DS Forums

 
 

James: "Keep your friends close and your enemies closer".


Reply
Thread Tools Search this Thread
Old 20-09-2015, 22:59
patsylimerick
Forum Member
 
Join Date: Sep 2010
Posts: 18,703
But it does.

As I said, there are plenty of posts from supporters of James that describe the behaviours/traits of his which they admire and support - that is your explanation for why he is well liked right there!

Yet, despite this, you still feel it has something to do with his appearance, which pretty much no supporters have mentioned.

I'm really sorry but I don't understand that logic.
With respect, I don't understand yours. He's a blatantly - self-admittedly - duplicitious game player. And these are qualities that you think viewers admire these behaviours/traits? I mean, I get that people like game players like Aaron, who did it with a modicum of wit.

You're saying that he chose Janice because he wanted Farrah out. And you're acknowledging that he then delivered quite a few quite nausea-inducing sermons about his grandfather and fragile wee Chloe Jasmine. And that's the kind of behaviour that you're suggesting indicates that people like him because of his behaviour and not his looks?
patsylimerick is offline   Reply With Quote
Please sign in or register to remove this advertisement.
Old 20-09-2015, 23:01
trevor tiger
Forum Member
 
Join Date: Jan 2012
Posts: 22,733
Not really, this is the end and he is going for the win... Austin is now his rival and he also doesn't need Austin now , he's at the end and in the top 4 (confirmed on Friday) . No Austin and James had no story line ... James needed a romance or a bromance for airtime but it's the end of the show and so...the end of Austin .
Exactly he is honing in for the win now and has to annihilate Austin whilst also coming across as well mannered and decent. I cannot stand the guy but he is playing a blinder. Someone mentioned that James reminded them of a Patrick Bateman type figure which I didn't get at the time but now I truly, truly do.
trevor tiger is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 20-09-2015, 23:06
Bacon&Eggs
Forum Member
 
Join Date: Nov 2011
Posts: 4,806
I suppose I am a tad defensive because the fact that you are wondering whether I am blind supporter of James despite the fact that I stated my opinion was made via context, makes me think that you are out to make assumptions about James supporters and are only interested in shouting them down. The very fact that I added the part about context to my opinion should tell you I'm not a blind supporter of James, or indeed anyone.

I have an issue with posters who make assumptions about others and their reasoning/levels of support, especially when there's no evidence for it. I also prefer to engage in debate where both parties actually form their own opinion from the source (in this case, the HL spoilers, but usually the show itself), rather than one poster asking another to clarify their opinion due to their own assumptions.

After my original post, had you gone away and read the HL spoilers, set out your opinion and then asked me to elaborate on mine, we would have had a perfectly pleasant and reasonable discussion. Instead you offered an opinion that really had no basis, and actually came across as an attempt to potentially belittle mine, and continued to ask me for the context/my opinion of the context because you had unfounded doubts about me as a poster.

As stated, I gave you no reason to wonder whether I'm a blind follower of James (and indeed, neither should my previous posts), so to me it very much seems that you potentially lack respect for anyone who might post in favour of James and perhaps you might have an automatic bias against them. I don't really feel like having to defend my status as someone who supports James - I'd rather have a discussion about the actual events, not my own opinion and why you feel that might be wrong (without even forming your own first).
BiB - If my enquiry came across as assuming then that's not my fault. Lets both read back and spot this offending assumption shall we....................... ok lets put it down to you being far to precious about your opinion and how dare anyone question it's basis.

I'll not waste time responding to the remainder since it's mostly based on the above misapprehension. Again i inquired as to the basis of your opinion at which point you became defensive. I do wonder why.
Bacon&Eggs is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 20-09-2015, 23:10
Mrs Checks
Forum Member
 
Join Date: May 2014
Posts: 3,770
With respect, I don't understand yours. He's a blatantly - self-admittedly - duplicitious game player. And these are qualities that you think viewers admire these behaviours/traits? I mean, I get that people like game players like Aaron, who did it with a modicum of wit.

You're saying that he chose Janice because he wanted Farrah out. And you're acknowledging that he then delivered quite a few quite nausea-inducing sermons about his grandfather and fragile wee Chloe Jasmine. And that's the kind of behaviour that you're suggesting indicates that people like him because of his behaviour and not his looks?
I think you're missing the logic of my point perhaps because you are too ingrained in your dislike of James? Correct me if I'm wrong, but your post comes across very much as if you believe only your assessment of James could be correct?

