They really need to move on from all these superlatives and into something different. Plotlines are becoming repetitive and boring, with a sense of crying wolf!
Synopsis for "Hell Bent" (spoilers)
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Originally Posted by Isambard Brunel:
“And yet according to the BBC, "the Doctor faces the greatest challenge of his many lives. One final test."
One final test.
What else can that possibly mean? The BBC said it, and they said it's final....”
“And yet according to the BBC, "the Doctor faces the greatest challenge of his many lives. One final test."
One final test.
What else can that possibly mean? The BBC said it, and they said it's final....”
I sat a final exam for chemistry. That doesn't mean I'll never do chemistry again.
Perhaps the preceding stories set the scene, and imply that someone is putting the Doctor through tests of worthiness. And this happens to be the last in the sequence.
Originally Posted by Peter Capaldi:
“It's his last final test; The Doctor dies permanently and next series is about a transexual Zygon with an amputated arm with the name of 'Akmed'. He reads some online forum and hears about someone called 'The Doctor'. He meets Rose Tyler, Martha Jones and Donna Noble, all in bed with Jack Harkness, joins in and hears yet more about The Doctor. (Venom sacs in the tongue)
He then goes to his doctor for his yearly checkup.”
“It's his last final test; The Doctor dies permanently and next series is about a transexual Zygon with an amputated arm with the name of 'Akmed'. He reads some online forum and hears about someone called 'The Doctor'. He meets Rose Tyler, Martha Jones and Donna Noble, all in bed with Jack Harkness, joins in and hears yet more about The Doctor. (Venom sacs in the tongue)
He then goes to his doctor for his yearly checkup.”
I read this at work, whilst drinking a cup of tea. This turned out to be a mistake....
Originally Posted by henry_hope:
“They really need to move on from all these superlatives and into something different. Plotlines are becoming repetitive and boring, with a sense of crying wolf!”
“They really need to move on from all these superlatives and into something different. Plotlines are becoming repetitive and boring, with a sense of crying wolf!”
I would agree to an extent that the hyperbole could do with toning down but what is hilarious is that many of the same people lambasting Moffat for being too over dramatic and full of superlatives can be found on other threads calling for a return to a style more like the RTD era. Yes the RTD era which gave us those small scale, low stakes character driven pieces involving The Reality Bomb and THE END OF TIME. It was like an Alan Bennett monologue in those days eh?
Originally Posted by saladfingers81:
“I would agree to an extent that the hyperbole could do with toning down but what is hilarious is that many of the same people lambasting Moffat for being too over dramatic and full of superlatives can be found on other threads calling for a return to a style more like the RTD era. Yes the RTD era which gave us those small scale, low stakes character driven pieces involving The Reality Bomb and THE END OF TIME. It was like an Alan Bennett monologue in those days eh?”
“I would agree to an extent that the hyperbole could do with toning down but what is hilarious is that many of the same people lambasting Moffat for being too over dramatic and full of superlatives can be found on other threads calling for a return to a style more like the RTD era. Yes the RTD era which gave us those small scale, low stakes character driven pieces involving The Reality Bomb and THE END OF TIME. It was like an Alan Bennett monologue in those days eh?”
I would agree. I can't really remember a single series finale buildup in NuWho where the stakes were low, the odds were quite favourable and the episode blurb didn't feature excessive superlatives.
From DWM
"Heaven Sent and Hell Bent are two of Doctor Who's finest episodes. We're not lying. They're pretty outre, instant classics, with - at their beating hearts - a wild, fulminating Doctor"
"Heaven Sent and Hell Bent are two of Doctor Who's finest episodes. We're not lying. They're pretty outre, instant classics, with - at their beating hearts - a wild, fulminating Doctor"
Originally Posted by chocolatecake:
“I read this at work, whilst drinking a cup of tea. This turned out to be a mistake....”
“I read this at work, whilst drinking a cup of tea. This turned out to be a mistake....
”
Part two coming soon...
Originally Posted by chocolatecake:
“I read this at work, whilst drinking a cup of tea. This turned out to be a mistake....”
“I read this at work, whilst drinking a cup of tea. This turned out to be a mistake....
”
Reading and drinking at the same time. Two things merged together, acting in sync.....
......like a hybrid.
Originally Posted by CD93:
“Reading and drinking at the same time. Two things merged together, acting in sync.....
