken Aaron and a heckling bunch of hms egging Aaron on.

meglosmurmurs

29-05-2015

Originally Posted by lee_mccleary:
“He was weak. I think he was worried about his mates seeing it.”

Calling Joel weak just makes Aaron's behaviour seem even more questionable.

I wonder why Aaron never did this to his other friends in the house or especially the other guys?

Hosai

29-05-2015

Originally Posted by hrh7:
“I actually think joel set boundaries quite well.”

Originally Posted by hrh7:
“
I was once in a large public group setting, where I was singled out and what I now consider, publicly psychologically abused by someone. At the time everyone laughed, as did I, to cover my embarrassment. But afterwards I felt completely humiliated and a number of people I spoke to had also realised with hindsight that it was inappropriate. The person was never to my knowledge invited back again, but I still feel awkward thinking about it now.

Oh and I was in my 40s and a professional person.”

As not a single person in that room knew his boundaries had been crossed I would have to disagree.

Dangermoose

29-05-2015

Originally Posted by Hosai:
“[b]

As not a single person in that room knew his boundaries had been crossed I would have to disagree.”

Why would they all know or need to know his boundaries?

Hosai

29-05-2015

Originally Posted by Dangermoose:
“Why would they all know or need to know his boundaries?”

As in when things aren't a joke anymore and have now become annoying/uncomfortable.

Cat-

29-05-2015

Originally Posted by Hosai:
“[b]

As not a single person in that room knew his boundaries had been crossed I would have to disagree.”

Well it was pretty obvious at the time they all thought it was hilarious, and yet after the event we had a few hms rallying around Joel admitting that they played a part in encouraging it.

The only person who stepped over the boundary line here, was Aaron.

Vesna

29-05-2015

Originally Posted by Alrightmate:
“Yes but from what I saw they seemed to be seeing it in the context of a game in the spirit of fun.”

Would they be laughing and egging on if it was one of them Aaron was doing this to? I doubt it. If he had done it to Sarah would he have stopped if she said no no no ? I think he would. They don't respect Joel so they laughed while he was being humiliated. He said no. Like he'd done in the truth or dare. No respect, it's not me so ha ha ha. How long would Danny have enjoyed Aaron's " antics " if it was his face, his bed, his personal space?

Not long I'd bet.

hrh7

29-05-2015

Originally Posted by Hosai:
“[b]

As not a single person in that room knew his boundaries had been crossed I would have to disagree.”

I don't think anyone at the time knew my boundaries had been crossed, even a family member who was stood alongside me and knows me well didn't realise until afterwards. And lets face it in the BB house they were mostly drunk, so not going to recognise it.

Desy Boy

29-05-2015

I personally think that Aaron found Joel to be mildly homophobic (and comments on sexual "immorality" seem to give credence to this view) and as such tried to wind him up in this regard.

It was a bit like Winston and Alf Garnett in In Sickness and In Health. That kind of odd couple theme. I doubt there was any real 'sexual' motivation in Aaron's action i.e. that he had any sexual designs on Joel. I believe that Joel recognised this and felt more annoyed and embarrassed at Aaron's antics than sexually exploited.

Conehead

29-05-2015

Aaron is very sexually experienced as we all know. He can read the signs, so he knew that he was being at least annoying, and at worst bullying. He targeted Joel and thought he was being funny, because the other idiots encouraged him.

His whiny exit was the best thing about the whole episode.

Dangermoose

29-05-2015

Originally Posted by Hosai:
“As in when things aren't a joke anymore and have now become annoying/uncomfortable.”

No-one should be pushed to the point to make others aware of where those boundaries lie. Surely you don't have to set them out upon meeting people - most normal people would know where the line is.

Hosai

29-05-2015

Originally Posted by Vesna:
“Would they be laughing and egging on if it was one of them Aaron was doing this to? I doubt it. If he had done it to Sarah would he have stopped if she said no no no ? I think he would. They don't respect Joel so they laughed while he was being humiliated. He said no. Like he'd done in the truth or dare. No respect, it's not me so ha ha ha. How long would Danny have enjoyed Aaron's " antics " if it was his face, his bed, his personal space?

