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IPhone Locked To First Sim ??


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Old 02-10-2015, 07:49
N-I-C-K
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I bought a iPhone 6s from Argos and I have read lots of information from people that unless you buy your phone directly from Apple, iPhones lock themselves to the first network you use.

Is this true?
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Old 02-10-2015, 08:00
Stig
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I bought a iPhone 6s from Argos and I have read lots of information from people that unless you buy your phone directly from Apple, iPhones lock themselves to the first network you use.

Is this true?
No. That only applied to phones from a very few retailers.

Think about it: Argos would have to tell you very clearly if that was going to happen.
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Old 02-10-2015, 08:14
My name's Scott
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No, the only place this happens really is phone shops. They don't have a separate inventory for contract phones on each every network they sell plans for and phones to be purchased up front. These devices will lock to the first SIM.

I know for sure this happens at Carphone Warehouse because I work there, unless they're low-end devices under £100 they don't bother.

Some devices are sold as PAYG and have network branded packaging and software with which you have to purchase a top up with it as well. This is different to SIM free and they will be locked.
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Old 02-10-2015, 11:17
B_W2
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Let me correct a few mis-understood people on this one. I have bought lots and lots of IOS phones from CPW, Argos, Apple stores and further and always wondered what the situation is with this.

Any Apple phone bought anywhere else than an Apple store will almost always lock to the first network of the SIM that is used.

I have bought many IPhones from Argos and they lock, same as CPW- they do now state this on the website.

I believe it's a policy Apple have, that only they sell truly UNLOCKED (not SIM- Free, there is a difference) and this has not changed for years now.

If it explicitly states that they are fully unlocked, maybe they bought they stock from an Apple store, but as I said, only true fully unlocked Apple phones- may a trip to one of the stores!

Regards
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Old 02-10-2015, 11:21
moox
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(not SIM- Free, there is a difference)
Not for every other manufacturer, where "SIM free" means "forever unlocked, unmolested by any network operator". Apple can't just change that definition.

It's scummy that it locks to the first SIM - and scummy that CPW only tell you in the small print. If you did as a normal person would - you looked at the price (it's the same as on Apple's site) and the term "SIM free" you'd think it's the same thing Apple are selling.

Indeed, Apple sells theirs as "SIM free" too:

http://www.apple.com/uk/shop/buy-iph...4gb-space-grey

Buying a SIM-free iPhone from apple.com allows you to choose your own carrier and change carriers at any time. iPhone may also be available at a lower price with a contract directly from your wireless carrier.
The thing about only having to stock one phone regardless of network is a bit BSy - Apple could provide tools for the retailer to change the lock status at sale depending on the policy of the network who is subsidising it, and to not lock phones at all that were sold at the unsubsidised price. Apple is in a unique position to do this due to the way their locking process works.
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Old 02-10-2015, 11:43
B_W2
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Very true. I agree with all the above. Apple do have a unique 'over a barrel' position.
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Old 02-10-2015, 12:01
d123
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Not for every other manufacturer, where "SIM free" means "forever unlocked, unmolested by any network operator". Apple can't just change that definition.
It's not Apple that changed the definition, it's the CarPhoneWarehouse.
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Old 02-10-2015, 12:09
BKM
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Let me correct a few mis-understood people on this one. I have bought lots and lots of IOS phones from CPW, Argos, Apple stores and further and always wondered what the situation is with this.

Any Apple phone bought anywhere else than an Apple store will almost always lock to the first network of the SIM that is used.
This is just NOT true!

GiffGaff for one sell TOTALLY UNLOCKED iPhones on thir website - I know because I bought one! As GiffGaff are an O2 subsidiary the handsets are actually O2 stock (as proved by an IMEI enquiry service) - but unlocked at Point of Sale

Initial Activation Policy Description: 269 - UK O2 Tesco
Next Tether Policy Details: 10 - Unlock
Lock Status: Unlocked

3 (the network) also now sell ALL their handsets (including iPhones) as totally unlocked
I believe it's a policy Apple have, that only they sell truly UNLOCKED (not SIM- Free, there is a difference) and this has not changed for years now.
Also cannot be true! As above!
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Old 02-10-2015, 12:39
-GONZO-
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John Lewis are also unlocked.
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Old 02-10-2015, 13:54
Mr_DB
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Let me correct a few mis-understood people on this one. I have bought lots and lots of IOS phones from CPW, Argos, Apple stores and further and always wondered what the situation is with this.