......like a hybrid.”
“Reading and drinking at the same time. Two things merged together, acting in sync.....
......like a hybrid.”
ROFL! XD
The Final Test was supposed to have been provided by The Celestial Toymaker in 1966. But the Doctor was too clever for him. (Famously, it could've been Hartnell's last performance if some people had got their way. Glad they didn't.) So The First Doctor survived, although there was that perilous moment with an item of confectionary at the end of the episode. That would've been a pretty embarrassing reason to have to regenerate. Yeah, almost as bad as the Sixth Doctor's perilous fall all the way off an exercise bike, which was hardly a 'Logopolis' moment...
Maybe a bit pernickety but with all this hybrid retconning and the doctor knowing about it all along ( yet, somehow never having mentioned this once in 50 years 
) hope they don't forget that on his first skaro visit the first Doctor had no idea what a Dalek was.
) hope they don't forget that on his first skaro visit the first Doctor had no idea what a Dalek was.
Originally Posted by moonstone25:
“Maybe a bit pernickety but with all this hybrid retconning and the doctor knowing about it all along ( yet, somehow never having mentioned this once in 50 years ) hope they don't forget that on his first skaro visit the first Doctor had no idea what a Dalek was.”
“Maybe a bit pernickety but with all this hybrid retconning and the doctor knowing about it all along ( yet, somehow never having mentioned this once in 50 years
) hope they don't forget that on his first skaro visit the first Doctor had no idea what a Dalek was.”
Funny thing to wrangle with, that, when you think about it.
Back in the Hartnell era, it was all fair game. Now we have to believe the Lords of Time didn't see the Daleks coming - despite them later foreseeing a time when they are conquerors of the entire Universe.
Originally Posted by moonstone25:
“Maybe a bit pernickety but with all this hybrid retconning and the doctor knowing about it all along ( yet, somehow never having mentioned this once in 50 years ) hope they don't forget that on his first skaro visit the first Doctor had no idea what a Dalek was.”
“Maybe a bit pernickety but with all this hybrid retconning and the doctor knowing about it all along ( yet, somehow never having mentioned this once in 50 years
) hope they don't forget that on his first skaro visit the first Doctor had no idea what a Dalek was.”
Wibbley, wobbley, timey-wimey.
Issue resolved.
Originally Posted by Whoswho1:
“From DWM
"Heaven Sent and Hell Bent are two of Doctor Who's finest episodes. We're not lying. They're pretty outre, instant classics, with - at their beating hearts - a wild, fulminating Doctor"”
“From DWM
"Heaven Sent and Hell Bent are two of Doctor Who's finest episodes. We're not lying. They're pretty outre, instant classics, with - at their beating hearts - a wild, fulminating Doctor"”
Have DWM ever criticised an episode of the show in a preview? Just curious really.
Originally Posted by Rooks:
“Have DWM ever criticised an episode of the show in a preview? Just curious really.”
“Have DWM ever criticised an episode of the show in a preview? Just curious really.”
What do you want them to say?
"Hell sent is the worse episode I've ever seen. I wouldn't recommend you waste 60 minutes with this bullshit, go watch the X-Factor instead"
They try to get you to watch it, not put you off watching it.
Originally Posted by david_Robinson:
“What do you want them to say?
"Hell sent is the worse episode I've ever seen. I wouldn't recommend you waste 60 minutes with this bullshit, go watch the X-Factor instead"”
“What do you want them to say?
"Hell sent is the worse episode I've ever seen. I wouldn't recommend you waste 60 minutes with this bullshit, go watch the X-Factor instead"”
The Radio Times had something along those lines about Journey to the Centre of the TARDIS once, IIRC
DWM previews these days try not to be spoilery and just whet the appetite, really. And usually consist largely of interviews with relevant people, eg Gattis and Sheersmith for the next episode, so they're hardly critical, obviously! Hyperbole is rare, in fairness. And Graham Kibble-White's reviews are always worth a look and I find them v fair and often quite critical. He certainly found fault in the last few episodes, and was not enamoured of the big Capaldi moment last week. Even when I disagree, he's a good read.
I do not work for the BBC OR DWM, btw.
I do not work for the BBC OR DWM, btw.
Originally Posted by david_Robinson:
“What do you want them to say?
