Do I want a Smart tv?

Virgil Tracy · 22-09-2015, 13:25

I'm about to buy a new tv , gonna spend between 250 - £300 , essentials are - Freeview HD , about 40" , I'd like a really good picture quality and decent sound from the tv itself , don't wanna have to add things .

but I've noticed that for little extra I can get a smart tv , but do I want it ?

does smart tv produce HD pictures ? is it a pain to organise with downloads, cables , apps etc.? does it buffer a lot ?

I'm not exactly a technophobe but I like to avoid things that I don't really need .

Chasing Shadows · 22-09-2015, 13:33

Quote:

Originally Posted by Virgil Tracy

does smart tv produce HD pictures ?

If you're watching an app that produces HD pictures, then yes. Amazon and Netflix and BBC iPlayer and 4 OD all broadcast high definition. Some Youtube videos are HD, others are SD. Whether some of the freebie apps, that show old straight-to-video movies (Popcorn and the like) do is not so obvious. The majority of games installed on our smart TV have fairly simple graphics - and are often designed to be played on an android tablet or phone. In which case, they won't necessarily be high definition.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Virgil Tracy

is it a pain to organise with downloads, cables , apps etc.? does it buffer a lot ?

If you connect it to your router via a network cable - then its one extra cable. If you use Wifi, it's no extra cables. It will work as fast as your home network speed - do you get buffering a lot if you watch Iplayer on your PC or laptop?

David (2) · 22-09-2015, 13:47

What picture quality u get from any of the content providers via smart internet access will depend on each individual provider.
The "higher quality" setting on BBC iplayer is good but it's not quite up to broadcast HD quality (bluray HD is a tad better again).

I saw the op mentioned sound....getting good sound from the built in speakers is usually difficult due to the tiny, thin, speakers on modern TVs. Might want to link the TV to a sound bar or regular hifi (make sure the TV has the right connections if you intend to do this).

Chris Frost · 22-09-2015, 14:03

Quote:

Originally Posted by Virgil Tracy

I'm about to buy a new tv , gonna spend between 250 - £300 , essentials are - Freeview HD , about 40" , I'd like a really good picture quality

BIB - "Really good picture quality" is a bit of an open term as it means different things to different folks, but given that £200-£300 represents pretty much the bottom end of the price range for a 40" TV, and the bottom end of anything isn't really where "really good" of anything lives then I'd say your budget is about £150-£300 light.

With the exception of perhaps the odd entry level Samsung or LG then I think a good chunk of what you'll be looking at is brands of TV that are really just badges on the mass produced supermarket/Argos type product made by Vestel and others.

Freeview HD....... just make sure the TV has a DVB-T2 tuner. Job done.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Virgil Tracy

....and decent sound from the tv itself , don't wanna have to add things

Ha ha ha.... sorry.... really thin TV = not much room for speakers. The reality is if you want decent sound then you're not going to find that on budget sets and rarely on the more expensive sets either.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Virgil Tracy

but I've noticed that for little extra I can get a smart tv , but do I want it ?

Yes, I'm sure Argos and the likes sell a dirt cheap 40" with smart features. So the things that go towards making good pictures get a budget cut to pay for 'smart' toys. Sorry, but your quest isn't looking too smart in itself.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Virgil Tracy

is it a pain to organise with downloads, cables , apps etc.? does it buffer a lot ?

Any TV with smart features is going to offer a corralled service restricted by the set's design so that the manufacturer exposure to support calls is limited.

If you want Smart to work as well as it does on say a PC then really, just hook up a PC. Smart TV isn't there and IMO it never will be. There are just too many competing ideologies within the product platform of smart TVs to make them comparable to the more open platforms provided by Windows, Android, Linux etc.

Virgil Tracy · 22-09-2015, 14:12

Quote:

Originally Posted by Chris Frost

BIB - "Really good picture quality" is a bit of an open term as it means different things to different folks, but given that £200-£300 represents pretty much the bottom end of the price range for a 40" TV, and the bottom end of anything isn't really where "really good" of anything lives then I'd say your budget is about £150-£300 light.

With the exception of perhaps the odd entry level Samsung or LG then I think a good chunk of what you'll be looking at is brands of TV that are really just badges on the mass produced supermarket/Argos type product made by Vestel and others.

well I've seen some Panasonics under £300 , are they not real Panasonics ?

