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Three 4G Discussion Thread (Part 2)


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Old 12-06-2015, 14:36
binary
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There is still some wiggle room if you know how to play the system.
"My name is jabbamk1 and I'm going to launch a full scale vendetta against you on the Digital Spy forums unless you give me my own 'MK One' plan for £1 a month..."
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Old 12-06-2015, 15:49
mogzyboy
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Whilst this is 100% correct.

There is still some wiggle room if you know how to play the system.
Care to share?
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Old 12-06-2015, 16:00
grumpyoldbat
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The 3 coverage map got updated and is surprisingly accurate as regarding 4G in my area. No indoor coverage for me but outside is OK. Sigh, awaiting the 800MHz DD switch on.
The coverage map and the accompanying info is even more laughably wrong.

At home the info says there's no coverage, but the map shows there is, and in fact there's lovely speedy 4G.

At work the info says there's very good 4G coverage, and the map shows coverage indoor and out, and there's only 3G!

They really don't know their **se from their elbow!
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Old 12-06-2015, 17:03
southlad
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The coverage map and the accompanying info is even more laughably wrong.

At home the info says there's no coverage, but the map shows there is, and in fact there's lovely speedy 4G.

At work the info says there's very good 4G coverage, and the map shows coverage indoor and out, and there's only 3G!

They really don't know their **se from their elbow!
Same here, map shows 4g indoor and out but info says no 4g available. The truth is there is one bar of 4g outside but none inside where it drops back to 3G. I even got a text from Three a few months ago telling me 4g is available in my area.
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Old 12-06-2015, 18:24
Thine Wonk
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The map and the postcode checker are updated separately, it can take a few months in some occasions where upgrades have happened. Mine now matches the map, but it didn't used to.
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Old 13-06-2015, 18:50
djfrancis
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The problem being near lidl is that its the only mast in about 2 miles which is disgusting. The next closest mast is on farm road which was upgraded (looks nasty now) which should go 4G sometime soon.

They were planning a mast near the royal mail office behind fitness first a long with the old Orange mast next to NatWest "Within 3 months" just need more people to complain to help speed things up.

It isn't acceptable to have no signal in the streets on a busy high street in London

The mast recently upgraded to Three 4G is the one close to Highview avenue by the A41 giving speeds of above 70Mbps at times.
The mast i pickup is cell id 127744 fron stoneyfeilds garden, This mast is in high street near lidi however the mast on broadhurst ave (near Highview avenue) i cant pickup as this could be giving the location towards stanmore. O2 have a tiny microcell on nationwide bank and mcdonalds in barnet on high street and thats only 2G so why dont EE/Three make a compatible microcell box to make 4G for station road coverage!

Today was passing by farm road mast no 4G yet maybe for EE users, Heres a photo of theses new NW london phone masts yukkkk http://postimg.org/image/pcme4flxf/ this one is on Farm Road.
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Old 13-06-2015, 19:51
Thine Wonk
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The mast i pickup is cell id 127744 fron stoneyfeilds garden, This mast is in high street near lidi however the mast on broadhurst ave (near Highview avenue) i cant pickup as this could be giving the location towards stanmore. O2 have a tiny microcell on nationwide bank and mcdonalds in barnet on high street and thats only 2G so why dont EE/Three make a compatible microcell box to make 4G for station road coverage!

Today was passing by farm road mast no 4G yet maybe for EE users, Heres a photo of theses new NW london phone masts yukkkk http://postimg.org/image/pcme4flxf/ this one is on Farm Road.
Because it takes years and years of investment to cover every street and get to the point where you're doing small fill in coverage. The networks are mainly spending their quarterly budgets on wide area 4G coverage at the moment, not infilling small coverage gaps.
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Old 13-06-2015, 21:23
lightspeed2398
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Three are at around 60% population coverage now. Has anyone got an idea of where they'll be at the end of the year running 800MHz on full blast? I remember someone (maybe Jabba?) saying that it would take only 1000 masts to cover the whole country with the thinnest layer of 4g.
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Old 13-06-2015, 21:35
jabbamk1
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Three are at around 60% population coverage now. Has anyone got an idea of where they'll be at the end of the year running 800MHz on full blast? I remember someone (maybe Jabba?) saying that it would take only 1000 masts to cover the whole country with the thinnest layer of 4g.
Well more than 1,000 (Probably double). But yeh they can do it.

Three are still promising 98% by the end of this year but that's a load of crap.

Honestly I don't know where Three will be at the end of the year.
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Old 13-06-2015, 22:03
mupet0000
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Well more than 1,000 (Probably double). But yeh they can do it.

Three are still promising 98% by the end of this year but that's a load of crap.

Honestly I don't know where Three will be at the end of the year.
Do you expect a mass 800MHz switch on or are we going to be underwhelmed by it? It's their only chance of getting anywhere near their target. I don't know why they bother to set targets like that and then 4G masts so slowly.

There's an MBNL site that's so congested in my town, between 17:30 and 20:00 the 3G no longer works for calls/texts/data. Calls don't even begin to connect and data does not flow at all. Three 4G from the same site works with no issues and the EE 3G/4G works fine too. Three said it would be fixed on the 11th June, I got a text that day telling me they still haven't resolved the issue and will contact me within a week regarding it.

