As for licenses, the upgrade is for free on a condition that the previous license is ended. If it wasn't like that you could update as many computers as you liked to W10 with one retail Windows license.

Yes I got the solitaire one too.

But every time I went to open pictures, I was presented with a nag asking me if I still wanted to use Windows Picture Viewer, or another app in their store who's name escapes me, despite Windows Picture Viewer being my chosen default. Thereafter the nag would not appear if I chose pictures from the same folder, but if I chose a different folder, or a different format, smack it was back.

Edit, sorry, of course I meant Windows Photo Viewer.

That is a bit worrying - if the roll back is failing. Of course.....we don't know if user error is involved. I have not installed 10 yet but as I was able to get the 10 preview working fine on a 5 year old (W7) Laptop, with all drivers working, my hunch is that W10 (fresh install after first upgrading) should not be a problem on any recentish machine.

However......there does seem to be a completely safe option to test W10 (fresh install) for people who use Acronis True Image or Macrium. This assumes that the information in the following link is 100% correct. (Is it?)
The link below claims that a W10 ISO is....in fact.......one big shareware demo!
You fresh install it - without any keys - and you end up with a fully functional W10 except for desktop personalisation. The article claims that all updates will arrive - at least for the first year. Huh? The first year? 30 days should be long enough for you to know that everything is working.

Then upgrade your 7 (or 8.1) after you restore your image.
Then Fresh Install/Reset the activated W10.

Too cautious? Too long winded? Well......it's better than rolling back to a door stop isn't it??

http://www.windowscentral.com/you-do...ate-windows-10

It must like you I had the Photos app set as default, now I changed to Windows Photo Viewer and Windows keeps stumm about other apps

Don't forget though that for every app (i still call them programmes) Microsoft want you to purchase there are lots of free versions that do the same thing.

Windows 10 has nothing to do with Paypal. Or any specific bank site. Do you actually believe it DOES?

You're doing something you're not telling us. For example, using a different web browser (like Edge) and simply expecting it magically has stored passwords from whatever browser you were using before.

MS is not responsible for bad user behavior or unrealistic expectations. OS upgrades, even the best of them, are not magic wands.

Also, who pays for Windows Photo Viewer? I don't even understand what you're saying there.

Of course. But that doesnt mean you dont get the nag.

Interstingly, in the link below provided by Landis, is the quote

Get a perspective - you really only see people with problems here - for the vast majority it has worked fine - if it had not the media would be slaying Microsoft!

I know this has become a long thread but if you invest a little time in reading it, you will see the repeated advice from experienced users is before you do an upgrade, do the following


1. Copy any valuable data to an external storage medium (or the Cloud if you like).

2. Make sure as a minimum, you have a windows recovery usb stick or DVD of you current operating system. You should have this anyway to protect against hard disk corruption or failure.

3. Strongly recommend you make a full image backup to an external drive using Macrium Reflect Free (only need freeo version not paid versions) or similar.
With this, you don't even need to reinstall apps.

With these simple precautions, you can recover even if things go pearshaped. Just relying on the Windows 10 rollback is putting all you eggs in one basket, and basically pretty dumb strategy.

Personally, I would use option 3 over any MS solution as (as many posters on this forum will agree) this is a fast and reliable way to recover. All big corporations use this approach.

If this is happening, it sounds like businesses that haven't bothered to apply administrative lock downs or security control of their machines at all. Sure some businesses operate that way (especially small ones) but it sure isn't a good idea.

For one thing, machines joined to a corporate domain and behind a corp firewall shouldn't be receiving Windows Updates. KB3035583 should never have even been installed.

No, but the operating system has to handle the protocols used and interpret the keystrokes entered correctly. Its clear that that did not happen.


No. I used Firefox as I did in Windows 7. Followed the same link, bought the same item from the same seller, used the same debit card in the same section of Paypal that I always use.
Incidentally, I had bought exactly the same item in exactly the same way 3 weeks previously as well, all without any problem.


Thanks for accusing me of not knowing what I am doing, or maybe lying, not sure which. While I'm no expert, I do know my way around the workings of a PC.
Microsoft screwed up, not me. W10 didnt work, nagged me to buy things, and disabled a fair chunk of my paid for security.


As Windows Photo Viewer was a part of Windows 7, it was already paid for when I bought the licence for Windows 7. Therefore I didnt need any other photo viewing software, and as Macadanny pointed out, there are many free programs out there that can view pictures too. But that didnt stop Microsoft from pushing another.

good advice but it's missing a few (and it's odd people keep leaving these out).

4.) Do a FULL system Spyware scan before you run the upgrade. This should be NON-OPTIONAL. It's just a disaster waiting to happen if you run the upgrade with spyware or a virus on your system.

5.) While it may not strictly be necessary, it's a good idea to uninstall any system level apps before running the upgrade (Antivirus/Security, Tune Up Apps, Custom Firewalls, complicated non-standard drivers that address the OS in sneaky ways, etc.). THEN search for Win 10 specific versions AFTER the update. If they don't exist, try reinstalling the old versions--many will work--but at least having been fresh installed under 10 there's a better chance of them working. Oh, also ditch totally the custom OEM apps that Dell and HP for example, but many others, also slapped down on systems. The custom icon docks. The Customer Support Apps. Go into Add/Remove seek them ALL out and kill them. On older PCs these packages aren't even supported anymore, even though you have them there taking up space, memory, etc. Trying to migrate them to 10 is a disaster.

6.) It's also a good idea to clear up your hard drive in general of anything extraneous before the upgrade. Anything you don't really need? Remove it. The Win 10 upgrade is going to take a heck of a lot of space since it will keep all of your previous OS for a while anyway, so the more free space the better anyway (actually that's always true of ANY PC at ANY time--they always run like crap with packed hard drives). Also, think of doing a hard drive defrag and a Disk Check for errors.

