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Three 4G Discussion Thread (Part 2)


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Old 03-02-2016, 22:25
squawkBOX
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The article from the FT (if you don't subscribe):

Hutchison pledges to price freeze to win Three-O2 approval
Li Ka-shing-owned group makes offer in bid to convince sceptical regulators to back UK mobile deal
https://next.ft.com/content/508f3a12...b-b7ece4e953a0


Mobile phone prices for tens of millions of UK customers would be frozen for five years as part of a £5bn investment drive by Li Ka-shing’s CK Hutchison to win over competition watchdogs to its £10.5bn acquisition of O2.

The merger of Hutchison’s Three and O2 would create the country’s largest mobile group, with control over about 40 per cent of the market. That has raised concerns among regulatory authorities in the UK and Brussels, who worry that reducing the number of mobile operators from four to three could lead to skyrocketing prices and falling investment.

In response, the Hong Kong-based group has promised to hold prices for five years for British customers of O2 and Three, while also opening its network to rivals.

The company said that the £5bn investment over five years would be used to improve coverage, reliability and data speeds, and represents about a fifth more than would have been invested by the two standalone companies combined.

In a letter to the Financial Times, Canning Fok, co-managing director of CK Hutchison, promises that “every cost efficiency that combining the businesses achieves will be shared with our customers. Like for like, customers’ bills will go down.”

Hutchison will use those arguments in its negotiations with the commission, as it seeks to win approval for a deal that has already drawn objections from Ofcom, the UK telecoms regulator.

On Monday, Sharon White, Ofcom’s chief executive, urged Brussels’ antitrust regulator to block the deal, pointing to prices rising by as much as a fifth in countries with just three competitors.

Her concerns are expected to be reflected in a detailed document of objections to the acquisition to be published by the commission on Thursday.

The commission is worried about a broad range of areas concerning retail and wholesale competition, as well as damage to network-sharing arrangements and the impact on retailers that sell mobile contracts.

Price pledges may not carry weight with the commission, which prefers structural remedies rather than artificially seeking to dictate costs.

Hutchison’s pledge is also based on unit price, while the commission and Ofcom may prefer to use overall costs of mobile packages at a time when consumers are increasingly buying more expensive bundles of data.

The key promise is likely to be around how far Hutchison will go on opening or selling parts of the combined network to encourage competition.

The company has promised to offer “fractional shared ownership interests in our network capacity” — in effect, allowing rivals that do not own mobile networks such as TalkTalk, Sky and Virgin Media to buy slices of capacity on its network.

“This is unprecedented in the UK telecom wholesale market. It eliminates the tricks some wholesalers use to disadvantage their wholesale customers,” Mr Fok wrote in his letter.

However, this falls short of the solution proposed by Ms White of creating a fourth, standalone rival to replace Three or O2 by selling spectrum and infrastructure. Hutchison is unlikely to agree to go to such lengths, according to analysts.

Mr Fok wrote that Hutchison has already spent billions to create Three, the smallest of the four mobile groups in the UK.

He added that the combination of Three with O2 “makes us able to stand up to the new leviathan BT. Not to mention to the old top-of-the-heap predator Vodafone and is the only way we can guarantee that five years from now customers will still be getting more and paying less for mobile services.”
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Old 03-02-2016, 22:26
jonmorris
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People on the One Plan are recommended the £30 plan as the equivalent, not a plan that's perhaps more suitable based on actual usage.

If you call, they recommend a more suitable plan based on usage but then won't offer any discount. That is unless you push for it, if course.

You know it's over 1.2 million people on the One Plan and others. Hardly an insignificant number.
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Old 03-02-2016, 22:33
Thine Wonk
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People on the One Plan are recommended the £30 plan as the equivalent, not a plan that's perhaps more suitable based on actual usage.

If you call, they recommend a more suitable plan based on usage but then won't offer any discount. That is unless you push for it, if course.

You know it's over 1.2 million people on the One Plan and others. Hardly an insignificant number.
Put into context though it's 15% of the customer base, many of which were moved off already over the last 18 months, and yes, recommended, but on the exact same letter an alternative offer is made for 12GB tethering, unlimited texts, unlimited data, 200 minutes for £20 and they are invited to speak to Three as there are also other options.
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Old 03-02-2016, 22:46
nigelbb
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Interesting that Three will freeze prices according to the FT tomorrow. Is that before or after bumping everyone up to paying more per month?!
It would be a hard decision if they offered me the option of freezing at my current £41/month for the One Plan. I would be very tempted.
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Old 04-02-2016, 01:17
hammy_y
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So what will happen is it'll force them to exit and then your real private equity asset strippers will come in and milk it for all it's worth or it'll go to a telecoms company like Virgin Media who'll just sell it as yet another thing and their project roadmap will have to be split between their fibre network, their business customers, their ISP, their phone service, their gov contracts and oh year, the mobile business too. Where's the new fibre rollout they promised to new areas? Nowhere, hasn't happened.