The site is swamped by gridlock traffic between those times, it's at a roundabout and points directly down a residential street with homes and businesses that goes for a mile, it also serves another residential area where I live although not line of sight because of a bridge but it's well placed enough to get through. It points down 2 roads that go into the town centre and also a busy A road. Also it's smack bang next to two retail parks.

Seen as the 4G works, what could they do to increase the 3G capacity? There's one other MBNL site in the area that reaches most of these places just not as well, but the other site works fine. The phone stays connected to the site with the best signal even if it doesn't work, so that doesn't really help.
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Old 13-06-2015, 23:09
eljmayes
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I suspect they will be nearing 75% by the end of year.
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Old 14-06-2015, 09:28
jaffboy151
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The coverage map and the accompanying info is even more laughably wrong.

At home the info says there's no coverage, but the map shows there is, and in fact there's lovely speedy 4G.

At work the info says there's very good 4G coverage, and the map shows coverage indoor and out, and there's only 3G!

They really don't know their **se from their elbow!
After testing in many different parts around the country I've found three & EE's 3g coverage maps to be very accurate, but there 4g maps are both total fantasy with coverage only really in 30-40% of the area shown on the map, if the coverage % figures talked about for year end are based on these maps then the reality is going to be a hell of a lot less then the reported figures. EE show my entire commute, 30 miles covered by 4g bar a few squares of white, where as you will be lucky to see it for about half a mile around cell sites, in fact if you're unlucky enough to catch 3g on a bad day we will drop to 2g and you'll be beached there for most the journey, one thing I do like about three is the no 2g to get stuck on, all networks seem the same in this regard, if the mood takes them, is it something to do with the way 2g works? Trying to get it to switch back to 3 or 4g is like trying to get your kid out of bed and ready for school when they don't want to go..
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Old 14-06-2015, 19:13
jabbamk1
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After testing in many different parts around the country I've found three & EE's 3g coverage maps to be very accurate, but there 4g maps are both total fantasy with coverage only really in 30-40% of the area shown on the map, if the coverage % figures talked about for year end are based on these maps then the reality is going to be a hell of a lot less then the reported figures. EE show my entire commute, 30 miles covered by 4g bar a few squares of white, where as you will be lucky to see it for about half a mile around cell sites, in fact if you're unlucky enough to catch 3g on a bad day we will drop to 2g and you'll be beached there for most the journey, one thing I do like about three is the no 2g to get stuck on, all networks seem the same in this regard, if the mood takes them, is it something to do with the way 2g works? Trying to get it to switch back to 3 or 4g is like trying to get your kid out of bed and ready for school when they don't want to go..
It's because your methodology is incorrect.

You'd need to force your phone to 4G only if you really want to see how accurate the maps are.
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Old 14-06-2015, 20:57
jaffboy151
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Your right there jabba and I guess it explains why three's 3g map is fairly accurate as there's nothing to switch down to, my argument would be that networks set the minimum signal strengths required before switches in technology which dictates what can be received and what cannot not so showing coverage where you cannot get it by design isn't really accurate is it.
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Old 14-06-2015, 21:02
lightspeed2398
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The maps need to represent typical usage then, should the typical user by expected to switch their phone to 4g only. I suggest a system of typical coverage in a simplified view, and an advanced view with more data. Of course, this would mean they would appear to have less coverage so they'd never do it. I think in my opinion that the best map is either Vodafone's which shows their planned coverage (although it's not very good) or o2's because you can see their masts, although these both have the very big disadvantages of not being able to zoom out because they're ashamed of their coverage. Either way I'm rambling now, perhaps I should also go out for a bike ride...
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Old 14-06-2015, 21:40
jabbamk1
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The maps need to represent typical usage then, should the typical user by expected to switch their phone to 4g only
In which case they might as well shrink the 2G map by 90% as you'll be on 3G most of the time on EE for example.

Those maps are there to show how far the 4G signal goes. They are not 100% accurate but do show the general 4G coverage area. But if 3G is stronger then it'll stick to 3G there.

Just remember when 3G was still rolling out but you got 2G in most places where 3G was supposed to be (cough) O2 (cough). Same issue here.
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Old 14-06-2015, 21:58
FmBandScan
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And also,which phones are able to switch to 4G only, with and without root? I know my LG G3 can choose 4G only if I enter the "secret code" into the dialar.
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Old 14-06-2015, 22:11
jonmorris
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I don't think most people care if they have 3G or 4G though. In the case of Three, you can get 3G speeds almost as fast (albeit with higher latency) so there's no real harm dropping down most of the time.

