They were riding high at the time that one of their members killed themselves, would they have been bigger than the other groups if it hadn't happened?
Would GRL have been bigger than little mix/ 5th harmony if Simone hadn't died?
I think bigger than 5th harmony yes but not Little Mix. I liked GRL but like 5th Harmony I don't think they 'fit' well together. The only time I think GRL looked like a group was in the Vacation video.
I'm not sure really. I always thought G.R.L. would be one of those amazing girl bands that unfairly flops (like Mini Viva or Girlicious). Then they had a hit with Ugly Heart which changed things a bit. But even before Simone died I was unsure how they would follow up such a great song. I personally think they were much better than Little Mix and Fifth Harmony, in terms of material, image and personality, but then my favourite girl bands almost always flop. It's difficult to say without knowing what material they had lined up for them.
I don't know but it's possible. Very sad about Simone. What I want to know though is who the heck are 5th Harmony? I keep seeing their name mentioned everywhere lately with comments about them being the 'biggest girl group' around today'! Really? Where have they suddenly sprung from? I couldn't name you a single song by them whereas I could probably name ever single by Little Mix!
Originally Posted by JordanC55:
“They were riding high at the time that one of their members killed themselves, would they have been bigger than the other groups if it hadn't happened?”
“They were riding high at the time that one of their members killed themselves, would they have been bigger than the other groups if it hadn't happened?”
Not really, they only had one single that the charts noticed and even that wasn't a huge hit.
Well, Ugly Heart was a reasonably big hit for G.R.L. so there was enough public interest to keep the single in the charts for a good number of weeks. Granted the single did better in countries like Australia.
After Simone died, who knows why they didn't continue as a four-piece girl group. Maybe replacing Simone might've seemed in bad taste purely because of the circumstances.
I actually preferred Lighthouse to Ugly Heart.
After Simone died, who knows why they didn't continue as a four-piece girl group. Maybe replacing Simone might've seemed in bad taste purely because of the circumstances.
I actually preferred Lighthouse to Ugly Heart.
It was really sad what happened to Simone Battle. I truly think the music scene in general is missing girl groups. Little Mix and Fifth Harmony are flying the flag and there's probably a few others. But in the 90s and 00s there was a much bigger market for them, both US and UK. They ranged from R&B to pop and delivered awesome music.
In the US, there hasn't been a big girl group since the Pussycat Dolls, though 5H appear to be taking up that mantle. Danity Kane were big for a while but I read Diddy mismanaged them in the end. In the 90s you had TLC, En Vogue and SWV as the biggest American girl groups of that era. Then in the early 00s it was mainly Destiny's Child.
In the UK, The Saturdays will probably make a comeback at some point. I think they're on break. I don't know what happened to Stooshe though, they were interesting around 2012/13.
In the US, there hasn't been a big girl group since the Pussycat Dolls, though 5H appear to be taking up that mantle. Danity Kane were big for a while but I read Diddy mismanaged them in the end. In the 90s you had TLC, En Vogue and SWV as the biggest American girl groups of that era. Then in the early 00s it was mainly Destiny's Child.
In the UK, The Saturdays will probably make a comeback at some point. I think they're on break. I don't know what happened to Stooshe though, they were interesting around 2012/13.
It's hard to tell but they really had great momentum and had great potential as a group such a tragedy and and such a shame 
. And also unlike Little Mix and 5th Harmony G.R.L seemed more like a Woman Group instead of a girl group and could have filled the role that the Pussycat Dolls left.
. And also unlike Little Mix and 5th Harmony G.R.L seemed more like a Woman Group instead of a girl group and could have filled the role that the Pussycat Dolls left.
Originally Posted by spaceygal:
“I don't know but it's possible. Very sad about Simone. What I want to know though is who the heck are 5th Harmony? I keep seeing their name mentioned everywhere lately with comments about them being the 'biggest girl group' around today'! Really? Where have they suddenly sprung from? I couldn't name you a single song by them whereas I could probably name ever single by Little Mix!”
“I don't know but it's possible. Very sad about Simone. What I want to know though is who the heck are 5th Harmony? I keep seeing their name mentioned everywhere lately with comments about them being the 'biggest girl group' around today'! Really? Where have they suddenly sprung from? I couldn't name you a single song by them whereas I could probably name ever single by Little Mix!”
They were Simon's pet project on the American X Factor a year or two ago before that show flopped.
Originally Posted by NoughtiesMusic:
“It was really sad what happened to Simone Battle. I truly think the music scene in general is missing girl groups. Little Mix and Fifth Harmony are flying the flag and there's probably a few others. But in the 90s and 00s there was a much bigger market for them, both US and UK. They ranged from R&B to pop and delivered awesome music.
