Yes thats good point didn't think about it that deeply just thought they're fun it's like they know they're not going to win it but my god they're going to have fun anyway which i like.

I adored Natalie, but it's hard to argue Jay is more trained than her (not even close, imo).

I enjoy a mix of celebs and some of the duffers make me very happy (Jeremy this year; Judy last). In the first few weeks, I usually vote for the entertaining dud or the 'improver' from the middle of the pack who I hope to see grow, but I wouldn't watch the show at all if we didn't have some dancers who were good from the start.

I have to admit that a lot of people probably wouldn't watch without the trained dancers.

would he be chucking his toys out of his pram and complaining about trained celebs if Ola had been partnered with Peter (which she was hoping for) or Jay?

no, he wouldnt

Not only the Brad Pitt of the dance world but evidently also the Sherlock Holmes. Of course it's not and never has been a level playing field in a variety of ways.

Surely one of the functions of the public vote should be to even things up a bit. The issue there, which tends to get lost between people attacking ringers and people defending them (and I'm a defender), is are the viewers being sufficiently well informed by the BBC. It's alright saying Jay's or Helen's experience is covered on the website but anecdotally I can tell you that a lot of people didn't seem to know anything about Jay's previous.

Maybe the Saturday show should be more transparent even to the extent of categorising celebs either novice, intermediate or advanced or something.

He must make Ola's working environment so uncomfortable with this stuff.

God forbid Strictly is ever cancelled - it will be the worst day in James Jordan's life because he won't be able to grasp onto it to keep himself relevant.

I spoke to a couple of people yesterday who didn't know about Jay or Helen's dancing experience, so it isn't widely known.

Nope, loved her. Ironically, given that it's James Jordan we're talking about, Denise is one of the few ringers I didn't love, as a lot of her dances (Latin in particular) didn't measure up.

Interesting that Ola didn't get Peter as her partner then - they would have been well suited height-wise. Maybe she was just due a duffer? Or maybe TPTB see her as being on the way out/don't like her and so didn't care what she wanted?

It's childish to get hung up on things being "unfair." No it's not fair to have Jay competing against the likes of Jeremy and kirstie. And...? It's also not fair that it's decided by largely inexperienced (in latin and ballroom) judges and the great british public each of whom has their own agenda meaning the best dancer generally won't win.

Yes, why not. What I do consider unfair is that some of the celebs with previous experience are "outed", e.g. Helen's ballet experience which they went on and on about in the first few shows, while others' experience is carefully concealed, e.g. Jay's.

Most of the general viewing public only hear what's on the show and maybe ITT and they just take what they're given at face value.

Think this hits the nail on the head.

Lots of people have an advantage -Sports people through stamina and 'focus', young over old, stage school for all round training, actors for acting , John Sergeant's sense of humour and charm. Even some non- dancers had Saturday morning dance classes as kids.

The public vote tends to even it all up.

The main point for me is that as long as the public know - as long as Strictly has added it to their public profile.

Maybe it was because he was the best fit height wise with Jeanette? She's only little and quite a few of the male celebs seem fairly tall.

I agree that it may not be widely known, but to a dancer, it is obvious, just by watching them even first week, that they have had training in dance. I really don;t mind that at all - as long as they have had no Ballroom/Latin experience, and I don't believe that these two mentioned, have had. I look forward to their progress.

It's never been a level playing field. Not only by experience, but by age, build and, dare I say it, looks and charisma. As long as the contestants understand that, and they really should do by now, there is no problem. And let's face it they all get a nice wad of cash, they're not doing it for the glory.

nd I wonder if any of Jay's fans were complaining about Natalie Gumede being a trained dancer?

James is entitled to give his opinion, I wish they would take the trained dancers out of it and let us see those who progress throughout the competition. It is now more trained dancers than non-trained, what is the point? How can we possibly compare Jay, Helen etc to Carol, Kirsty etc?[/quote]

BIB no I supported Natalie and for me she should of won and I want Jay to win this year.

My husband says sports people have the greatest advantage. Because they're fit they cope best in the last few weeks.

Pus they have had psychological training to 'focus' - you could see Darren Gough 'going into the zone' as he stepped onto the floor.

He says most of the others get too tired as the series goes on. Once they have to do 2 dances a week, and then do more if they reach the final, most celebrities start to go backwards.

Even dance training and experience can vary. A few years' ballet classes as small kid is much less than Jay's training at local Saturday classes and 3 years at a local Drama and Dance College. But Jay's is less than Helen's training at the Acting School and then the Royal Acadamy of Music. Natalie's years of dance training and Denise Van Outen's training and West End experience out did them all.

But as long as the public KNOWS it doesn't matter as the public vote can make allowance.

(Despite my name,I'm female - Fred is our pet dog's name )

I feel like ive found my internet new home, victoriasponge has vodka and ive also got a dog named fred (well freddie really)

Really?
I honestly am amazed that anyone remains in the dark about Helen. Darcy even talks to her in ballet-speak

I don't really mind as long as the judges let it be known to the public who has dance experience and leave it to them to make their own mind up.

But these are probably people who don't know very much about dancing and watch for their Saturday night entertainment. I doubt they would tell me porkies.

"SCD isn't fair with trained dancers in it," says James Jordan.

Wow James, thanks for that.

In tomorrow's edition, James tells us about how he's found out that the pope is actually Catholic and that bears like to defecate in wooded areas.

Thanks to James for sparing time from his busy schedule of classes at the "School For the Bleedin' Obvious".

All the above!

I think it's a shame. I've never been that keen on James, but at one point he was a producer's fave (or it seemed to me) he had little presenting slots, and was a judge with Ola on the wheelchair dance series. In both cases he did well. I don't know what happened, a change of PTB or the row with Craig about not being included on a tour but it all went sour. My hunch is that he got to big for his boots.

he had a chance of building a decent carer on the back of Strictly, but that's not going to happen now.

Rent a gob Jordan should shut his big mouth
Jay to Go all the way to the final and Win 😀😄😃