Hi all, I'm wondering why it is that some celebs with previous experience are viciously attacked by both the media and the voting public, while others are let off and applauded for their talent?

Natalie Gumede was relentlessly attacked for her dance training, while Kara Tointon ended up winning, with seemingly little acknowledgment of her previous skills in ballet, tap, jazz and contemporary.

This year has a similar theme...Helen George was called out for her dance training, while Jay and Peter got off relatively easy - despite a large amount of experience.

This one spreads it around a bit.
http://www.nowmagazine.co.uk/celebri...g-a-fix-305878

I thought the clip they showed of Helen training where she was talking about ballet experience was interesting. Where she was saying about the difference with foot positioning - and how it's completely the opposite in Ballroom/Latin.

So you have to unlearn what you already know and then start again....

You could argue that previous experience is a disadvantage .....

I think that was probably played up in order to make it look like her dance background wouldn't help her. I don't think that anyone without her kind of background could have pulled off a Waltz like that at all on Strictly, let alone on week 1. I seriously doubt it's a disadvantage.

It doesn't bother me in the slightest. I do enjoy seeing a 'journey' contestant but if they all had dance experience I would be a very happy bunny if that meant I was going to see 14 weeks of good dancing.

I don't think all viewers think the same ( in fact I know they don't ) Some of us tune in for the dance, some because they are a fan of a contestant, some for the thrills and spills, some for the show, costumes etc etc.

As for winners - well again it doesn't matter really. Ideally I would like to see the best dancer win. Natalie G should have won hands down in her year in my opinion. Ditto Coin Jackson and others. However she didn't. No biggy. She got paid and ultimately that's the deal. She is a performer, who got paid for a job and did the job very well.

I can also understand why she didn't win. There was something about her that was harder to warm to than other contestants. She also danced with thingy who was also not the warmest and fluffiest of pros - although he had his fans I know.

I have no idea what the winning formula is but it clearly has dance only as one component alongside likability of the contestant, the pro and many other factors.

Anyway, it doesn't bother me at all when people have previous experience (as long as they don't try and hide it or pretend it makes everything harder for them. I just wish if the media was going to "expose" dancers, they'd be fair and not just single one person out!

Thanks Nina - I wasn't really being serious .... I agree with you that any sort of performance experience of any kind will always stand them in good stead. Although, for somebody who's performed in huge stadiums (or should that be stadia...) I do find Jay's nerves quite strange.

I did get that, and I didn't mean for my response to come out so serious-sounding!

I find Jay's nerves slightly confusing too, but I do believe he's being genuine. I guess there is quite a large difference between being a component of a larger entity (The Wanted) and having all focus on you and your ability.
Last edited by Nina_Blake : 02-10-2015 at 14:29

Interesting. Four "ringhas" and Pdur is not even one of them. Hey ho. *shrugs nochelantly*

I guess it's a lot harder to call Peter a ringer than the others, because he doesn't have all the stage/dance school credentials and training. He's just done a lot of choreographed dancing before.

Agree with this

I think it finds its own balance in the end via the public vote: Chris Parker finished ahead of Claire Sweeney, Denise Lewis got to the final ahead of Sarah Manners, Jaye Jacobs went week 2, Colin Jackson finalled ahead of Patsy Palmer, Ramps and Matt Dawson came first and second ahead of Louisa Lytton and Emma Bunton while Ray Fearon got booted mid-table. And Penny Lancaster went week 6 while Kenny Logan got to the semis.

The list of people with dance backgrounds falling behind those without goes on for even longer. That's how reality shows work.

Yes that could be right.

I am not being disparaging about 'thingy' by the way (post 5). His name has genuinely escaped me and despite having dug into my mind it still eludes me. BAH

Artem. Unforgettable Artem.

Of course it is. Phew! And thanks. It was bugging me If I get run over by a bus this afternoon I can die happy.

Someone was talking about Jay's "natural" fluid arms in another thread. It has nothing to do with this then I suppose:

‘But I did a lot of contemporary dance so I’m looking forward to now learning different types of dance that I’ve never done before.’

Previous experience doesn't really bother me, but the double standards thing does.

Re your comparison of Natalie and Kara, Natalie is kind of in a class of her own ringer-wise as she trained for years at a specialist dance school, specifically to become a professional dancer, before her injury. Most other 'ringers' have done some training at stage school etc. while really focusing on becoming an actor/singer etc. Kara never actually went to stage school so was much less of a ringer than she is often claimed to be on here. Mostly I think it is down to likeability and whatever it is that makes viewers 'warm' to someone. Some people just have it and others, like Natalie and Pixie don't (obviously I only mean for the majority of the voting viewers, I know there are plenty of people who did like them). I agree with you if they are going to 'expose' one, they should make it clear for all of them, but viewers would still excuse some and not others based on their personality.

Not all viewers adored Kara Tointon - I found her deadly dull and many - sorry, all of Mr Bleached Teeth's dances looked little like the dance they were supposed to!

I don't dislike someone because they've had training - I disliked Denise Van Outen because she was endlessly hyped and pushed by TPTB.

I'm pretty sure Kara went to Sylvia Young, and on her IMDB profile, it mentions: "Not only is she a wonderful actress but she is also highly trained in dance, specializing in Aerobics, Ballet, Choreography, Contemporary, Jazz and Tap. "

She was signed to the Sylvia Young agency for auditions, but never attended the school. She has said in several interviews that she wanted to go to drama school but never went because she kept getting work.

http://www.radiotimes.com/news/2015-...cting-together

I don't know who writes people's IMDB profiles, but as far as I can see any dancing as a child was done in the sort of weekend or evening classes that young girls do.

But if we're going down that route, who's to say the claims about Natalie Gumede's training were as accurate as they were claimed to be?

I'd class IMDB as a pretty reliable site on the whole, and I'm sure facts are checked.

Also, in a daily mail article, she's quoted as having said "‘When they found out I was struggling we sat down and they said, “Let’s think of a hobby.” We decided on gymnastics, which I started at five. That gave me happiness, there was something I could excel at. At 11 I started board-diving and then joined the Sylvia Young agency for ballet, singing and drama"

http://www.dailymail.co.uk/femail/ar...pier-ever.html
Last edited by Nina_Blake : 02-10-2015 at 15:51

I had always understood Kara did some Saturday classes at Sylvia Young but wasn't a full time student there.

I would imagine that an actor's IMDB profile is supplied by the actor or their agent and is likely to be a 'best foot forward' version of skills and experience

I gave Kara some slack after I saw how much her dyslexia affected her learning.

Exactly, she joined the agency but didn't go to the school. I'm not saying she didn't do gymnastics and some ballet classes, but a lot of children do. This article specifically says she didn't go to Sylvia Young

http://www.telegraph.co.uk/culture/t...est-Ender.html

Re your question about Natalie, she said in interviews at the time that she was training to become a professional dancer prior to her injury so that seems pretty accurate.