Any Apple phone bought anywhere else than an Apple store will almost always lock to the first network of the SIM that is used.

I have bought many IPhones from Argos and they lock, same as CPW- they do now state this on the website.

I believe it's a policy Apple have, that only they sell truly UNLOCKED (not SIM- Free, there is a difference) and this has not changed for years now.

If it explicitly states that they are fully unlocked, maybe they bought they stock from an Apple store, but as I said, only true fully unlocked Apple phones- may a trip to one of the stores!

Regards
For someone wanting to correct misunderstandings, you've created a few yourself. What you have written simply is not true.

Carphone Warehouse is known for handsets locking to the network of the first SIM used. Other places do sell SIM free, unlocked handsets that don't lock to the network of the first SIM used. An example by another poster is GiffGaff, another is Three. There may be some other retailers that sell locking-handsets, but it's simply not everyone other than Apple as you wrote.

You state that the Argos website states this, I've just checked a SIM free iPhone 6s from Argos, it does no such thing.

You state that you believe Apple have done this as policy to make it so that only they sell truly unlocked phones. Again, a load of rubbish I'm afraid. Apple want people to buy unlocked handsets. They want them to do so and be able to swap their SIMs at will.

If you look at everything Apple has done with iPhone you will see that they want to be the power holder instead of networks. By having more people freely able to switch networks whenever they want it means that the loyalty is with the device over the network - and it means more people are more likely to sell their handset for an upgrade every year, and more people are interested in buying second hand handsets that are unlocked.

Even Apple are keen to introduce an electronic SIM card that will enable you to switch out your SIM whenever you wish - again backing up this idea.

The whole network locking thing is something used by networks to stop people getting an expensive phone at a discounted rate and then selling the handset or using it on another network (which means that they don't get termination charges coming into the number, nor do they make out-of-allowance charges from the consumer). If you get a handset on a contract from them with a discounted rate, then to make money and claw back their investment in your handset, they want you to use their service. Apple don't care about this - they care about selling iPhones.

Phones that lock to the network of the first SIM inserted help networks protect their investments as per their needs, but allow phone shops and sites to only need to order and stock one SKU (or model) of iPhone.

This makes everything cheaper - the network don't need to package special versions of the handsets, Apple, the networks and the phone shops/sites don't need separate shipping runs, distinct areas in warehouses aren't needed - and a customer that wants a phone on a specific network won't be told "We have none left on that network, but we have on this other network you didn't want instead"...
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Old 02-10-2015, 14:35
preecey
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Carphone Warehouse is known for handsets locking to the network of the first SIM used. Other places do sell SIM free, unlocked handsets that don't lock to the network of the first SIM used. An example by another poster is GiffGaff, another is Three.
All handsets sold by Carphone Warehouse are unlocked and unbranded, with the exception of iPhone. Your comment misleads people into thinking that all devices sold by CPW lock to the network of the first SIM inserted, which is completely untrue - this only applies to iPhone.
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Old 02-10-2015, 14:38
preecey
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No, the only place this happens really is phone shops. They don't have a separate inventory for contract phones on each every network they sell plans for and phones to be purchased up front. These devices will lock to the first SIM.

I know for sure this happens at Carphone Warehouse because I work there, unless they're low-end devices under £100 they don't bother.

Some devices are sold as PAYG and have network branded packaging and software with which you have to purchase a top up with it as well. This is different to SIM free and they will be locked.
You work for Dixons Carphone and you spout out that?
It is common knowledge that every phone sold there is unlocked and unbranded, apart from iPhone which does lock to the network of the first SIM.
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Old 02-10-2015, 15:48
Mr_DB
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All handsets sold by Carphone Warehouse are unlocked and unbranded, with the exception of iPhone. Your comment misleads people into thinking that all devices sold by CPW lock to the network of the first SIM inserted, which is completely untrue - this only applies to iPhone.
Apologies for that, I was talking about iPhones specifically so that's the context in which I was talking. However I take your point and will update my post.