7.) Finally, in my opinion, the upgrade should be done with as many devices unplugged as possible. Sure you'll need to plug them in and test once the upgrade is over, but it's a bad idea to throw ANYTHING at an automated upgrade process you don't have to. Remove extra factors from the upgrade whenever possible. THEN test them after (and again, look for newer supported drivers and support packages from the website of each manufacturer first).

HTTP is a dead simple protocol. There are precious few others, and virtually none are controlled at the OS level.

Java is one possibility, I suppose, but there's a difference between Javascript and true Java and if you somehow migrated over without Java, there aren't many banking sites that use it. And I know 100% that Paypal's site doesn't.

So this upset is just that you're not pleased that they advertised something enhanced you can totally refuse and use the default instead? It might be annoying, but it doesn't sound like they're actually taking anything away from you. There's a Windows 10 photo app. You don't pay for it. Where's the issue?

That would be by far the best option, and would be my preferred option.

But......I thought the current understanding was that Microsoft have turned your Windows key into a Windows 10 key as part of the activation process. And that this is why there has to be a proper roll back. And that this is why reports of failed roll backs are problematic.
If Microsoft are saying that a restored W7 or W8.1 image will function as though the W10 activation had never occured, then....with the greatest of respect to you...I would like to see a link!

If it's a problem with a specific purchase, inside of Paypal, what leads you to suspect the Operating System before you question whether or not it's Paypal's problem? They have transitory errors and things not working on their site constantly.

Of course testing this shouldn't have been too bad. If you suspect a problem is due to a change on a PC, you try the same operation elsewhere (ideally on another PC, but even on a phone or tablet) and compare. You might argue you effectively did that by rolling your PC back, but I suspect hours passed and so it wasn't really the same thing as testing the problem out elsewhere right then and there to see if it was really that PC with Win 10 on it causing the problem.

At the very least, the one other factor involved was Firefox. Assuming you know all your passwords and such, it's always a good idea to have another browser (say, Chrome or Opera--if you don't want to risk IE or Edge) to see if the browser is the issue.

The OS is the least partner in all of this. If you can connect to the site and have the browser running, and it's not a site that uses something like Adobe Flash or Java (which Paypal doesn't) then the browser is the first suspect, but a transitory problem on the other end definitely the second one.

Because doing so disadvantages Micrsoft's future options. They could extend the 12 months for the free upgrade though.

The future business model, unless they totally dominate like in days past, is an advert driven one. Total domination could also mean an 'with ads' OS just for those who do not want to pay.

Whatever, adverts are an increasing part of every OS. Want an IOS or Windows update for your 3 year old kit, accept the extra ads or pay. That is how it will be.

This is also good advice, but I think the other points are a bit beyond a lot if users.

TBH, I was less thinking about doing a good upgrade but more about how to recover if it all goes pearshaped. If you can't recover, then potentially it all goes horribly wrong.

I don't blame you for this, I did the upgrade yesterday after being prompted that it was ready I disabled Avast & went ahead it didn't take long to do about an hour first thing I noticed the graphics were on the desktop were changed to always asking for permission to open I stopped this happening on my Windows 7 Pro but this made no difference on 10 the images looked dull in colour to 7, I couldn't get Edge to work it kept freezing up I could see some of Windows 8 in 10, I looked up on PC Advisor mag how to roll back to Windows 7 & that didn't take long about 15 mins anything that has Windows 8 in the OS makes me cringe, This is just IMHO that Microsoft might just be having brown trousers because if they can't sort out these problems then we have to ask why bother with Windows 10???? Apple will laughing at them all the way to the bank. I think Windows 7 will be like XP around for a lot longer than MS think or want

And yet all the panic Sky is falling stuff is forgetting how nightmarishly bad the Win XP to Win 7 migrations were. People were practically jumping out of ACTUAL Windows at that time. The people who'd done Vista in the middle had it a little better, but most people did the same level of leap they're being asked to do now.

Posting lengthy posts just adds to the Tower of Babel

There is a guaranteed method (which can be explained simply) but it may take some time of things-to-do and most people can't be arsed or don't have an external drive (or a spare Flash drive)

It works perfectly. I have tested it on different PCs, with 7, 8.1 and the special 8.1 with Bing.

There is no issue reverting provided you replace W10. See

http://www.howtogeek.com/223139/how-to-create-an-image-of-your-pc-before-upgrading-to-windows-10/

You cannot cheat and try creating a dual OS or put one in a virtual machine (I tried out of interest).

The old wait for 10.1 or SP1 chestnut again!

MS have clearly stated they will no longer be producing new sub versions or Service Pack.

From now on, they will simply be doing continual updates (mandatory for home version). So you will never know when to specifically update!

All you can really do is wait for a while and hope
for the best (or read press until they say something useful).

If you upgrade, you can rollback in 30 days if any issues.

Oh........I just checked and Updates has disappeared from the Control panel

I used to have windows updates set to download and then inform me so I could install them manually at a time that suited me

but I guess I won't have that option now

I had to roll back to win 7 as win 10 couldn't find my laptop Nvidia card. It was absolutely painless.

I moved from W7 to W10 , I have noticed on W7 if I hovered over the Wifi icon next to the clock ,it stated the connection strength.Now with W10 if I hover above it,it just states the network name,the Icon has changed so it is not apparent what the wifi connect is now at a quick glance
If I right click the icon,and open Network and sharing centre , it then shows the old bar version and I can see the signal quality

No biggy, but just a bit harder to get the info,required.