I used to have a 7.1 surround system, but I rarely watch films these days and didn't want all the clutter, so I got rid of most of it (including the amp).

All I have now is just the two front speakers for listening to music and I would like an amp that will power them, but I don't have a clue about amps.

What I'm looking for is something very small and discreet, very cheap, and as "weak" as possible. I don't want too much power. I don't tend to turn my speakers up very loud.

Oh and I don't want any effects. My old Yamaha amp had so many DSPs, but all I want is direct sound from my computer to the speakers with no processing.

My speaker specs are:
nominal power 70/120w RMS
peak power 120w
freq response 50-25,000 Hz
impedance 4-8 ohms

Can anyone recommend anything?

Do your speakers have a model name on them and this will also help more?
Or can post a picture what they look like?

More importantly what kit do have that needs to deliver 2.0 stereo to the speakers. Without knowing the source(s) and what audio outputs it has how can anyone offer any advice ?

You've had an AV Receiver so you're probably aware that there are digital and analogue signal connections. 'Digital' encompasses HDMI, Optical, and digital coax. They all need some form of decoding before the signal can be amplified for the speakers.

Analogue is simpler to deal with. You'll have seen the red- and the white-phono connections on the back of the receiver when hooking up. Signals using this type of connection don't need to be decoded. Analogue also comes via different format connections too: e.g. 3.5mm jack plug and SCART. However, not all sources have analogue connections any more. TVs dropped the analogue audio outputs a few years ago. Some still have a headphone socket which will sever the same purpose, but without that then the usual connection is Optical from a TV.

The point of the paragraph above is to highlight that knowing what type of source signal(s) you need to deal with is important. There are cheap and low powered T-amps available for under £40. They only have a single analogue input though and no digital inputs at all. If your music source has an analogue audio output then happy days. But if it is digital then you'll need to up the budget.

Thanks for your replies, FM, Graham and Chris


Very sorry, I didn't think that was relevant. They are Canton CD100 speakers. I bought them 10 years ago. I think they're excellent, yet very slim and discreet. Ideally I'd like a tiny amp I can tuck away somewhere out of sight.


Very sorry again, I overlooked that detail. It's coming from my PC. A standard 2.5mm jack socket (the green one) on my motherboard. No sound card, all standard stuff.

I do like the idea of getting something very cheap and sencond hand. Is there perhaps a simple set of power specs I need to look out for, or is there more to it than that?

Could have a look at a Denon PMA720AE

http://www.richersounds.com/product/...eno-pma720-blk

Cheaper is this one

http://www.richersounds.com/product/...ae/deno-pma520

Or the MARANTZ
PM5005

http://www.richersounds.com/product/...ara-pm5005-blk

Not sure you get the best out the amps though unless you upgrade to maybe to these

http://www.richersounds.com/product/.../miss-m33i-blk

Which look pretty good for price or higher up.

There also these

http://www.richersounds.com/product/.../whar-diam-121

And higher to.

if youre not really fussed about quality etc then id just look for something under £50 on ebay thats close to you and go for that. An old arcam, denon, marantz etc...as long as they are working will be absolutely fine.

If you don't expect to run the speakers much above background listening levels then there's little point worrying about amplifier power or any kind of matching of power between the amp and speakers.

Your speakers have a sensitivity of 86.5dB per Watt per metre. That means that for 1 Watt of amplifier power and measured at 1 metre from the speaker then the sound level produced will be 86.5dB. To put that in to context, when you ran the set-up with the AV Receiver it was probably outputting enough power to make a sound at 80dB where you or the microphone were sat. If we say you were sat 4 metres from the front left speaker then your amp was generating slightly less than 1 Watt to achieve that. You don't need much power if it's just background listening.

Many of the very small T-amps have a footprint smaller than a paperback book. This is because of the circuitry they use. There's no need for the large transformer you find in conventional Hi-Fi and AV amps, hence the T-amps are about the smallest thing you can buy. Second-hand conventional Hi-Fi amps will use those large transformers too. That means they'll have the same kind of footprint as your old AV receiver. There were Hi-Fi amps made smaller than this - Mission Cyrus is the first brand that pops in to mind. However, the size reduction was only half the width of your old AV amp and they are not cheap, even second-hand.

The sound output from your laptop is analogue. The jack size is 3.5mm rather than 2.5mm as you suspect. 3.5mm is a standard size for portable headphones. I'd be extremely surprised if it were anything other than 3.5mm.

Many thanks to everyone for the excellent advice. Thanks FM!

Chris,

Thank you for your recommendation. I am definitely going to get a t-amp, that is precisely what I was looking for: very basic and small with just a power button and volume control. Absolutely perfect!

I've done a bit of research on this now. I heard the 2020-based models are the best so I think I'll probably get a Muse M20 EX2 TA2020. There are loads on eBay for under £25. But then if I went up to £130 I could get something like a second-hand Bantam Gold, which I read very good things about. (Anyone know if there would be a massive difference?)

Your explanation about power was little above my head but I get the gist, thanks. You said that the sensitivity of my speakers is 86.5dB. Where did that figure come from? Did you look it up, or is it calculated from the specs I posted? Just wondering.