Quote:

Freeview HD....... just make sure the TV has a DVB-T2 tuner. Job done.

what's DVB-T2 ?

thanks for the replies guys .

.

barbeler · 22-09-2015, 14:24

Quote:

Originally Posted by Virgil Tracy

what's DVB-T2 ?

thanks for the replies guys ..

Or in other words, make sure it has Freeview HD on the box.

jackthom · 22-09-2015, 14:50

Quote:

Originally Posted by Virgil Tracy

well I've seen some Panasonics under £300 , are they not real Panasonics ?

I'm sure Nigel will be along later to clear this up but I'm fairly sure I've read that even the cheaper Panasonics are just rebadged Vestel sets.

SnrDev · 22-09-2015, 16:21

Quote:

Originally Posted by barbeler

Or in other words, make sure it has Freeview HD on the box.

And ignore HD READY if that's on the box. That tells you that it can show HD pictures from another source, but it doesn't include an inbuilt HD tuner. Not sure tbh if that's still relevant; it certainly used to be.

OP it sounds like you need to move up a bracket in your budget, esp if good pq is your primary requirement.

1andrew1 · 22-09-2015, 17:17

Quote:

Originally Posted by Virgil Tracy

I'm about to buy a new tv , gonna spend between 250 - £300 , essentials are - Freeview HD , about 40" , I'd like a really good picture quality and decent sound from the tv itself , don't wanna have to add things .

but I've noticed that for little extra I can get a smart tv , but do I want it ?

does smart tv produce HD pictures ? is it a pain to organise with downloads, cables , apps etc.? does it buffer a lot ?

I'm not exactly a technophobe but I like to avoid things that I don't really need .

Bear in mind that not all Smart TVs have the same on-demand services. the cheaper ones may just have iPlayer and Netfix and not the likes of ITV Player, Demand 5, and All4 (formerly 4 OnDemand).
I believe Panasonic's 2015 300 and 400 series are made by Vestel.

Virgil Tracy · 22-09-2015, 17:36

Quote:

Originally Posted by SnrDev

And ignore HD READY if that's on the box. That tells you that it can show HD pictures from another source, but it doesn't include an inbuilt HD tuner. Not sure tbh if that's still relevant; it certainly used to be.

OP it sounds like you need to move up a bracket in your budget, esp if good pq is your primary requirement.

now that's what I always thought , but I've seen several tvs listed as having amongst their features both : "HD Ready " and "Freeview HD"

anthony david · 22-09-2015, 18:06

Quote:

Originally Posted by Virgil Tracy

now that's what I always thought , but I've seen several tvs listed as having amongst their features both : "HD Ready " and "Freeview HD"

Although not strictly correct, some people use the phrase "HD Ready" to mean a display resolution lower than 1080X1920, typically 768X1366 (also known as WXGA). John Lewis advertise some TVs as Freeview HD, display resolution Freeview Ready. They display Freeview HD with a resolution of 768X1366 as a result. This is seldom a problem with small screen sizes (32 inch or less).

Basically if it doesn't say Freeview HD it cannot receive Freeview HD

Chris Frost · 22-09-2015, 20:31

Quote:

Originally Posted by Virgil Tracy

what's DVB-T2 ?

It's the type of tuner required for picking up Freeview HD. A DVB-T tuner is one that receives Free view but not the HD channels. So if all the talk about HD Ready sets has you in a spin then just cut to the chase. If it has a DVB-T tuner then it will receive HD via the aerial socket. Simple.

And yes, the Panasonic 300 model is badged.

Nigel Goodwin · 22-09-2015, 20:44

Quote:

Originally Posted by Chris Frost

It's the type of tuner required for picking up Freeview HD. A DVB-T tuner is one that receives Free view but not the HD channels. So if all the talk about HD Ready sets has you in a spin then just cut to the chase. If it has a DVB-T tuner then it will receive HD via the aerial socket. Simple.

Presumably that was a typo?

barbeler · 22-09-2015, 21:56

It wouldn't bother me if the TV didn't have a tuner of any kind, as a smart recorder is almost essential kit these days.

ironjade · 22-09-2015, 23:40

Some of the features on my Smart TV no longer work, e.g. Blinkbox (thanks to Microsoft withdrawing support) and Amazon TV.
If it weren't for BBC I Player and an obscure Russian 3D channel, the Smart aspects would be a total waste of time.
The browser is glacially slow and entering text via the TV remote is a massive PITA.
I'm starting to think Smart TVs are for dumb people.

