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Kathy and Sharon - the new Pat and Peggy???


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Old 23-10-2015, 14:59
wizardt
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Kathy Beale and Sharon Watts (refuse to call her Mitchell) are two iconic ladies and it's fairly obvious that they will never be friends. But do you think they will be frenemies? Kathy has always hated Sharon because of Sharongate and now Sharon hates Kathy because she is a threat to her relationship with Phil. Phil and Kathy are likely to have an affair/one night stand soon. I'd be surprised if nothing happens between Kathy and Phil. (Thank god Phil and Shirley are over as I don't think I can stand Phil using 3 women at the same time).

But Gavin Sullivan is 99.9% likely to be Sharon's father. That means that Kathy and Sharon will be stepmother-stepdaughter. That's going to cause more tension right?

Pat and Peggy were enemies because they both loved Frank and Pat stabbed Peggy in the back by having an affair with him. Eventually they became best pals so could this happen to Sharon and Kathy? Letitia Dean and Gillian Taylforth have both said they want to stay in EastEnders for many years and they can be strong matriarchs in future like Pat and Peggy.
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Old 23-10-2015, 15:38
vaslav37
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I always thought Shirley was viewed as the new Pat?
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Old 23-10-2015, 15:40
wizardt
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I always thought Shirley was viewed as the new Pat?
She will never "replace" Pat IMO. I can see Kathy as the new Pat.
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Old 23-10-2015, 15:44
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Sharon and Kathy were their own characters way before Peggy Mitchell was even invented. They don't need to be the new anything. I'm looking forward to their weird step mum/daughter dynamic though.

Sorry Wiz, that sounds like I'm telling you off, its not meant to!
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Old 23-10-2015, 15:45
Ell_Ren
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She will never "replace" Pat IMO. I can see Kathy as the new Pat.
I think Shirley has more similarities to Pat than Kathy, especially when she first arrived, and compared with how Pat was written earlier on in her stint.

But Shirley could not 'replace' Pat, no character could.
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Old 23-10-2015, 15:47
Aaron_Silver
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Why does every introduction or re-introduction or whatever have to the new Pat and Peggy or the new Den and Angie or whatever iconic character you can name, why cant they just be a new generation of individual characters? I really don't get the constant need for comparison myself
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Old 23-10-2015, 15:49
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Why does every introduction or re-introduction or whatever have to the new Pat and Peggy or the new Den and Angie or whatever iconic character you can name, why cant they just be a new generation of individual characters? I really don't get the constant need for comparison myself
I want Les to have a nervous breakdown and he and Christine become the new Den and Angie.
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Old 23-10-2015, 15:51
Harlowe
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I dunno to be honest the term the new this or that get's thrown around a lot, they're both 'iconic' characters in EE history their own right for being original characters.

It really depends where they go with them, they wasn't always at each other's throats and I think fighting over Phil is old hat but the angle of Gavin being Sharon's birth father could be interesting, as it clear Kathy is too attached to Gavin and Sharon is the little lost orphan with no parents alive until now, the writing currently for them is pretty shite though.

The problem will come if they split Sharon & Phil up, she can't be a strong mother figure with no family to be the head of.
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Old 23-10-2015, 15:54
Aaron_Silver
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I want Les to have a nervous breakdown and he and Christine become the new Den and Angie.
You have an answer for everything
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Old 23-10-2015, 15:55
Harlowe
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She will never "replace" Pat IMO. I can see Kathy as the new Pat.
I don't really think she anything like Pat, she & Pat was best friends before she left if anything they was the original premise of the frenemies term because of Pat's history with Pete.
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Old 23-10-2015, 15:55
Ell_Ren
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I've never understood the obsession with 'matriarchs' on EastEnders. I don't see it mentioned as much in other soaps.
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Old 23-10-2015, 16:04
Fallon9
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I've never understood the obsession with 'matriarchs' on EastEnders. I don't see it mentioned as much in other soaps.
I agree. Most viewers just want to see a good multi generational mixture of interesting characters, controversial characters, likeable characters, fresh new characters and old favourites. I don't know anybody who cares about 'Matriarchs' or characters having to be the new Peggy/Pat. As long as a character is interesting or appealing I don't care what label they can or can't be given..

Sharon is Sharon.
Kathy is Kathy.
Shirley is Shirley.
Pat was Pat.
Peggy is Peggy.