In the US, there hasn't been a big girl group since the Pussycat Dolls, though 5H appear to be taking up that mantle. Danity Kane were big for a while but I read Diddy mismanaged them in the end. In the 90s you had TLC, En Vogue and SWV as the biggest American girl groups of that era. Then in the early 00s it was mainly Destiny's Child.
In the UK, The Saturdays will probably make a comeback at some point. I think they're on break. I don't know what happened to Stooshe though, they were interesting around 2012/13.”
“It was really sad what happened to Simone Battle. I truly think the music scene in general is missing girl groups. Little Mix and Fifth Harmony are flying the flag and there's probably a few others. But in the 90s and 00s there was a much bigger market for them, both US and UK. They ranged from R&B to pop and delivered awesome music.
In the US, there hasn't been a big girl group since the Pussycat Dolls, though 5H appear to be taking up that mantle. Danity Kane were big for a while but I read Diddy mismanaged them in the end. In the 90s you had TLC, En Vogue and SWV as the biggest American girl groups of that era. Then in the early 00s it was mainly Destiny's Child.
In the UK, The Saturdays will probably make a comeback at some point. I think they're on break. I don't know what happened to Stooshe though, they were interesting around 2012/13.”
I don't know for sure about Stooshe but I do know that two of the members dated for a bit and then broke up. So it's possibly personal problems as well as management/poor sales or chart positions that's got in the way of their career as a band.
Stooshe is still together and performing.
https://www.facebook.com/Stooshe
Stooshe are currently finishing off their sophomore album, with a release in 2015!
I think they lost big label backing.
https://www.facebook.com/Stooshe
Stooshe are currently finishing off their sophomore album, with a release in 2015!
I think they lost big label backing.
Originally Posted by NoughtiesMusic:
“It was really sad what happened to Simone Battle. I truly think the music scene in general is missing girl groups. Little Mix and Fifth Harmony are flying the flag and there's probably a few others. But in the 90s and 00s there was a much bigger market for them, both US and UK. They ranged from R&B to pop and delivered awesome music.
In the US, there hasn't been a big girl group since the Pussycat Dolls, though 5H appear to be taking up that mantle. Danity Kane were big for a while but I read Diddy mismanaged them in the end. In the 90s you had TLC, En Vogue and SWV as the biggest American girl groups of that era. Then in the early 00s it was mainly Destiny's Child.
In the UK, The Saturdays will probably make a comeback at some point. I think they're on break. I don't know what happened to Stooshe though, they were interesting around 2012/13.”
“It was really sad what happened to Simone Battle. I truly think the music scene in general is missing girl groups. Little Mix and Fifth Harmony are flying the flag and there's probably a few others. But in the 90s and 00s there was a much bigger market for them, both US and UK. They ranged from R&B to pop and delivered awesome music.
In the US, there hasn't been a big girl group since the Pussycat Dolls, though 5H appear to be taking up that mantle. Danity Kane were big for a while but I read Diddy mismanaged them in the end. In the 90s you had TLC, En Vogue and SWV as the biggest American girl groups of that era. Then in the early 00s it was mainly Destiny's Child.
In the UK, The Saturdays will probably make a comeback at some point. I think they're on break. I don't know what happened to Stooshe though, they were interesting around 2012/13.”
The 90s and 00s were the biggest times for girl groups. Apart from those you mention there was the biggest group of all, The Spice Girls in the 90s and Girls Aloud, Atomic Kitten and The Sugababes in the 00s. But in reality has there ever been a time when there has been a whole lot of girl groups? If say Stooshe or The Saturdays or MKS were to reappear alongside 5H, Little Mix (and Haim?) that would be about normal.
I thought 'Ugly Heart' was a great song and why didn't G.R.L. continue as a four-piece?
The problem with Little Mix and Fifth Harmony is that they're so childish compared to other classic girl groups. Maybe it's just the generation we live in but both of these groups are so heavily supported by social media (Tumblr and Twitter) and they seem to be completely aimed at a young age group. All the members of both groups look about 12 (except Dinah and Normani from 5H), their music is sort of cheesy and kiddy (Black Magic) and there's no sex appeal or anyone that grown women can relate to (unlike Spice Girls, Sugababes, Girls Aloud, The Saturdays etc).
Both are also backed by Simon Cowell and came from his TV talent shows so are always going to be promoted on his shows.
The reason I loved GRL was because they were very much your classic girl band. They had to start from the bottom and work hard to gain a fanbase, they were all a decent age (not too young, about early to mid 20's), they had sex appeal, they were releasing mature but hard hitting pop songs (Ugly Heart) and they had alot of character and personality. It's a real shame what happened to Simone and I genuinely do think they could have been HUGE if they carried on.