Chris Frost · 22-09-2015, 23:58

Quote:

Originally Posted by Nigel Goodwin

Presumably that was a typo?

Yes

Chris Frost · 23-09-2015, 00:01

Quote:

Originally Posted by ironjade

Some of the features on my Smart TV no longer work, e.g. Blinkbox (thanks to Microsoft withdrawing support) and Amazon TV.
If it weren't for BBC I Player and an obscure Russian 3D channel, the Smart aspects would be a total waste of time.
The browser is glacially slow and entering text via the TV remote is a massive PITA.
I'm starting to think Smart TVs are for dumb people.

This ^

A £40 Android MX box or a Roku or...well basically anything other than a Smart TV is a much smarter choice. Add a wireless keyboard if you're serious about surfing the net and you'll be laughing.

Tassium · 23-09-2015, 08:21

I wouldn't bother with a smart TV, I would get a £40 android box as well as an ordinary 40" TV

Although read the reviews carefully for the android box...

jackthom · 23-09-2015, 10:09

Quote:

Originally Posted by Chris Frost

This ^

A £40 Android MX box or a Roku or...well basically anything other than a Smart TV is a much smarter choice. Add a wireless keyboard if you're serious about surfing the net and you'll be laughing.

There's also the slightly more expensive option of a smart blu-ray player if you already have a collection of discs. I have a couple of Sony units which cover pretty much all of the main streaming services including DLNA playback of media stored on a PC

trayhop123 · 23-09-2015, 11:44

now that the ps4 is in full swing ,,,,,,,,,,,,, a second hand ps3 can be a cheap option

blu ray , netflix , plus all the catchup channels

Virgil Tracy · 23-09-2015, 15:12

thanks for all the info guys .

Jimmy_Carter · 23-09-2015, 21:10

Quote:

Originally Posted by trayhop123

now that the ps4 is in full swing ,,,,,,,,,,,,, a second hand ps3 can be a cheap option

blu ray , netflix , plus all the catchup channels

Thats what we use. PS3 was £50 for a preowned from Game coupled with a PS3 remote so works just like a DVD player but with so much more verastility.

David (2) · 24-09-2015, 12:10

I would rather not have a 2nd hand PS3 cluttering up the place just to get smart features into the TV. It's not exactly a small box. A plug in smart dongle is far neater. If you want full internet on the TV then a PC (connected with hdmi) is the way to go. A wireless keyboard with built in trackpad can be used as a remote control.

Nigel Goodwin · 24-09-2015, 13:17

Quote:

Originally Posted by David (2)

I would rather not have a 2nd hand PS3 cluttering up the place just to get smart features into the TV. It's not exactly a small box.

I think you're missing the point, it also gives you a decent game console

A dongle is probably a similar price to a 2nd hand PS3, although personally I'd rather have a proper Android 'box' than just a dongle (and I did

).

Richardcoulter · 24-09-2015, 14:02

Quote:

Originally Posted by Nigel Goodwin

I think you're missing the point, it also gives you a decent game console

A dongle is probably a similar price to a 2nd hand PS3, although personally I'd rather have a proper Android 'box' than just a dongle (and I did

).

Is the purpose of an Android box mainly to provide gaming functionality on top of what Chromecast offers as a standalone product?

22-09-2015, 13:25	#1
Virgil Tracy Forum Member Join Date: Aug 2006 Posts: 24,023	Do I want a Smart tv? I'm about to buy a new tv , gonna spend between 250 - £300 , essentials are - Freeview HD , about 40" , I'd like a really good picture quality and decent sound from the tv itself , don't wanna have to add things . but I've noticed that for little extra I can get a smart tv , but do I want it ? does smart tv produce HD pictures ? is it a pain to organise with downloads, cables , apps etc.? does it buffer a lot ? I'm not exactly a technophobe but I like to avoid things that I don't really need .

