And Jenna hates people who bitch and are two-faced,

Thanks for the apology Alrightmate. Appreciated but probably I didn't express my self well.

Agree with you too.

It can be funny and it is a huge part of human nature. We all do it. Those of that sign up to DS arguably more than most.

I don't mind seeing it in the mix, far from it but I do think it is has a very different effect on the human psyche compared to humour and such like.

When there is inevitable aggro in the house there reaction is a bit like the reaction at the school gates, everyone (us) runs shouting "fight fight", to get a good view of the action.

It can be exciting (entertaining) and it can shake more out than the actual substance of the fight (bitching) . But when the fight is over the psyche isn't left satisfied. The fight resolves little, nothing is changed by it and if anything it tends to open more issues than it closes. So the internal appetite is left unfulfilled and wanting more. No matter how much you consume, satisfaction doesn't come so the niggling feeling of wanting more lives on.

Humour and laughter are different in that they bring their own closure. You don't want to have the same laugh indefinitely or even twice. You may want more laughs but there is no pull to perpetuate the same one. So it tends to provide its own closure in a way that arguing and fighting doesn't.

It appears bitching is only Funny when its your fav that's doing it.

You'd be the first to complain if Natasha bitched about Farrah to be fair.

I think it was a terrible vote to have those two together, would have preferred Farrah and Bobby in there and maybe Farrah hear Jenna bitch about her, that would have been better, but those two being separated from the house is too obvious, would have been better to have split them up

I think what they are trying to say is a lot of people are sick and tired of BB choosing to show us 2 nasty vile women over the other housemates having fun.
If you remove the negativity,of course the mood will change,

Those 2 women have brought the house down to its knees with their back biting bitchiness.

I agree but that is what I was meaning I was being balanced believe it or not. They all bitch people need to accept it.

I've watched all but one of the live shows, and I strongly disagree.

Even the rest of your post treats it as different, but tries to attribute it to things like "before this, they were afraid that the spotlight wasn't on them".

Before this, they had the continual tension and threat of another eruption caused by Jenna and even more Farrah. With those two removed, that was gone.

Last night's live show confirmed my view that this CBB would be far better, for me as a viewer, if Jenna and Farrah were out for the rest of the series, and not just as a fake-eviction twist. We finally got to see what the house would be like without them, and it was good.

But Jenna says she is real and does not Bitch, back stab and is not two-faced, just hope she will watch the Show back, but then again she is always right and will not see any wrong in what she says and does,

Well she is wrong imo.

Bit of a sweeping statement - 'perfect' ??? I don't think anyone in the history of the show has ever expected anyone to be perfect.

It's unimportant that they all bitch (if they even really do).

Some of them bitch more more than others, or much more continually, or much more poisonously in its manner or effects -- and that's far more significant.

Perfectly put.

With all due respect there is no way you know who bitches the most unless you have L/F I would have more respect if you said you suspect. You are experienced enough to know that BB can manipulate the edit of any h/m to suit their agenda.

I really do not think it is possible to edit a LF that shows J and F in the private room bitching about every single thing they are seeing. Every single thing.

Funny you don't remember that when you discuss Natasha. Or is it only a factor when your favorite is criticized?

I have never accused anyone being a bigger bitch than another if you are going to continue to attack me as a f/m I will take steps to make sure I never see it. I have been on here far to long to deal with that rubbish.

I think it's valid to 'complain' about someone bitching if they're hailed as a housemate who is seen to be squeaky clean.

Sure, Farrah and Jenna bitch, but most of the others certainly do.
Yet one group is presented as 'good' and the other group presented as 'bad'.

I think it's also a misconception that ALL Farrah and Jenna do is bitch and have no fun.
This is probably the biggest misconception, because I've certainly see them having fun with other housemates, especially Jenna who seems to generally get on well with many of them as well.
Farrah is certainly nowhere near as bad as she was nearly a week ago. Which suggests to me that she might be at least trying to not get so hotheaded to some extent.

Who is saying that Natasha is squeaky clean The point that is consistently being made whether true or not is that Jenna and Farrah bitch more than anyone other HM including Natasha. I agree with that premise. Maybe you and others think Natasha or another HM bitches more but surely that is the only pertinent and relevant argument?

But that is not the same issue.

Regardless of how well viewers can tell what's really going on, some HMs do bitch etc in ways that have a much more deleterious effects than others.

It's then up to us as viewers to make our best judgement about what's really happening, based on what BB lets us see, but also based on what we've learned about BB and BB editing over the years including years when we had a 24/7 live feed.

Even a full, 24/7 live feed does automatically settle such things for us. Viewers used to disagree, sometimes radically, even when watching the very same live footage.

Last night's live feed was an interesting experiment. Remove Farrah and Jenna so that the HMs think they're free of them, and see what happens. I think conformed the view that Farrah and Jenna had a very negative effect on the house. The atmosphere was very different, and as MsBehaviour said, it highlighted what an emotional drain Farrah and Jenna have been.

It was fun, and the thread was fun. A weight lifted from the house.

I think the problem with Jenna and Farrah bitching is that they are so blindly hypocritical about it.

The shout about 'being real' and 'fake assed bitches', whilst actually being WORSE than the others.

Not that the others don't bitch, it's the level of hypocrisy and lack of self awareness, coupled with self justification and vitriol.

It's really unpleasant.

Indeed, and some of us forum members too

It's not the fact of their constant bitching, and it's not that they are the only HMs who bitch. It's that their bitching lacks style, wit, intelligence, and originality, which just makes it tedious in the extreme.