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Old 31-08-2015, 22:22
*Topaz*
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I think the point is that noone ever suggests that Rav or Joe's chances of learning to dance were sabotaged by their pros incompetence whereas Laila is frequently cited on this board as a talented (in fact 'the only talented') dancer Anton has been paired who had potential to win which was scuppered by him, particularly in Latin. In reality, she got at least as far and probably much further than her ability suggested she should. Her Latin was very poor because she could not move in time to the music, pure and simple; she had no sense of rhythm and looking at almost any of her dances with an objective eye it is plain to see. She also couldn't remember routines, which was much easier to camouflage in hold, so that her Ballroom (and she had natural poise which helped here too) was much better.
I think Aliona did get quite a bit of stick for doing unsuitable QS choreography for Rav and putting a lift in his tango...and maybe Kristina also got a bit of stick for being more interested in copping off with Joe than actually teaching him....however, I'm judging from the fIrst few weeks, Laila looked a far better dancer than both of them at that point in time.

I'm not one of those people who think she could have won - I think Chris Hollins became far too popular and I doubt even with the best pro on the show she would have got to Ricky Whittle's standard, but I do think another pro might have perhaps gotten some better performances out of her, especially in Latin.
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Old 31-08-2015, 22:28
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Laila is a long way from being the most talented dancer on strictly but to say she couldn't dance for toffee is far fetched imo. Do you really think she had less natural ability than the likes of Rav Wilding and Joe Calzhage? They were contestants around her age in the same series and were eliminated well before her. She could perform the dances well enough because she was an actress, it's true she didn't always remember the steps, however I think she was a decent enough mover. I recall she was mostly praised for her ballroom - latin was a problem but even then she performed a decent enough Paso and Charleston.....whether the problem was her or Anton it's hard to tell, especially as he hasn't had anyone that can be described as a contender since her.....I have to say though, his attitude to Latin sucks....he treats it like a joke and he apparently said the samba wasn't even a dance!

I think the point is that noone ever suggests that Rav or Joe's chances of learning to dance were sabotaged by their pros incompetence whereas Laila is frequently cited on this board as a talented (in fact 'the only talented') dancer Anton has been paired who had potential to win which was scuppered by him, particularly in Latin. In reality, she got at least as far and probably much further than her ability suggested she should. Her Latin was very poor because she could not move in time to the music, pure and simple; she had no sense of rhythm and looking at almost any of her dances with an objective eye it is plain to see. She also couldn't remember routines, which was much easier to camouflage in hold, so that her Ballroom (and she had natural poise which helped here too) was much better.
Exactly. Plus my point was also about Laila being beautiful and not being a good dancer. She looked like she should be able to dance, but it was easier for many posters to blame Anton when she made mistakes. I suspect she was a nightmare to work with - and then of course the partnership blew up for very different reasons.

PS I don't think Rav was as bad as Laila, but we didn't see much of him really.
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Old 01-09-2015, 09:27
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Anton is what Strictly is all about for many people. He is the personification of kitsch with a knowing wink: pure Strictly!
Totally agree.
Anne Widdecombe lives locally to me and she's often interviewed to give her views on her Strictly experience, she holds Anton in such high regard ( a bit of a crush I think ) they're firm friends and she won't have a bad word said about him.
I love him too
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Old 01-09-2015, 09:38
DiamondDoll
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Totally agree.
Anne Widdecombe lives locally to me and she's often interviewed to give her views on her Strictly experience, she holds Anton in such high regard ( a bit of a crush I think ) they're firm friends and she won't have a bad word said about him.
I love him too

That's good to hear.
I also think Judy Murray was very close to Anton.
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Old 01-09-2015, 11:16
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I am always amused at the nonsense that is talked about Laila's natural dancing ability being hampered by Anton. Laila was attractive and younger than most of his celebs and could strike a good pose; she also had absolutely no natural sense of rhythm. Here is her jive - she is completely off beat for almost the entirety of the dance, with Anton very obviously trying to compensate and get her on track. You cannot seriously suggest she is dancing better than Anton here.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3w5tJOFQOuQ

[I will say in defence of both of them it was a tough track to dance a jive to]

At the time I clearly did not notice this ( or have forgotten ) but you are absolutely spot on.... Laila looks gorgeous but is obviously off the beat, forgetting steps etc and Anton is doing an extremely good job of keeping things flowing as best he can. Has certainly made me appreciate him more, just watching that clip.
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Old 01-09-2015, 11:24
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For all those who think Anton is such a brilliant teacher, why then do you think since Laila the producers have not entrusted him with any contestant that can be described as a contender?