My point is quite clear - people have expressed here why they like James. You may not agree, but their opinions are valid (as are yours) and they will be your explanation as to why he is popular. Just as someone may read your posts and see them as reasoning of why people dislike him. As stated, we all see things differently - our opinions are informed by our own experiences, after all.

As for my own views, I gave you reasoning why I like him. I can still find faults in him (minor, in my opinion) while having a positive opinion of him overall.

Do you tend to approach your evaluation of HM in a black and white way? With your posts and your admittance that you are still against Natasha & Austin due to the first few days, I'm inclined to think so. Apologies if I'm wrong.

I approach my assessment of HM in the opposite way (I change my mind a lot and I can find fault in housemates but still like them, or like certain behaviours/traits of housemates I dislike overall). Perhaps that's why you're missing my point? We're just not on the same wavelength?
Mrs Checks is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 20-09-2015, 23:11
lee_mccleary
Forum Member
 
Join Date: Jan 2015
Posts: 636
Biggest game player in the house. He has his eyes on the prize.
lee_mccleary is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 20-09-2015, 23:14
patsylimerick
Forum Member
 
Join Date: Sep 2010
Posts: 18,703
I think you're missing the logic of my point perhaps because you are too ingrained in your dislike of James? Correct me if I'm wrong, but your post comes across very much as if you believe only your assessment of James could be correct?

My point is quite clear - people have expressed here why they like James. You may not agree, but their opinions are valid (as are yours) and they will be your explanation as to why he is popular. Just as someone may read your posts and see them as reasoning of why people dislike him. As stated, we all see things differently - our opinions are informed by our own experiences, after all.

As for my own views, I gave you reasoning why I like him. I can still find faults in him (minor, in my opinion) while having a positive opinion of him overall.

Do you tend to approach your evaluation of HM in a black and white way? With your posts and your admittance that you are still against Natasha & Austin due to the first few days, I'm inclined to think so. Apologies if I'm wrong.

I approach my assessment of HM in the opposite way (I change my mind a lot and I can find fault in housemates but still like them, or like certain behaviours/traits of housemates I dislike overall). Perhaps that's why you're missing my point? We're just not on the same wavelength?
None of this answers the question I'm asking you, does it? (you've starting discussing the poster, not the post, which is never a good look).

I'll put it in black and white if you want.

James picked Janice though he KNEW, 100%, that Chloe would do so.

He said afterwards - quite forcefully and with a monumental amount of transparent cheese - that he did this because of his grandfather and because Chloe is quite fragile. Yet you acknowledge that he did it because he wanted rid of Farrah.

Then you say that it is his behaviour and not his looks that appeals to people. I'm asking if it's the behaviour outlined above that you think appeals to people.
patsylimerick is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 20-09-2015, 23:18
erin_p
Forum Member
 
Join Date: Jul 2013
Posts: 24,531
I have a feeling the nominations have been shown to the house

10.32pm: Jenna says James' behaviour towards Austin has been "ugly"

10.48pm: The housemates are STILL talking about nominations
erin_p is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 20-09-2015, 23:19
Penny Crayon
Forum Member
 
Join Date: Feb 2008
Posts: 20,498
it's an expression. I don't suppose he really sees them as 'enemies' it's just something you say isn't it? The way they had just been gunning for him they were like the 'enemy' at that particular time.
Penny Crayon is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 20-09-2015, 23:28
robborocks
Forum Member
 
Join Date: Feb 2007
Posts: 2,055
it's an expression. I don't suppose he really sees them as 'enemies' it's just something you say isn't it? The way they had just been gunning for him they were like the 'enemy' at that particular time.
Agree with this.
robborocks is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 20-09-2015, 23:28
Mrs Checks
Forum Member
 
Join Date: May 2014
Posts: 3,770
None of this answers the question I'm asking you, does it? (you've starting discussing the poster, not the post, which is never a good look).

I'll put it in black and white if you want.

James picked Janice though he KNEW, 100%, that Chloe would do so.

He said afterwards - quite forcefully and with a monumental amount of transparent cheese - that he did this because of his grandfather and because Chloe is quite fragile. Yet you acknowledge that he did it because he wanted rid of Farrah.

Then you say that it is his behaviour and not his looks that appeals to people. I'm asking if it's the behaviour outlined above that you think appeals to people.
I'm really sorry Patsy, but I don't understand what you're getting at.

I gave you my personal opinion on these events in my earlier post. I can't speak for any other supporters of James, but the posts are out there I'm sure.

I can't give you one definitive answer as to why everyone who likes James made that decision, or how they feel about the behaviours you've outlined above. That's EXACTLY why I told you that the way you'd find out why James is popular is by reading his supporters' opinions.