22-09-2015, 13:33	#2
Chasing Shadows Forum Member Join Date: Apr 2009 Posts: 2,536	Quote: Originally Posted by Virgil Tracy does smart tv produce HD pictures ? If you're watching an app that produces HD pictures, then yes. Amazon and Netflix and BBC iPlayer and 4 OD all broadcast high definition. Some Youtube videos are HD, others are SD. Whether some of the freebie apps, that show old straight-to-video movies (Popcorn and the like) do is not so obvious. The majority of games installed on our smart TV have fairly simple graphics - and are often designed to be played on an android tablet or phone. In which case, they won't necessarily be high definition. Quote: Originally Posted by Virgil Tracy is it a pain to organise with downloads, cables , apps etc.? does it buffer a lot ? If you connect it to your router via a network cable - then its one extra cable. If you use Wifi, it's no extra cables. It will work as fast as your home network speed - do you get buffering a lot if you watch Iplayer on your PC or laptop?

22-09-2015, 13:47	#3
David (2) Forum Member Join Date: Mar 2003 Location: S.West England. Posts: 18,037	What picture quality u get from any of the content providers via smart internet access will depend on each individual provider. The "higher quality" setting on BBC iplayer is good but it's not quite up to broadcast HD quality (bluray HD is a tad better again). I saw the op mentioned sound....getting good sound from the built in speakers is usually difficult due to the tiny, thin, speakers on modern TVs. Might want to link the TV to a sound bar or regular hifi (make sure the TV has the right connections if you intend to do this).

22-09-2015, 14:03	#4
Chris Frost Forum Member Join Date: Jun 2003 Location: Cheshire Posts: 6,462	Quote: Originally Posted by Virgil Tracy I'm about to buy a new tv , gonna spend between 250 - £300 , essentials are - Freeview HD , about 40" , I'd like a really good picture quality BIB - "Really good picture quality" is a bit of an open term as it means different things to different folks, but given that £200-£300 represents pretty much the bottom end of the price range for a 40" TV, and the bottom end of anything isn't really where "really good" of anything lives then I'd say your budget is about £150-£300 light. With the exception of perhaps the odd entry level Samsung or LG then I think a good chunk of what you'll be looking at is brands of TV that are really just badges on the mass produced supermarket/Argos type product made by Vestel and others. Freeview HD....... just make sure the TV has a DVB-T2 tuner. Job done. Quote: Originally Posted by Virgil Tracy ....and decent sound from the tv itself , don't wanna have to add things Ha ha ha.... sorry.... really thin TV = not much room for speakers. The reality is if you want decent sound then you're not going to find that on budget sets and rarely on the more expensive sets either. Quote: Originally Posted by Virgil Tracy but I've noticed that for little extra I can get a smart tv , but do I want it ? Yes, I'm sure Argos and the likes sell a dirt cheap 40" with smart features. So the things that go towards making good pictures get a budget cut to pay for 'smart' toys. Sorry, but your quest isn't looking too smart in itself. Quote: Originally Posted by Virgil Tracy is it a pain to organise with downloads, cables , apps etc.? does it buffer a lot ? Any TV with smart features is going to offer a corralled service restricted by the set's design so that the manufacturer exposure to support calls is limited. If you want Smart to work as well as it does on say a PC then really, just hook up a PC. Smart TV isn't there and IMO it never will be. There are just too many competing ideologies within the product platform of smart TVs to make them comparable to the more open platforms provided by Windows, Android, Linux etc.

22-09-2015, 14:12	#5
Virgil Tracy Forum Member Join Date: Aug 2006 Posts: 24,023	Quote: Originally Posted by Chris Frost BIB - "Really good picture quality" is a bit of an open term as it means different things to different folks, but given that £200-£300 represents pretty much the bottom end of the price range for a 40" TV, and the bottom end of anything isn't really where "really good" of anything lives then I'd say your budget is about £150-£300 light. With the exception of perhaps the odd entry level Samsung or LG then I think a good chunk of what you'll be looking at is brands of TV that are really just badges on the mass produced supermarket/Argos type product made by Vestel and others. well I've seen some Panasonics under £300 , are they not real Panasonics ? Quote: Freeview HD....... just make sure the TV has a DVB-T2 tuner. Job done. what's DVB-T2 ? thanks for the replies guys . .

22-09-2015, 14:24	#6
barbeler Forum Member Join Date: Mar 2007 Posts: 11,705	Quote: Originally Posted by Virgil Tracy what's DVB-T2 ? thanks for the replies guys .. Or in other words, make sure it has Freeview HD on the box.