Lighthouse was a fantastic song and I understand why they split up, but to me it was also a death of the last "era" of girl bands (along with The Saturdays dissappearing) and leaving us with these Tumblr/Disney/kiddy/Simon Cowell rubbish groups.
Both are also backed by Simon Cowell and came from his TV talent shows so are always going to be promoted on his shows.
The reason I loved GRL was because they were very much your classic girl band. They had to start from the bottom and work hard to gain a fanbase, they were all a decent age (not too young, about early to mid 20's), they had sex appeal, they were releasing mature but hard hitting pop songs (Ugly Heart) and they had alot of character and personality. It's a real shame what happened to Simone and I genuinely do think they could have been HUGE if they carried on.
Lighthouse was a fantastic song and I understand why they split up, but to me it was also a death of the last "era" of girl bands (along with The Saturdays dissappearing) and leaving us with these Tumblr/Disney/kiddy/Simon Cowell rubbish groups.
Newsflash: a lot of "grown women" dont like the overtly sexy image at all. Its young gay male music stans that seem preoccupied about it.
To answer the original question, I didnt happen to think GRL was distinctive. They seemed to be yet another group formed by an industry manager per a template that would look good on paper.
To answer the original question, I didnt happen to think GRL was distinctive. They seemed to be yet another group formed by an industry manager per a template that would look good on paper.
Originally Posted by casualviewer:
“Newsflash: a lot of "grown women" dont like the overtly sexy image at all. Its young gay male music stans that seem preoccupied about it.”
“Newsflash: a lot of "grown women" dont like the overtly sexy image at all. Its young gay male music stans that seem preoccupied about it.”
I should have worded my post better. I meant that as well as having no sex appeal, there's nobody that grown women can relate to with the likes of Little Mix and Fifth Harmony. With other groups women can support them and listen to their music without feeling embarrassed (what grown woman is going to want to be seen at a Fifth Harmony concert or blast Black Magic from their car?), they can read about them in the newspapers and copy their styles and fashions, they can relate to song lyrics and music videos because they're more mature and deal with more "adult" issues etc and you just don't get that with the younger girl groups. For young kids and teenagers on Tumblr/Twitter, yes, Fifth Harmony and Little Mix are PERFECT but there needs to be an older, mature, "sexy" girl group for grown women and gays to support and listen to without it feeling wrong.
I like Fifth Harmony, but there's something missing. I don't think any of them have star power, whereas there's something interesting about all 4 Little Mix girls. They all radiate with that pop star aura.
Originally Posted by Shadow2009:
“I should have worded my post better. I meant that as well as having no sex appeal, there's nobody that grown women can relate to with the likes of Little Mix and Fifth Harmony. With other groups women can support them and listen to their music without feeling embarrassed (what grown woman is going to want to be seen at a Fifth Harmony concert or blast Black Magic from their car?)”
“I should have worded my post better. I meant that as well as having no sex appeal, there's nobody that grown women can relate to with the likes of Little Mix and Fifth Harmony. With other groups women can support them and listen to their music without feeling embarrassed (what grown woman is going to want to be seen at a Fifth Harmony concert or blast Black Magic from their car?)”
You havent been following along on the audience impressions for Black Magic. Its been resonating very strongly with women and men 30 and over, which is why Radio2 and Heart picked it up. One of the long running and most popular comments under the BM video is "Is it wrong of me as a 31 year old man..." and you can read all of the grown ups chiming in. I've been able to chronicle comments on Twitter from older listener reactions in the LM thread all along because they are so numerous.
Before the YT comments got swamped with fan war swipes, there were a fair few from women expressing how glad they were to see a pop act keeping their clothes on.
So, I dont happen to agree with your premise about a group needing the sexy image to get 25+ onboard.
Originally Posted by Shadow2009:
“The problem with Little Mix and Fifth Harmony is that they're so childish compared to other classic girl groups. Maybe it's just the generation we live in but both of these groups are so heavily supported by social media (Tumblr and Twitter) and they seem to be completely aimed at a young age group. All the members of both groups look about 12 (except Dinah and Normani from 5H), their music is sort of cheesy and kiddy (Black Magic) and there's no sex appeal or anyone that grown women can relate to (unlike Spice Girls, Sugababes, Girls Aloud, The Saturdays etc).
Both are also backed by Simon Cowell and came from his TV talent shows so are always going to be promoted on his shows.
The reason I loved GRL was because they were very much your classic girl band. They had to start from the bottom and work hard to gain a fanbase, they were all a decent age (not too young, about early to mid 20's), they had sex appeal, they were releasing mature but hard hitting pop songs (Ugly Heart) and they had alot of character and personality. It's a real shame what happened to Simone and I genuinely do think they could have been HUGE if they carried on.