BT has been criticised for ignoring areas, the pair of them have been acting against the interests of consumers eg: BT rolling out areas where Virgin had fibre already first, yet BT is allowed to swallow up EE and add to their already huge dominance.
Well if Virgin Media bought one of them they might improve them a lot, and it would help them compete with BT. But I do agree that the BTEE deal seemed to basically go through, no questions asked, and no-one cared... that doesn't seem right.

Virgin Media have been rolling out fibre... here's a few places
http://www.uswitch.com/broadband/new...to_manchester/
http://www.engadget.com/2015/07/30/v...oadband-leeds/
and more recently near to me:
http://www.uswitch.com/broadband/new...fast_villages/

Also isn't it only logical for BT to cable Virgin Media areas first? It's definitely in my interest when they start rolling out G.Fast
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Old 04-02-2016, 06:48
jabbamk1
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The article from the FT (if you don't subscribe):

Hutchison pledges to price freeze to win Three-O2 approval
Li Ka-shing-owned group makes offer in bid to convince sceptical regulators to back UK mobile deal
https://next.ft.com/content/508f3a12...b-b7ece4e953a0
Was just about to post this myself.

Thanks squawkBOX.
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Old 05-02-2016, 11:23
Zebb
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News story; Tom Mockridge, chief executive of Virgin Media, calls on Brussels to allow O2 merger with Three. Makes sense.

Despite Sharon White, Ofcom, biased objections, you know, the ones posted behind a Tory controlled media paywall and without even consulting with Three or O2 first, looks like support is strong for the deal.
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Old 07-02-2016, 17:46
Cloudane
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Three's coverage checker says there'll be "network improvements" tomorrow. Makes you wonder...
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Old 07-02-2016, 18:29
alanwarwic
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I think they already cover 65% with 4 G.
And in their smaller 3G areas, if contention is low then there is little need for 4G.

Back in tye days whee they reined supreme on 3G, EE users never seemed to need data.
And even now, with a paltry EE allowance much the norm, I am not sure if users are that bothered.
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Old 08-02-2016, 00:35
hammy_y
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Three's coverage checker says there'll be "network improvements" tomorrow. Makes you wonder...
It says that nearly all the time for me.
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Old 08-02-2016, 01:02
Stereo Steve
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I think they already cover 65% with 4 G.
And in their smaller 3G areas, if contention is low then there is little need for 4G.

Back in tye days whee they reined supreme on 3G, EE users never seemed to need data.
And even now, with a paltry EE allowance much the norm, I am not sure if users are that bothered.
Which is why we need 3 strong networks with high density data coverage. That will push prices down. EE can charge what they like in many parts of the UK and that is not their fault, it's the other guys who didn't invest enough or keep up.
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Old 08-02-2016, 09:44
Craig Arthur
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Some activity down at a local MBNL mast. New Alifabs cabinet has appeared (https://onedrive.live.com/redir?resi...nt=photo%2cjpg)

It's quite a big one as well. EE already have this site 4G'd could this be 3 adding some 4G?
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Old 08-02-2016, 09:56
Pedro_C
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Some activity down at a local MBNL mast. New Alifabs cabinet has appeared (https://onedrive.live.com/redir?resi...nt=photo%2cjpg)

It's quite a big one as well. EE already have this site 4G'd could this be 3 adding some 4G?
H3G UK often use cabinets of that nature to 4G masts. EE/3 4G monopole+cabs
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Old 08-02-2016, 10:06
Craig Arthur
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That was my thinking, but wasn't sure. It's been there a week or so but no obvious new services coming from it.
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Old 08-02-2016, 10:42
jayteedc1
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Some activity down at a local MBNL mast. New Alifabs cabinet has appeared (https://onedrive.live.com/redir?resi...nt=photo%2cjpg)