22-09-2015, 14:50	#7
jackthom Forum Member Join Date: Nov 2001 Location: Northumberland Posts: 4,536	Quote: Originally Posted by Virgil Tracy well I've seen some Panasonics under £300 , are they not real Panasonics ? I'm sure Nigel will be along later to clear this up but I'm fairly sure I've read that even the cheaper Panasonics are just rebadged Vestel sets.

22-09-2015, 16:21	#8
SnrDev Inactive Member Join Date: May 2011 Posts: 5,981	Quote: Originally Posted by barbeler Or in other words, make sure it has Freeview HD on the box. And ignore HD READY if that's on the box. That tells you that it can show HD pictures from another source, but it doesn't include an inbuilt HD tuner. Not sure tbh if that's still relevant; it certainly used to be. OP it sounds like you need to move up a bracket in your budget, esp if good pq is your primary requirement.

22-09-2015, 17:17	#9
1andrew1 Forum Member Join Date: Feb 2009 Posts: 3,981	Quote: Originally Posted by Virgil Tracy I'm about to buy a new tv , gonna spend between 250 - £300 , essentials are - Freeview HD , about 40" , I'd like a really good picture quality and decent sound from the tv itself , don't wanna have to add things . but I've noticed that for little extra I can get a smart tv , but do I want it ? does smart tv produce HD pictures ? is it a pain to organise with downloads, cables , apps etc.? does it buffer a lot ? I'm not exactly a technophobe but I like to avoid things that I don't really need . Bear in mind that not all Smart TVs have the same on-demand services. the cheaper ones may just have iPlayer and Netfix and not the likes of ITV Player, Demand 5, and All4 (formerly 4 OnDemand). I believe Panasonic's 2015 300 and 400 series are made by Vestel.

22-09-2015, 17:36	#10
Virgil Tracy Forum Member Join Date: Aug 2006 Posts: 24,023	Quote: Originally Posted by SnrDev And ignore HD READY if that's on the box. That tells you that it can show HD pictures from another source, but it doesn't include an inbuilt HD tuner. Not sure tbh if that's still relevant; it certainly used to be. OP it sounds like you need to move up a bracket in your budget, esp if good pq is your primary requirement. now that's what I always thought , but I've seen several tvs listed as having amongst their features both : "HD Ready " and "Freeview HD"

22-09-2015, 18:06	#11
anthony david Forum Member Join Date: Dec 2012 Posts: 3,469	Quote: Originally Posted by Virgil Tracy now that's what I always thought , but I've seen several tvs listed as having amongst their features both : "HD Ready " and "Freeview HD" Although not strictly correct, some people use the phrase "HD Ready" to mean a display resolution lower than 1080X1920, typically 768X1366 (also known as WXGA). John Lewis advertise some TVs as Freeview HD, display resolution Freeview Ready. They display Freeview HD with a resolution of 768X1366 as a result. This is seldom a problem with small screen sizes (32 inch or less). Basically if it doesn't say Freeview HD it cannot receive Freeview HD

22-09-2015, 20:31	#12
Chris Frost Forum Member Join Date: Jun 2003 Location: Cheshire Posts: 6,462	Quote: Originally Posted by Virgil Tracy what's DVB-T2 ? It's the type of tuner required for picking up Freeview HD. A DVB-T tuner is one that receives Free view but not the HD channels. So if all the talk about HD Ready sets has you in a spin then just cut to the chase. If it has a DVB-T tuner then it will receive HD via the aerial socket. Simple. And yes, the Panasonic 300 model is badged.

22-09-2015, 20:44	#13
Nigel Goodwin Forum Member Join Date: Apr 2006 Location: North Derbyshire Posts: 41,789	Quote: Originally Posted by Chris Frost It's the type of tuner required for picking up Freeview HD. A DVB-T tuner is one that receives Free view but not the HD channels. So if all the talk about HD Ready sets has you in a spin then just cut to the chase. If it has a DVB-T tuner then it will receive HD via the aerial socket. Simple. Presumably that was a typo?

22-09-2015, 21:56	#14
barbeler Forum Member Join Date: Mar 2007 Posts: 11,705	It wouldn't bother me if the TV didn't have a tuner of any kind, as a smart recorder is almost essential kit these days.