It's not like being kicked down to 2G and being stuck there forever as so often happens on my O2 account. That's then useless for data, while dropping to 3G on Three doesn't mean the end of data. (again, most of the time)
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Old 14-06-2015, 22:19
jaffboy151
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This is why I'm particularly against the 4g fantasy coverage maps around on three and EE, the ability to select 4g only is disabled by the, they set the minimum db limit at which they think the signal is inferior and to fall back to a lower priority tech, so saying there is coverage in such areas is deceiving. Saying that, I don't really care what symbol my phone says other then on an anorak level, all I want is data at above say 2mbps with a ping below 100, this seems to be more difficult for me now to achieve then when I joined three over 5 years ago.
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Old 14-06-2015, 22:29
jonmorris
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In a lot of my testing of 4G, I've locked devices to 4G only (no need for voice) and once doing so, you can discover 4G does indeed exist in a lot of areas where the maps say so. Sometimes I'd even dare to say I've picked up 4G where there's supposedly no coverage - and got my hopes up that perhaps Three has upgraded a nearby site, only to discover that this isn't the case.

Even with 0 or 1 bars of 4G (don't you just love it that some phones can show 0 bars before going 'no service/emergency calls only') I've had speeds in excess of 10Mbps. It's rather messed up, as with the phone back in 3G/4G mode, it will never let me use 4G in these locations.

Ultimately though, the maps aren't necessarily wrong - in fact, they seem quite scarily accurate. Your phone is simply opting to remain on 3G, or has dropped from 4G to 3G during data flow and now stays on 3G until you stop consuming data. Given there are so many parameters, it's why you often find yourself on 3G even where there is 4G.

Once many more sites in any given area are upgraded, or indeed when we get 800MHz, a LOT of these problems will disappear.
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Old 14-06-2015, 22:53
japaul
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It's a bit more complicated.

Apart from the signal threshold the maps assume for 4G coverage (which for EE and Three seem quite low ) and having to wait for data to stop flowing, there is another issue which causes a problem when you have small islands of 4G coverage. I saw this recently on Vodafone in South Wales where there is limited 4G in quite a few areas but at the moment it is often one or two sites with lots of gaps. It was quite frustrating as I would have 4G in a certain place but when I returned there another time the phone would stay on 3G. Why?

The problem is that a phone will only look for 4G if the 3G cell contains the 4G system info in SIB19 (this is a system info block) and it seems the only 3G sites with the necessary info were the ones upgraded to 4G. So unless you happened to camp on a 3G site that had been upgraded to 4G then you stayed on 3G even though in good 4G coverage.

Now you might think the surrounding 3G sites need upgrading but this isn't the reason. It is done on purpose! If you supply the SIB19 info then you need to be reasonably sure the user will be in 4G coverage as it will be on a higher priority and therefore compulsory for the phone to look for it. If it doesn't find it it will repeat the search again after a short time and this can easily eat your battery in no time. So given a lot of users on adjacent cells won't be in 4G coverage they didn't supply the info. This is quite extreme but a balance has to be struck. Often some 3G sites which don't have 4G do contain the info but only if the network is confident you will be in 4G coverage.

If you are in an area where there are lots of 4G sites then it's safe to give all of the 3G cells the SIB19 4G info and even though you might happen to be in an area with weak 4G your phone will look for it and probably find it. However in a "4G island" even though you are in a relatively strong coverage area your phone might not have looked for it. I think this is what happens a lot on Three who have quite a lot of small islands of 4G.

2G sites need similar info (in the 2-quarter message rather than SIB19) to tell phones to look for 4G but changes to these can be even less likely which is why you might become beached on 2G.

Switching phones off and on or going into airplane mode will often make a phone do one full search (but not always) so this might let you pick up 4G.
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Old 15-06-2015, 00:26
ard100
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Pontypool wales is live covers a very large area 800mhz, also three site in Cwmbran next to go live and has 800mhz from three aswell
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Old 15-06-2015, 01:47
Zee_Bukhari
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The mast i pickup is cell id 127744 fron stoneyfeilds garden, This mast is in high street near lidi however the mast on broadhurst ave (near Highview avenue) i cant pickup as this could be giving the location towards stanmore. O2 have a tiny microcell on nationwide bank and mcdonalds in barnet on high street and thats only 2G so why dont EE/Three make a compatible microcell box to make 4G for station road coverage!

Today was passing by farm road mast no 4G yet maybe for EE users, Heres a photo of theses new NW london phone masts yukkkk http://postimg.org/image/pcme4flxf/ this one is on Farm Road.
The mast by lidl is 3G and 4G for Three and EE customers. There is an old Orange mast next to NatWest which broadcasts excellent 3G and 4G coverage for EE customers, but nothing for Three customers.

The mast near highview avenue went Three 4G live about 1 month ago and the one on farm road, the ugly looking one shouldn't be too far off.
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Old 15-06-2015, 07:16
jaffboy151
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Thanks japaul, I understand why coverage can vary in the same place a bit more now, I've always wondered what SIB19 ment on my service report on the Samsung,

https://www.dropbox.com/s/xvp524i7u2...-26-1.jpg?dl=0
Any idea what the bits with a question mark next to them are all about?
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Old 17-06-2015, 19:28
denyo1977
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Can't find anything about it after seeing the tweet, but it looks like Three are giving out free portable chargers too

https://twitter.com/MrJamesBrown/sta...137270784?s=09
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