EDIT: I can no longer edit it unfortunately.
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Old 02-10-2015, 17:07
enapace
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Honestly you could just always even with CPW iPhone put a Three sim in it and then get Three unlock it for you so it is truly unlocked.
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Old 02-10-2015, 19:47
BKM
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Honestly you could just always even with CPW iPhone put a Three sim in it and then get Three unlock it for you so it is truly unlocked.
This depends if 3 check the handset IMEI to see if they supplied it! I have no idea about this but perhaps someone who has tried it can report back.
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Old 02-10-2015, 21:16
d123
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This depends if 3 check the handset IMEI to see if they supplied it! I have no idea about this but perhaps someone who has tried it can report back.
Plenty people were doing this in the past, I can't remember if it was the 5 or 5s but there was a long thread on AV Forums as only CPW had stock and everyone was buying them, getting a 3 PAYG sim and having it unlocked (they were actually paying £15 or £20 for the unlock back then).
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Old 02-10-2015, 21:30
enapace
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Honestly even if they didn't really want do you could say to them that they need to do as they are the only ones who can. CPW can't do it only the network it's locked to can.
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Old 13-01-2016, 20:10
Gigabit
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Apparently if you bought a phone from a network such as O2 and the first SIM you put in was say from EE, the phone would work fine but the phone would then lock to EE. Is this true or do the phones the networks sell come locked to the respective network, when they come from Apple?
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Old 13-01-2016, 20:13
d123
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Apparently if you bought a phone from a network such as O2 and the first SIM you put in was say from EE, the phone would work fine but the phone would then lock to EE. Is this true or do the phones the networks sell come locked to the respective network, when they come from Apple?
Network phones are preset locked to the network that is selling it.

I presume you are getting confused with the CarPhoneWarehouse model of locking to first sim?
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Old 13-01-2016, 20:19
Gigabit
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Network phones are preset locked to the network that is selling it.

I presume you are getting confused with the CarPhoneWarehouse model of locking to first sim?
Well, a person came to me the other day with an iPhone bought on a contract at an Apple Store and that was locked to O2. I thought all iPhones were unlocked if bought from Apple so I was very confused.
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Old 13-01-2016, 20:23
BKM
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Well, a person came to me the other day with an iPhone bought on a contract at an Apple Store and that was locked to O2. I thought all iPhones were unlocked if bought from Apple so I was very confused.
Apple Stores don't sell new iPhones on contract to anyone - or locked phones! The only situation that a handset should be locked by an Apple Store is if they have replaced a locked handset under warranty - when the replacement handset gets the originals lock status.

So yes! Someone is VERY confused!
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Old 13-01-2016, 20:46
jchamier
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Well, a person came to me the other day with an iPhone bought on a contract at an Apple Store and that was locked to O2. I thought all iPhones were unlocked if bought from Apple so I was very confused.
I know in the USA you can buy contract phones from apple retail stores and apple online, and if bought on a subsidised contract its exactly the same as buying from a carrier store.

I know apple online in the UK only sells handsets without SIM, but is is possible that Apple retail stores in the UK can offer contracts. You would have to ask in a store.
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Old 13-01-2016, 20:50
BKM
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I know in the USA you can buy contract phones from apple retail stores and apple online, and if bought on a subsidised contract its exactly the same as buying from a carrier store.
I think you are incorrect! Apple Stores in the US will give you a new SIM for one of several networks for your new handset - but this is a customer convenience and, AFAIK, they do not otherwise set up any contracts!
I know apple online in the UK only sells handsets without SIM, but is is possible that Apple retail stores in the UK can offer contracts. You would have to ask in a store.
They do not.
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Old 13-01-2016, 20:55
Gigabit
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Is that a recent change? I went into an Apple Store nearby very recently and all over the tables they had different network contracts available with their iPhones.
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Old 13-01-2016, 21:00
BKM
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Is that a recent change? I went into an Apple Store nearby very recently and all over the tables they had different network contracts available with their iPhones.
The Apple Store in the Oracle, Reading - as I believe all stores - had handsets for sale only (but they COULD supply from a selection of most PAYG SIMs if you wished) all times I have been in!
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