He gets the older/ lazy contestants for a reason and that's because anyone with any decent potential would be wasted on him imo.......I'd still like him to get someone under the age of 40 just to see what he could do with them, but I wouldn't hold out much hope of him doing anything brilliant with them!
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Old 01-09-2015, 11:30
CaroUK
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Anton has had a couple of contenders before Laila. He had Lesley Garrett in series 1, and IMHO they were robbed of a place in the final by Chris Parker, and he finished 4th with Patsy Palmer so he CAN do well with someone with a modicum of talent and/ or musicality.

Of course, both of those were in the days before he was gifted the comedy/ older female candidates. Most of his former partners have nothing but praise for him and his teaching, and it's interesting to see that he and Erin invite their former Strictly partners back for a dance when they are on tour in the areas where they live - I saw them in Canterbury and they had Julian Clary and Lesley G dancing with them and both clearly enjoyed the experience - Anton also had Judy on their show this year.

I can see him ending up with Carol this year though - she's the oldest woman there, but that said she might be a wee bit tall for him.....
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Old 01-09-2015, 11:40
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Anton pretty much admitted on ITT at one point last year that it's not necessarily all about who dances best - and so he just concentrates on making sure his celeb enjoys themselves and the whole experience.

I reckon he'll end up with either Carol or Katie this year.
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Old 01-09-2015, 11:40
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Anton has had a couple of contenders before Laila. He had Lesley Garrett in series 1, and IMHO they were robbed of a place in the final by Chris Parker, and he finished 4th with Patsy Palmer so he CAN do well with someone with a modicum of talent and/ or musicality.

Of course, both of those were in the days before he was gifted the comedy/ older female candidates. Most of his former partners have nothing but praise for him and his teaching, and it's interesting to see that he and Erin invite their former Strictly partners back for a dance when they are on tour in the areas where they live - I saw them in Canterbury and they had Julian Clary and Lesley G dancing with them and both clearly enjoyed the experience - Anton also had Judy on their show this year.

I can see him ending up with Carol this year though - she's the oldest woman there, but that said she might be a wee bit tall for him.....
Those first few series were a long time ago now and from what I've read on here the series were less competitive back then. It's now been six years since he had Laila and it just seems weird that if he's the brilliant teacher that some of his fans insist he is, the producers have not entrusted him with anyone that can be described as a contender since then.
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Old 01-09-2015, 12:04
jiroos
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Those first few series were a long time ago now and from what I've read on here the series were less competitive back then. It's now been six years since he had Laila and it just seems weird that if he's the brilliant teacher that some of his fans insist he is, the producers have not entrusted him with anyone that can be described as a contender since then.
As made clear in my (very lengthy) post above, it is nothing to do with whether Anton is a good teacher or not. It is simply now part of Strictly tradition that Anton gets the comedy duffer - hence why everyone is predicting Carol or Katie for him rather than Georgia, Helen or Jamelia. Okay, even if he is the crap teacher some think he is, why not give him a predicted middling contestant like Kellie and see which way it goes??

Personally, I would love him to succeed with a contender to prove all of his detractors wrong.
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Old 01-09-2015, 12:11
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As made clear in my (very lengthy) post above, it is nothing to do with whether Anton is a good teacher or not. It is simply now part of Strictly tradition that Anton gets the comedy duffer - hence why everyone is predicting Carol or Katie for him rather than Georgia, Helen or Jamelia. Okay, even if he is the crap teacher some think he is, why not give him a predicted middling contestant like Kellie and see which way it goes??

Personally, I would love him to succeed with a contender to prove all of his detractors wrong.
I don't agree, surely they would given him a break from the duffers at least once in the last six years if they felt confident he could handle a contender - I think his teaching is sufficient enough for less able contestants and maybe ok enough for a middler but not a contender.
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Old 01-09-2015, 12:15
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Anton pretty much admitted on ITT at one point last year that it's not necessarily all about who dances best - and so he just concentrates on making sure his celeb enjoys themselves and the whole experience.

I reckon he'll end up with either Carol or Katie this year.
From what he said in the interview at the time of the fall out from the John Sargent affair, he realised that pretty much in season one . It took Erin until Austin and Brendan until at least Lisa and I'm not sure that James truly ever did.
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Old 01-09-2015, 12:25
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Those first few series were a long time ago now and from what I've read on here the series were less competitive back then. It's now been six years since he had Laila and it just seems weird that if he's the brilliant teacher that some of his fans insist he is, the producers have not entrusted him with anyone that can be described as a contender since then.
Anyone who saw Brendan with Sarah Manners or James with Georgina would not think the early series were any less competitive at all.

It's weird that if he is as bad as all that, that he keeps getting rehired when other pros have fallen by the wayside. His average finishing position is 8th - and Brendan's is 6th which given the disparity in the ability they generally have to deal with is actually closer than I thought it would be.