Oh and you were right about my socket being 3.5mm. My mistake!

Any difference would be pretty minuscule, and most likely totally inaudible - certainly so for TV use.

Just to clarify, I'm not using it for TV or films, only for listening to music on my PC. I don't really listen to music as "basckground listening". I find music irritating if I'm doing something else (especially if I'm trying to read) and I almost always listen intently to music. Since I compose music as a hobby, it's mostly my own music I'm listening to.

I don't like it too loud, but loud enough to hear all the frequencies clearly, if that makes sense. Maybe about 70dB maximum? I am always sat about 1m away from the speakers - I wouldn't want to be any further away than that.

It's dead simple to make an amplifier that sounds pretty damn good - what makes FAR more difference is the speakers you use.

The only way to know the sensitivity of a speaker is to measure it. There is no way to calculate it from the specs. The figure is readily available with about 30secs of googling

http://www.canton.de/en/produkte/cd-100

There are plenty of small footprint amps around, for example

www.amazon.co.uk/gp/product/B00F9424X8/

Or one with a headphone output as well

http://www.amazon.co.uk/Topping-TP21...dp/B005CRLZGE/

Or a bit cheaper

http://www.amazon.co.uk/LP-2024A-Hi-.../dp/B00SATAEEA

Your original project brief was something small, discreet, low powered and very cheap. "Very cheap" is a subjective term of course, so open to broad interpretation, but I wasn't expecting it to mean up to £130 Anyway, I think it's very easy to get carried away with looking at reviews on all these little Chinese amps.

If I were in your shoes and sticking to the original brief then something along the lines of a Muse amp with an upgraded power supply would be my first step. I think that would also be far easier to source than looking for a used Bantam Gold.

Thanks again everyone, all advice has been appreciated


You're better at sticking to my brief than I am! Obviously I don't want to have to spend £100+ if there's a much cheaper model which will basically do the job. I just still can't quite get my head around the fact that you can a half-decent amp from China for under £25. That's a shock considering I paid hundreds for my old amp. Quite amazing prices! (Reminds me of the high-quality HD video camera I got from China a few years ago, also for under £25. Quite shocking prices.)


Yeah, that's the avenue I am going down, thanks so much! I am so glad you recommended t-amps. Many thanks.

By the way, any recommendations for the power supply? I see small, bog-standard ones on sale for around £10, as well as bulkier more pricey ones for over £30. Given how cheap the amp is, don't mind paying £30 for a PS but don't necessarily want extra bulk if it's not necessary.

You're just looking for a regulated power supply with more current capacity.

"Regulated" means that the power supply maintains a fairly consistent output voltage irrespective of the load from the amp. More current (Amps) won't hurt an amp. The amp draws the amount of current it needs to do the job. If the amp tries to draw more current than the PSU can supply then you'll hear that as a loss of scale in the sound. Some of the amps you've been looking at come with no power supply at all. Others might come with a small wall wart unregulated type with 12V and 2A output. Changing that to a 12V 4A or 6A version will give the amp a small reservoir of extra power to draw on.

Some amps benefit from running a slightly higher voltage too, but you need to research this carefully for the specific model you are considering as it's not a universal feature. Too much voltage will kill the amp.

I agree with this -- which makes it all the more peculiar that every reasonably-priced (read <£500) surround amp I've ever had sounds terrible in stereo mode. Surely it can't be that hard to get it right?


[/quote]

The regulation is the key.

Lots of switching supplies are very noisy, and the Tripath amps are sensitive to this.

2A is enough for a 2020 (they only deliver around 12W per channel into 8 ohms), but a good quality one is key. I use a 2.5A supply from an old Juniper firewall and it seems to deliver a very clean 12V supply. The firewall was an expensive item in its day (~£1500) so the PSU is well made.

Cheap PSUs tend to only just about deliver their rated current; I tested the Juniper device to 4A and it was still (in the short term) delivering the full current without loss of regulation.

The 2020 is rated to work to 16V. I have found with the 2050 (which is rated 24V) that the sound quality improves if the voltage is raised to around 32V, but as the max was 35 I didn't want to push it any higher.

Thank you jjne.

And many thanks Chris Frost, your technical explanations have been very helpful to me indeed. Wish I could return the favour, thanks!

OK, this should (hopefully) be my last question here. I am going to get a Muse TA2020 t-amp and separate power cable.

I'm scared about buying power cables as I don't know if I'll get the right connector for the amp. Can anyone advise on what to look for on eBay. I searched for "regulated" but what came up looked nothing like standard power cables. Am I looking in the wrong place?

You need a switch-mode supply, 12V, 2.5mm centre positive, of at least 2A.

Most of the ones on eBay will be of the cheap Chinese variety and I personally don't recommend them, having had a few blow up on me.

Could I be really cheeky and just ask if anyone could just give me a link to a suitable power supply on Amazon, eBay or somewhere? I don't want to get the wrong thing, or something which won't fit the socket. In my experience with PSUs, they have all different sizes of plugs and that confuses me. I've already ordered a Muse TA2020 and I was thinking of getting 4A or higher PSU?