I've questioned you as a poster because I'm genuinely confused. With all due respect, I can't understand where you are coming from and I was trying to figure out why we seem to be missing each other's points. I really don't want to argue with you so I suspect the best thing to do is to leave it there - all I can think is that we have very different ways of approaching this (and I do not mean that as a slight).
Mrs Checks is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 20-09-2015, 23:54
Penny Crayon
Forum Member
 
Join Date: Feb 2008
Posts: 20,498
None of this answers the question I'm asking you, does it? (you've starting discussing the poster, not the post, which is never a good look).

I'll put it in black and white if you want.

James picked Janice though he KNEW, 100%, that Chloe would do so.

He said afterwards - quite forcefully and with a monumental amount of transparent cheese - that he did this because of his grandfather and because Chloe is quite fragile. Yet you acknowledge that he did it because he wanted rid of Farrah.

Then you say that it is his behaviour and not his looks that appeals to people. I'm asking if it's the behaviour outlined above that you think appeals to people.

Is that ^^ such a terrible thing? In the grand scheme of things what is so treacharous about it? He was forced to make a decision (really quickly) he made his decision and gave his reasons. Maybe he wasn't 100% clear in his own head he just went with his gut feeling in the twenty seconds/minute that he had.

He hasn't shouted at people, he hasn't sworn at them - he hasn't been in any way aggressive - I think that's what appeals. We don't know what his thought processes were - he has tried to explain - whatever they were I don't think it makes him a bad person.
Penny Crayon is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 21-09-2015, 00:41
Bacon&Eggs
Forum Member
 
Join Date: Nov 2011
Posts: 4,806
it's an expression. I don't suppose he really sees them as 'enemies' it's just something you say isn't it? The way they had just been gunning for him they were like the 'enemy' at that particular time.
He was responding to Natasha telling him to keep clear of Jenna & Austin since they were ganging up on him... his response:

"Keep your friends close and your enemies closer."

It could be said as an expression or as a statement of intent. I'm not really sure what to make of it alongside the context but to read it as an expression is to give him the benefit of the doubt imo. Maybe he gets the b-o-d time after time because of his looks.
Bacon&Eggs is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 21-09-2015, 00:49
Penny Crayon
Forum Member
 
Join Date: Feb 2008
Posts: 20,498
He was responding to Natasha telling him to keep clear of Jenna & Austin since they were ganging up on him... his response:

"Keep your friends close and your enemies closer."

It could be said as an expression or as a statement of intent. I'm not really sure what to make of it alongside the context. To read it as an expression, though, is to give him the benefit of the doubt. Maybe he gets it time after time because of his looks.
Benefit of the doubt about what exactly. Whether he said it as an expression or a statement of intent what's so bad about it. They have been on and on at him for days - I should think he's feeling very ganged up on for simply daring to make a decision that they didn't agree with. This time last week Jenna was nominating him with venomous glee.

He said this in response to Natasha telling him to move to another bed. I see it very much as he can't be doing with the 'fall out' if he does that.

This really is nothing to do with looks. It's pretty pathetic (I think) that people keep bringing it up. I think James is favoured (along with some others) for being civil to everyone and not screeching, swearing and throwing insults at the drop of a hat.
Penny Crayon is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 21-09-2015, 01:14
Bacon&Eggs
Forum Member
 
Join Date: Nov 2011
Posts: 4,806
Benefit of the doubt about what exactly. Whether he said it as an expression or a statement of intent what's so bad about it. They have been on and on at him for days - I should think he's feeling very ganged up on for simply daring to make a decision that they didn't agree with. This time last week Jenna was nominating him with venomous glee.

He said this in response to Natasha telling him to move to another bed. I see it very much as he can't be doing with the 'fall out' if he does that.

This really is nothing to do with looks. It's pretty pathetic (I think) that people keep bringing it up. I think James is favoured (along with some others) for being civil to everyone and not screeching, swearing and throwing insults at the drop of a hat.
Well on the one hand maybe it's an expression and not to be taken literally - like you said you doubt he see's them as his enemies. A very early poster suggested perhaps he was trying to save face. On the other hand perhaps it's a statement of intent or a tactic to win the game "I will keep my enemies close in order to defeat them"

I don't see too much "bad" about either except if he's playing a game someone needs to inform his fans because they seem oblivious.