I said before, I'm not the biggest Anton fan - but he fulfills the role that the Powers that Be ask him to.
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Old 01-09-2015, 12:37
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Anyone who saw Brendan with Sarah Manners or James with Georgina would not think the early series were any less competitive at all.

It's weird that if he is as bad as all that, that he keeps getting rehired when other pros have fallen by the wayside. His average finishing position is 8th - and Brendan's is 6th which given the disparity in the ability they generally have to deal with is actually closer than I thought it would be.

I said before, I'm not the biggest Anton fan - but he fulfills the role that the Posers that Be ask him to.
I didn't watch the early series, I did watch James first series and I thought he behaved like a bit of an a*se....so nothing much has changed there. I'm just going by what I've read on here that the later series were more competitive.

I think Anton is hired more for the 'personality' he brings to the show, I've got nothing against him, I know he fulfils a certain role - I just think it's far fetched some of his fans seemingly saying Laila was such a worthless dancer and he was so brilliant to put up with her! Well if he's such a brilliant teacher then why won't they give him a break from the duffers and give him another chance with a contender?
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Old 01-09-2015, 12:59
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I didn't watch the early series, I did watch James first series and I thought he behaved like a bit of an a*se....so nothing much has changed there. I'm just going by what I've read on here that the later series were more competitive.

I think Anton is hired more for the 'personality' he brings to the show, Ive got nothing against him, I know he fulfils a certain role - I just think it's far fetched some of his fans seemingly saying Laila was such a worthless dancer and he was so brilliant to put up with her! Well if he's such a brilliant teacher then why won't they give him a break from the duffers and give him another chance with a contender?
I didn't think that people were saying that as such - just that the reverse of Laila being Queen of the Dance and held back by Anton wasn't right either.

She was a middling dancer who had issues with timing and who finished 4th. Granted it wasn't a stellar year, but 4th behind the eventual winner of Chris, Ricky and Ali wasn't too shabby all things considered.
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Old 01-09-2015, 13:09
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I didn't think that people were saying that as such - just that the reverse of Laila being Queen of the Dance and held back by Anton wasn't right either.

She was a middling dancer who had issues with timing and who finished 4th. Granted it wasn't a stellar year, but 4th behind the eventual winner of Chris, Ricky and Ali wasn't too shabby all things considered.
One of the posters above said 'she couldn't dance for toffee' and the subtext of some others posts seemed to be saying he was a complete Saint for putting up with her and covering up her mistakes! Any pro worth their salt knows you should try and hide the mistakes of your partner the best you can......I think it's just as wrong to try and paint Laila as some difficult, diva like duffer!
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Old 01-09-2015, 13:20
jiroos
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I don't agree, surely they would given him a break from the duffers at least once in the last six years if they felt confident he could handle a contender - I think his teaching is sufficient enough for less able contestants and maybe ok enough for a middler but not a contender.
THE PTB do as they want - no questions asked. Hell, if they wanted to put Anton with a bloke this year, they would.

No saying he would accept it tho'!!!
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Old 01-09-2015, 13:47
holly berry
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Anton wouldn't bat an eyelid at dancing with a man ...

or probably even a cadaver
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Old 02-09-2015, 00:50
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One of the posters above said 'she couldn't dance for toffee' and the subtext of some others posts seemed to be saying he was a complete Saint for putting up with her and covering up her mistakes! Any pro worth their salt knows you should try and hide the mistakes of your partner the best you can......I think it's just as wrong to try and paint Laila as some difficult, diva like duffer!
Why are you taking my "couldn't dance for toffee" comment out context when it has already been clarified for you? Is it beyond belief Anton was hiding her mistakes where possible? Actually, I do think Laila was a duffer and difficult to teach. I wouldn't say she was difficult in the diva sense though and haven't got the impression anyone else has suggested she was.

I'm not going to repeat what has been said several times before about why Anton will not be given a contender because you clearly have such a low opinion of his abilities it would be a waste of time.

Not sure what you have read on here that gave you the impression that the early series were not competitive because they were probably even more so than now, maybe because sportsmen were leading the field or something. James and Brendan used to be the worst though, competing on and off the dance floor - as we saw on ITT many times. The changes in the production of the show from Series 5/6 onwards are probably the reason for the show being less of a competition now.

And it's easy to slate James these days, but plenty of posters will tell you Georgina and James clashed because of her poor attitude to learning to dance. She wasn't prepared for how hard she needed to work and James wanted to do well in his first series. Yes, he said something inappropriate about her weight, but she was a bit of a diva and difficult to work with.