22-09-2015, 23:40	#15
ironjade Forum Member Join Date: Nov 2004 Location: London Posts: 8,651	Some of the features on my Smart TV no longer work, e.g. Blinkbox (thanks to Microsoft withdrawing support) and Amazon TV. If it weren't for BBC I Player and an obscure Russian 3D channel, the Smart aspects would be a total waste of time. The browser is glacially slow and entering text via the TV remote is a massive PITA. I'm starting to think Smart TVs are for dumb people.

22-09-2015, 23:58	#16
Chris Frost Forum Member Join Date: Jun 2003 Location: Cheshire Posts: 6,462	Quote: Originally Posted by Nigel Goodwin Presumably that was a typo? Yes

23-09-2015, 00:01	#17
Chris Frost Forum Member Join Date: Jun 2003 Location: Cheshire Posts: 6,462	Quote: Originally Posted by ironjade Some of the features on my Smart TV no longer work, e.g. Blinkbox (thanks to Microsoft withdrawing support) and Amazon TV. If it weren't for BBC I Player and an obscure Russian 3D channel, the Smart aspects would be a total waste of time. The browser is glacially slow and entering text via the TV remote is a massive PITA. I'm starting to think Smart TVs are for dumb people. This ^ A £40 Android MX box or a Roku or...well basically anything other than a Smart TV is a much smarter choice. Add a wireless keyboard if you're serious about surfing the net and you'll be laughing.

23-09-2015, 08:21	#18
Tassium Forum Member Join Date: Mar 2009 Location: It's Grim Posts: 24,412	I wouldn't bother with a smart TV, I would get a £40 android box as well as an ordinary 40" TV Although read the reviews carefully for the android box...

23-09-2015, 10:09	#19
jackthom Forum Member Join Date: Nov 2001 Location: Northumberland Posts: 4,536	Quote: Originally Posted by Chris Frost This ^ A £40 Android MX box or a Roku or...well basically anything other than a Smart TV is a much smarter choice. Add a wireless keyboard if you're serious about surfing the net and you'll be laughing. There's also the slightly more expensive option of a smart blu-ray player if you already have a collection of discs. I have a couple of Sony units which cover pretty much all of the main streaming services including DLNA playback of media stored on a PC

23-09-2015, 11:44	#20
trayhop123 Forum Member Join Date: Feb 2012 Posts: 865	now that the ps4 is in full swing ,,,,,,,,,,,,, a second hand ps3 can be a cheap option blu ray , netflix , plus all the catchup channels

23-09-2015, 15:12	#21
Virgil Tracy Forum Member Join Date: Aug 2006 Posts: 24,023	thanks for all the info guys .

DS Forums

Do I want a Smart tv?

23-09-2015, 21:10	#22
Jimmy_Carter Forum Member Join Date: Nov 2013 Posts: 259	Quote: Originally Posted by trayhop123 now that the ps4 is in full swing ,,,,,,,,,,,,, a second hand ps3 can be a cheap option blu ray , netflix , plus all the catchup channels Thats what we use. PS3 was £50 for a preowned from Game coupled with a PS3 remote so works just like a DVD player but with so much more verastility.

24-09-2015, 12:10	#23
David (2) Forum Member Join Date: Mar 2003 Location: S.West England. Posts: 18,037	I would rather not have a 2nd hand PS3 cluttering up the place just to get smart features into the TV. It's not exactly a small box. A plug in smart dongle is far neater. If you want full internet on the TV then a PC (connected with hdmi) is the way to go. A wireless keyboard with built in trackpad can be used as a remote control.

24-09-2015, 13:17	#24
Nigel Goodwin Forum Member Join Date: Apr 2006 Location: North Derbyshire Posts: 41,789	Quote: Originally Posted by David (2) I would rather not have a 2nd hand PS3 cluttering up the place just to get smart features into the TV. It's not exactly a small box. I think you're missing the point, it also gives you a decent game console A dongle is probably a similar price to a 2nd hand PS3, although personally I'd rather have a proper Android 'box' than just a dongle (and I did ).

24-09-2015, 14:02	#25
Richardcoulter Forum Member Join Date: Jun 2002 Posts: 9,703	Quote: Originally Posted by Nigel Goodwin I think you're missing the point, it also gives you a decent game console A dongle is probably a similar price to a 2nd hand PS3, although personally I'd rather have a proper Android 'box' than just a dongle (and I did ). Is the purpose of an Android box mainly to provide gaming functionality on top of what Chromecast offers as a standalone product?