I don't see how you arrive at your interpretation (bib2), are you saying the sentiment behind it was to peace-keep?
Bacon&Eggs is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 21-09-2015, 01:25
Penny Crayon
Forum Member
 
Join Date: Feb 2008
Posts: 20,498
Well on the one hand maybe it's an expression and not to be taken literally - like you said you doubt he see's them as his enemies. A very early poster suggested perhaps he was trying to save face. On the other hand perhaps it's a statement of intent or a tactic to win the game "I will keep my enemies close in order to defeat them"

I don't see too much "bad" about either except if he's playing a game someone needs to inform his fans because they seem oblivious.

I don't see how you arrive at your interpretation (bib2), are you saying the sentiment behind it was to peace-keep?
They are all playing a game it's called Big Brother. Some play it prettier than others.
Penny Crayon is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 21-09-2015, 01:37
Bacon&Eggs
Forum Member
 
Join Date: Nov 2011
Posts: 4,806
They are all playing a game it's called Big Brother. Some play it prettier than others.
Ok so this statement relates to tactics? A minute a go you said it was a peace keeping exercise. You're giving me whiplash
Bacon&Eggs is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 21-09-2015, 02:09
Penny Crayon
Forum Member
 
Join Date: Feb 2008
Posts: 20,498
Ok so this statement relates to tactics? A minute a go you said it was a peace keeping exercise. You're giving me whiplash
I simply said the 'enemy' speech was a statement.

I never said he wasn't playing a game. They're all playing a game - some play it more ferociously, maliciously and ugly. I believe they all have an idea how they're going to 'play' it in the house - they'd be foolish not to give it any thought.

Some play it with venom and spite and can be cruel. I haven't seen that in James - he has been respectful and genuinely tried to keep the peace.

I don't go along with those who screech and swear in the name of 'being real' or 'telling it as it is'. I don't like dirty tricks when they try to make themselves look good by making others look bad.

They all play a game in their own way but it's not full on 24/7(except maybe Jenna) - sometimes (as in the enemy speech) they're simply having an honest conversation.
Penny Crayon is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 21-09-2015, 07:40
patsylimerick
Forum Member
 
Join Date: Sep 2010
Posts: 18,703
I'm really sorry Patsy, but I don't understand what you're getting at.

I gave you my personal opinion on these events in my earlier post. I can't speak for any other supporters of James, but the posts are out there I'm sure.

I can't give you one definitive answer as to why everyone who likes James made that decision, or how they feel about the behaviours you've outlined above. That's EXACTLY why I told you that the way you'd find out why James is popular is by reading his supporters' opinions.

I've questioned you as a poster because I'm genuinely confused. With all due respect, I can't understand where you are coming from and I was trying to figure out why we seem to be missing each other's points. I really don't want to argue with you so I suspect the best thing to do is to leave it there - all I can think is that we have very different ways of approaching this (and I do not mean that as a slight).
OK, if you don't see where I'm coming from at this stage, you're not going to. No problem.

Is that ^^ such a terrible thing? In the grand scheme of things what is so treacharous about it? He was forced to make a decision (really quickly) he made his decision and gave his reasons. Maybe he wasn't 100% clear in his own head he just went with his gut feeling in the twenty seconds/minute that he had.

He hasn't shouted at people, he hasn't sworn at them - he hasn't been in any way aggressive - I think that's what appeals. We don't know what his thought processes were - he has tried to explain - whatever they were I don't think it makes him a bad person.
I never said there was anything 'treacherous' about it. I also don't think it's 'treacherous' to shout the odds. I find James extraordinarily disingenuous. I also find him very dull. I don't think 'he hasn't been aggressive' should be enough for a winner. Mind you, given the competition, I don't know what would make a winner this year.

I'm kind of left with Janice, only because she's made me laugh quite a bit and I think she is showing the viewer pretty much what she is.

I've got a major issue with James having convictions for assault - including biting a man's ear - yet presenting a butter wouldn't melt, Kofi Annan, persona in the house. It just doesn't sit anywhere near right.
patsylimerick is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 21-09-2015, 09:51
sheils1
Forum Member
 
Join Date: May 2006
Posts: 13,776
So after Natasha suggested that James moved beds he responded with "Keep your friends close and your enemies closer". So James is playing Austin? If so you can call me another former James fan. I've met James before and he was great, so I automatically voted to save him when I could. But these past few days have put me off of him.
Agree with you, he sees Austin as his main threat, after all Austin was in the top four Friday night.

Yep he has played Austin, now he is being a nasty bitch.

Really gone off him now.
sheils1 is offline   Reply With Quote
 
Reply



Thread Tools Search this Thread
Search this Thread:

Advanced Search

 
Forum Jump


All times are GMT. The time now is 07:39.