BTW I like Anton, but I am not a fan. It is possible to say something positive about someone without being a fan.
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Old 02-09-2015, 06:18
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Why are you taking my "couldn't dance for toffee" comment out context when it has already been clarified for you? Is it beyond belief Anton was hiding her mistakes where possible? Actually, I do think Laila was a duffer and difficult to teach. I wouldn't say she was difficult in the diva sense though and haven't got the impression anyone else has suggested she was.

I'm not going to repeat what has been said several times before about why Anton will not be given a contender because you clearly have such a low opinion of his abilities it would be a waste of time.

Not sure what you have read on here that gave you the impression that the early series were not competitive because they were probably even more so than now, maybe because sportsmen were leading the field or something. James and Brendan used to be the worst though, competing on and off the dance floor - as we saw on ITT many times. The changes in the production of the show from Series 5/6 onwards are probably the reason for the show being less of a competition now.

And it's easy to slate James these days, but plenty of posters will tell you Georgina and James clashed because of her poor attitude to learning to dance. She wasn't prepared for how hard she needed to work and James wanted to do well in his first series. Yes, he said something inappropriate about her weight, but she was a bit of a diva and difficult to work with.

BTW I like Anton, but I am not a fan. It is possible to say something positive about someone without being a fan.
Is Anton really worth getting worked up about? Or even James who I only made a passing comment about..... If you think Laila was a 'duffer' then it hardly matters that I repeated your 'can't dance for toffee' comment. I got the impression you thought she was a diva because you said you suspected 'she was a nightmare' to work with - can't quote it because you've quoted it within a post.....it's also the impression I get from other Anton supporters when discussing his partnership with Laila over the years......they think if they try and put all the blame on Laila for the problems within that partnership - he comes out of it smelling of roses. I didn't dispute he hid some of her mistakes..... I just don't think it makes him unique for doing so.
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Old 03-09-2015, 20:24
TerryM22
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Totally agree.
Anne Widdecombe lives locally to me and she's often interviewed to give her views on her Strictly experience, she holds Anton in such high regard ( a bit of a crush I think ) they're firm friends and she won't have a bad word said about him.
I love him too

As we know Anne Widdecombe is a lady with exquisite taste, the amazing Anton is a lovely man as well as being a great all round ballroom dancer who posseses a very wide range of dancing talents and as we also know he is an excellent teacher.

When you next see dear Anne please give her a big Hi from Terry and her legions of Strictly Come Dancing fans, please let her know that we have been lobbying hard to get the producers to give her a special role in this years series, thank you so much.
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Old 03-09-2015, 23:28
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As we know Anne Widdecombe is a lady with exquisite taste, the amazing Anton is a lovely man as well as being a great all round ballroom dancer who posseses a very wide range of dancing talents and as we also know he is an excellent teacher.

When you next see dear Anne please give her a big Hi from Terry and her legions of Strictly Come Dancing fans, please let her know that we have been lobbying hard to get the producers to give her a special role in this years series, thank you so much.
I wholeheartedly agree! Great to see you again Terry.
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Old 04-09-2015, 07:48
sofakat
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How come Anton du Beke has survived the strictly cull of pro dancers these last few years??
I am mystified. They say he is popular, but that must be with a very ageing crowd of nice women with tight perms who like their men to be a bit dull and anodyne. He is so 1975.

In the last two years he has looked utterly bored all the way through. He is now a bit of a joke and plays up to it.

Yes, his ballroom used to be beautiful - used to be. His Latin is a joke and so is his choreography. He cannot jive at all or do 'passion'.

He's like a tired civil servant waiting for his pension.

He MUST have something on the BBC ...
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Old 04-09-2015, 08:12
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I am mystified. They say he is popular, but that must be with a very ageing crowd of nice women with tight perms who like their men to be a bit dull and anodyne. He is so 1975.

In the last two years he has looked utterly bored all the way through. He is now a bit of a joke and plays up to it.

Yes, his ballroom used to be beautiful - used to be. His Latin is a joke and so is his choreography. He cannot jive at all or do 'passion'.

He's like a tired civil servant waiting for his pension.

He MUST have something on the BBC ...
Yet Brendan (The Shelf) Cole has also survived and avoided older more curvy contestants.
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Old 04-09-2015, 12:27
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I am mystified. They say he is popular, but that must be with a very ageing crowd of nice women with tight perms who like their men to be a bit dull and anodyne. He is so 1975.

In the last two years he has looked utterly bored all the way through. He is now a bit of a joke and plays up to it.

Yes, his ballroom used to be beautiful - used to be. His Latin is a joke and so is his choreography. He cannot jive at all or do 'passion'.

He's like a tired civil servant waiting for his pension.

He MUST have something on the BBC ...


I couldn't agree more
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