Lighthouse was a fantastic song and I understand why they split up, but to me it was also a death of the last "era" of girl bands (along with The Saturdays dissappearing) and leaving us with these Tumblr/Disney/kiddy/Simon Cowell rubbish groups.”
“The problem with Little Mix and Fifth Harmony is that they're so childish compared to other classic girl groups. Maybe it's just the generation we live in but both of these groups are so heavily supported by social media (Tumblr and Twitter) and they seem to be completely aimed at a young age group. All the members of both groups look about 12 (except Dinah and Normani from 5H), their music is sort of cheesy and kiddy (Black Magic) and there's no sex appeal or anyone that grown women can relate to (unlike Spice Girls, Sugababes, Girls Aloud, The Saturdays etc).
Both are also backed by Simon Cowell and came from his TV talent shows so are always going to be promoted on his shows.
The reason I loved GRL was because they were very much your classic girl band. They had to start from the bottom and work hard to gain a fanbase, they were all a decent age (not too young, about early to mid 20's), they had sex appeal, they were releasing mature but hard hitting pop songs (Ugly Heart) and they had alot of character and personality. It's a real shame what happened to Simone and I genuinely do think they could have been HUGE if they carried on.
Lighthouse was a fantastic song and I understand why they split up, but to me it was also a death of the last "era" of girl bands (along with The Saturdays dissappearing) and leaving us with these Tumblr/Disney/kiddy/Simon Cowell rubbish groups.”
Lol Fifth Harmony have plenty of Sex appeal & loads of their songs/lyrics are sexual, I mean have you heard 'Worth it' or even seen the music video?
Disney/Kiddy is the LAST word I'd describe Fifth Harmony...
Totallty true about Little Mix though
Originally Posted by casualviewer:
“..
To answer the original question, I didnt happen to think GRL was distinctive. They seemed to be yet another group formed by an industry manager per a template that would look good on paper.”
“..
To answer the original question, I didnt happen to think GRL was distinctive. They seemed to be yet another group formed by an industry manager per a template that would look good on paper.”
It would be hard to think of a girl vocal group that weren't formed from an 'industry manager' blueprint of some sort. Indeed Little Mix and Fifth Harmony have probably had less time to get it together than many of their predecessors.
Originally Posted by Shadow2009:
“... For young kids and teenagers on Tumblr/Twitter, yes, Fifth Harmony and Little Mix are PERFECT but there needs to be an older, mature, "sexy" girl group for grown women and gays to support and listen to without it feeling wrong.”
“... For young kids and teenagers on Tumblr/Twitter, yes, Fifth Harmony and Little Mix are PERFECT but there needs to be an older, mature, "sexy" girl group for grown women and gays to support and listen to without it feeling wrong.”
I'm a lot older, straighter, alt rock-oriented and male than most Little Mix fans but I like them for a number of reasons. For a Cowell artist, they have a lot of freedom; writing their own songs, wearing what they want (they are quite sexy at times, just not overtly or all the time); they have mixed up their music with pop and R&B, they can all sing in harmony and dance; they listen to older music. Some of their songs have been concerned with female assertiveness; some have been a bit darker than the current hit single which is a slice of 80s influenced bubblegum pop, why not? They also have bit of that British quirkiness about them that US groups don't, I would give them a chance.
Originally Posted by mgvsmith:
“It would be hard to think of a girl vocal group that weren't formed from an 'industry manager' blueprint of some sort. Indeed Little Mix and Fifth Harmony have probably had less time to get it together than many of their predecessors.”
“It would be hard to think of a girl vocal group that weren't formed from an 'industry manager' blueprint of some sort. Indeed Little Mix and Fifth Harmony have probably had less time to get it together than many of their predecessors.”
I knew as I posted I'd get into trouble without elaborating further.
Yep, I'd agree that on paper, the XF girlgroups were manufactured to the hilt. In both cases (I'm assuming with 5H since I dont follow them) to the surprise of everybody including the members themselves, they were able to overcome that and forge stronger cohesiveness, which I think has been a large part of each group's success. Both groups also have strong vocals from all the members which is more unusual with modern girl groups.Where I would agree with Shadow2009's opinion is that its not so much the image as the material. Both the XF groups had earlier material that focused heavily on concerns of younger women with the self confidence issues, and IMO once they provided(ed) songs that are more universal, then they can appeal to a wider section of the public. Because let's be honest, most people just want something they can bop along to in the car or at a party. That's why BM, in Little Mix's case, is doing well with 25+. That segment is appreciative of pure Pop, and the video aids the nostalgia of the tv shows they watched in the 90s.