Any relationships between characters should just develop naturally, it shouldn't be about trying to turn characters into other characters.
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Old 23-10-2015, 16:10
wizardt
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I've never understood the obsession with 'matriarchs' on EastEnders. I don't see it mentioned as much in other soaps.
Matriarchs are important in soaps. Corrie has Gail, Audrey, Liz, Rita etc... Emmerdale has Lisa and Diane. Home and Away has Irene and Roo. We need some strong women who rule their families. Sharon, Kat and Kathy would be perfect IMO.

The younger viewers may not understand the importance of matriarchs but I think the older generation would definitely be interested.
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Old 23-10-2015, 16:14
Ell_Ren
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I agree. Most viewers just want to see a good multi generational mixture of interesting characters, controversial characters, likeable characters, fresh new characters and old favourites. I don't know anybody who cares about 'Matriarchs' or characters having to be the new Peggy/Pat. As long as a character is interesting or appealing I don't care what label they can or can't be given..

Sharon is Sharon.
Kathy is Kathy.
Shirley is Shirley.
Pat was Pat.
Peggy is Peggy.

Any relationships between characters should just develop naturally, it shouldn't be about trying to turn characters into other characters.
Brilliant post, I completely agree.
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Old 23-10-2015, 16:16
Adrian_Ward1
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They have potential to be
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Old 23-10-2015, 16:20
Hank1234
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I always thought Shirley was viewed as the new Pat?
No... Pat had a heart
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Old 23-10-2015, 16:29
vald
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Pat and Peggy weren't doormats.
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Old 23-10-2015, 16:33
wizardt
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Pat and Peggy weren't doormats.
Peggy was a doormat when she was with Archie and Eric.
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Old 23-10-2015, 16:34
wizardt
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No... Pat had a heart
I agree with that
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Old 23-10-2015, 16:51
Marcus_Smith
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Yeah pat did have a heart that scene of Kathy on the bench yesterday looking sumber if pat was still in it when it cut back to scene her sitting with Ronnie I imaged it would have been pat sitting there instead of Ronnie with Kathy it's a real shame BK killed Pat Off and DTC is annoying me that he hasn't even had Kathy mention pat her best friend since Kathy returned
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Old 23-10-2015, 16:58
Harlowe
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Pat and Peggy weren't doormats.
Not strictly true but if everyone women who bowed down to a man on this show and that is a lot then they would all be doormats, another over used term which is devoid of it's true meaning.
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Old 23-10-2015, 17:04
vald
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Not strictly true but if everyone women who bowed down to a man on this show and that is a lot then they would all be doormats, another over used term which is devoid of it's true meaning.
Hence the wink
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Old 23-10-2015, 17:13
Harlowe
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Hence the wink
of course, what I meant to say was that with the term matriarchs being overused, Doormat is another that get's thrown about on here, probably one for benalenalen thread
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Old 24-10-2015, 14:11
Broken_Arrow
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Sharon and Kathy were their own characters way before Peggy Mitchell was even invented. They don't need to be the new anything. I'm looking forward to their weird step mum/daughter dynamic though.

Sorry Wiz, that sounds like I'm telling you off, its not meant to!
I was just about to post something similar

Sharon had already been on the show 10 years before Peggy 2.0 rocked up. It was Sharon who was obsessed with The Vic long before the writers decided to appropriate it for Peggy. Sharon doesn't need to be the new anyone. Neither does Kathy for that matter. Pat was her own character and can never be replaced by anyone. Peggy really is very overrated. She's an iconic character no doubt but her character never had as much depth as Sharon, Kathy or Pat. Female soap characters are always going to be feuding over men anyway so there's no need to attempt to replicate Pat Vs. Peggy. It's been going on for countless decades across all forms of televisual media
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Old 24-10-2015, 14:16
Broken_Arrow
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I don't really think she anything like Pat, she & Pat was best friends before she left if anything they was the original premise of the frenemies term because of Pat's history with Pete.
Exactly!

I suppose you'd just have to be watching EastEnders back then to get it. Pat Vs. Kathy was the original Pat Vs. Peggy and much better written too. Same as Sharon's obsession with The Vic existed long before Peggy's and actually made sense because of her history with the place. Peggy only wanted The Vic because it gave her status in the community. That's pretty superficial.
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