Not long I'd bet.”

Ofcourse Danny woudn't have stood for it at all. But thats because his character wouldn't stretch anywhere near being able to play with Aaron, like Joel could in his own way. To say "they don't respect Joel so they laughed while he was being humilated" seems a bit bleak, what about the fact that Joel and Aaron had become a slightly silly duo? I think people were laughing at the serious Joel, insane Aaron show, rather than someone being humiliated which would be a horrible thing to laugh at.

Vesna

29-05-2015

Originally Posted by Desy Boy:
“I personally think that Aaron found Joel to be mildly homophobic (and comments on sexual "immorality" seem to give credence to this view) and as such tried to wind him up in this regard.

It was a bit like Winston and Alf Garnett in In Sickness and In Health. That kind of odd couple theme. I doubt there was any real 'sexual' motivation in Aaron's action i.e. that he had any sexual designs on Joel. I believe that Joel recognised this and felt more annoyed and embarrassed at Aaron's antics than sexually exploited.”

I don't see it at all as someone earlier pointed out even a slightly homophobic person would never share a bath with a homosexual person. And I agree. It just wouldn't happen. Besides what Aaron did was just plain wrong no matter the sexual orientation of any of them.

Did Joel say he felt sexually exploited

I never heard him say that. I heard and saw Aaron violate his personal space.

Vesna

29-05-2015

Originally Posted by Hosai:
“Ofcourse Danny woudn't have stood for it at all. But thats because his character wouldn't stretch anywhere near being able to play with Aaron, like Joel could in his own way. To say "they don't respect Joel so they laughed while he was being humilated" seems a bit bleak, what about the fact that Joel and Aaron had become a slightly silly duo? I think people were laughing at the serious Joel, insane Aaron show, rather than someone being humiliated which would be a horrible thing to laugh at.”

I never saw this duo act you refer to. I've seen them have honest and real chats, usually one on one.. I've not seen them perform for the others. I've seen Joel cringe when Aaron's tried it on and I've heard him tell Aaron that he was not gay. And I saw in the same episode tonight Joel say no to kissing Aaron, even on a dare. He said no as he always has to Aaron's sexual advances. Clearly Aaron has no respect for Joel. I found it all rather bleak. BB should have called Aaron out way earlier. Should never have been allowed to go on and on.

academia

29-05-2015

Originally Posted by Hosai:
“Honestly, I know this sounds like I'm blaming the 'victim'. But had I not known how that scene would ultimately play out, was it that obvious Joel was uncomfortable in a serious way? I know its embarrassing and awkward to essentially say 'stop', but everytime he did it, it sounded exactly like someone playfully saying 'stop', but is actually seeing the funny side, and everyone else in the room seemed to agree. It was only in the diary room afterwards it became clear how uncomfortable Joel had been? I know its hard for people with low confidence to set boundaries but...is it normal to give no serious signs/hints at all at the time?”

Joel could not set boundaries for a man who doesn't know what a boundary is. Joel is not responsible for Aaron's appalling behavoiur.

dd68

29-05-2015

He is 19 and I am sure that he has never been in a situation like this

Heartache

29-05-2015

Originally Posted by dialectic:
“He was very uncomfortable, you could tell by his mumbling and nervous laugh . If he acted one way he could appear homophobic or if he acted another way he could appear gay. He was possibly a bit afraid of how far Aaron would go with this, but trying not to give offense himself. He wants to be a politician.”

Totally agree, and l bet it was more trying to avoid being accused of being homophobic, in this very PC day and age. Already the finger pointing had started on Twitter accusing BB of this, and supported by Aaron.

Jennyuk

29-05-2015

In this clip of Aaron and Joel in the bath at 32:40, Joel says to Aaron "Aaron dont try flirting with me, Nick is coming in" this was before the bedroom incident. So Joel had already told Aaron to back away.

http://www.channel5.com/shows/big-br...episode-17-248

2 of 2