It's quite a big one as well. EE already have this site 4G'd could this be 3 adding some 4G?
I think that type of cabinet is for the 800Mhz and 1800Mhz equipment. They use a shorter one for sites with just 1800Mhz. http://i.imgur.com/4vhuSPS.jpg

jayteedc
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Old 09-02-2016, 22:03
moox
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Unsurprisingly the 3 site says, once again, that there are "network improvements" in my area on the 13th. I've yet to actually see an improvement from the last million times there has been "improvements"

(still no 1800MHz 4G for example)
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Old 09-02-2016, 22:41
DevonBloke
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Unsurprisingly the 3 site says, once again, that there are "network improvements" in my area on the 13th. I've yet to actually see an improvement from the last million times there has been "improvements"

(still no 1800MHz 4G for example)
Yeah, round here, Three "network improvements" normally means EE are doing something.

Can't believe neither of them have done the Eden project mast though.
let me rephrase that.... I can't believe EE haven't done that mast. Three's Cornwall coverage looks complete crap.
Dunno why but I thought it was better than that.
(I'm talking 1800 that you can actually use of course).
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Old 09-02-2016, 23:19
PrinceGaz
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Three's coverage checker is now saying that you can use the inTouch app to access SuperVoice network (inc 800Mhz coverage as ticking the box in the checker adds much wider 4G coverage), on devices such as my S4 Mini.

I haven't been able to test this out on my phone to see if it is true, but it sounds like the TinT coverage may be coming to all devices soon (as the S4 Mini is pretty old).

Without TinT:

ftp://public:public@princegaz.no-ip....ts4mdh23hg.png

With TinT ticked:

ftp://public:public@princegaz.no-ip....dh23hgtint.png
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Old 09-02-2016, 23:56
Pedro_C
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Three's coverage checker is now saying that you can use the inTouch app to access SuperVoice network (inc 800Mhz coverage as ticking the box in the checker adds much wider 4G coverage), on devices such as my S4 Mini.

I haven't been able to test this out on my phone to see if it is true, but it sounds like the TinT coverage may be coming to all devices soon (as the S4 Mini is pretty old).

Without TinT:

ftp://public:public@princegaz.no-ip....ts4mdh23hg.png

With TinT ticked:

ftp://public:public@princegaz.no-ip....dh23hgtint.png
My Moto G is listed, so gonna do some tests tomorrow (and go on another mast hunt)
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Old 10-02-2016, 00:05
Pedro_C
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It works. It actually works. 3 in touch allows access to 800MHz for devices not 3 ROM'd ETC

My Moto G 1st gen: http://pedroc.co.uk/3intsuper.png Cell ID 7 is 800MHZ!
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Old 10-02-2016, 00:08
PrinceGaz
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It works. It actually works. 3 in touch allows access to 800MHz for devices not 3 ROM'd ETC
Seriously? The coverage area I included was not where I live now so I couldn't check (I've got solid 3G2100 and good 4G1800). If that is true, that would be awesome. I knew Jackson would make it right!
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Old 10-02-2016, 00:11
Pedro_C
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Seriously? The coverage area I included was not where I live now so I couldn't check. If that is true, that would be awesome. I knew Jackson would make it right!
Updated the post above! 3 Supervoice on Moto g 1st gen with three InTouch App shows the Non-3 ROM Moto G 1st Gen LTE on 3's 800MHz (Cell ID 7)

Calls don't seem to be going over the app, but data's working. It's quite hard to test here though because I have to put the phone in the microwave (which is off) and then move a baking tray in front in the right place so it blocks of 1800Mhz but still lets enough 800Mhz in.
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Old 10-02-2016, 00:20
DevonBloke
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because I have to put the phone in the microwave 9which is off) and then move a baking tray in front in the right place so it blocks of 1800Mhz but still lets enoguh 800Mhz in.
Hahahahaha. God I swear you are more geeky than me!!!!
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Old 10-02-2016, 00:21
jonmorris
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Did you get an update for inTouch? The version I can see on the Play store is still from December and no mention of 4G as yet.

I've got my Three SIM in a dual SIM phone right now (Honor 7) and it seems inTouch doesn't like that at all. It just exits immediately!
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Old 10-02-2016, 00:24
Pedro_C
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Did you get an update for inTouch? The version I can see on the Play store is still from December and no mention of 4G as yet.

I've got my Three SIM in a dual SIM phone right now (Honor 7) and it seems inTouch doesn't like that at all. It just exits immediately!
It's v4.9.5. It's not letting me make calls over the 800MHz but data works great. I'll do some more testing later today when I head into an area with pretty much no 3 2100 and 1800 4G.
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