"Hell sent is the worse episode I've ever seen. I wouldn't recommend you waste 60 minutes with this bullshit, go watch the X-Factor instead"
.”
“What do you want them to say?
"Hell sent is the worse episode I've ever seen. I wouldn't recommend you waste 60 minutes with this bullshit, go watch the X-Factor instead"
.”
saying something is a classic and saying its good, are two very different things.
Originally Posted by saladfingers81:
“I would agree to an extent that the hyperbole could do with toning down but what is hilarious is that many of the same people lambasting Moffat for being too over dramatic and full of superlatives can be found on other threads calling for a return to a style more like the RTD era. Yes the RTD era which gave us those small scale, low stakes character driven pieces involving The Reality Bomb and THE END OF TIME. It was like an Alan Bennett monologue in those days eh?”
“I would agree to an extent that the hyperbole could do with toning down but what is hilarious is that many of the same people lambasting Moffat for being too over dramatic and full of superlatives can be found on other threads calling for a return to a style more like the RTD era. Yes the RTD era which gave us those small scale, low stakes character driven pieces involving The Reality Bomb and THE END OF TIME. It was like an Alan Bennett monologue in those days eh?”
I agree RTD was guilty of it too, its a flaw the show has had since its return, and its why at this point it makes for a yeah whatever type reaction, as someone else said they have cried wolf far to many times, and its not needed, its bad writing/marketing.
Originally Posted by CD93:
“Reading and drinking at the same time. Two things merged together, acting in sync.....
......like a hybrid.”
“Reading and drinking at the same time. Two things merged together, acting in sync.....
......like a hybrid.”
Me and a friend of mine have started shoehorning "...like a hybrid" in to the end of many sentences. It's annoying as hell, and hellishly hilarious both at the same time...like a hybrid.
Originally Posted by Whoswho1:
“From DWM
"Heaven Sent and Hell Bent are two of Doctor Who's finest episodes. We're not lying. They're pretty outre, instant classics, with - at their beating hearts - a wild, fulminating Doctor"”
“From DWM
"Heaven Sent and Hell Bent are two of Doctor Who's finest episodes. We're not lying. They're pretty outre, instant classics, with - at their beating hearts - a wild, fulminating Doctor"”
Haha I had to laugh at the "we're not lying" it just gave me the impression that they don't even think their word is trusted, and that its possible for them (and indeed have in the past) to lie.
I don't buy into any advance hyping of episodes, these were the people who told us that Kill The Moon was incredible, proper drama, best thing ever (paraphrasing) and what we got was an insult to the human brain, so pinch of salt, plus its Moffat and this year I've just lost faith in him delivering good DW.
Originally Posted by saladfingers81:
“I would agree to an extent that the hyperbole could do with toning down but what is hilarious is that many of the same people lambasting Moffat for being too over dramatic and full of superlatives can be found on other threads calling for a return to a style more like the RTD era. Yes the RTD era which gave us those small scale, low stakes character driven pieces involving The Reality Bomb and THE END OF TIME. It was like an Alan Bennett monologue in those days eh?”
“I would agree to an extent that the hyperbole could do with toning down but what is hilarious is that many of the same people lambasting Moffat for being too over dramatic and full of superlatives can be found on other threads calling for a return to a style more like the RTD era. Yes the RTD era which gave us those small scale, low stakes character driven pieces involving The Reality Bomb and THE END OF TIME. It was like an Alan Bennett monologue in those days eh?”
I think (just my opinion) that RTD was much better at lining up characters that the audience could invest in. School Reunion is a terrific example of the RTD era. Yes, I know it's not an RTD script but it is reflective of his time on the show.
On paper, School Reunion is a story about a universe-threatening plot by the Krillitane.
But actually it's the simpler story of the Doctor being reunited with a former companion and what that reunion means to him, Rose and Sarah Jane.
RTD understood that modern TV audience invest in people. Moffat is much more about the story arc, and doesn't always lay the emotional foundations for an audience to care.
So, yes, RTD gave us a great big Reality Bomb. But didn't us oldies actually care more that Davros recognised Sarah Jane? And didn't we all care more when Donna broke our hearts by having her memory wiped? It was the quieter, human parts of the story that mattered, not the scale of the threat.
Frankly, I punched the air when Amy (FINALLY) left. And I'm counting the days until we say goodbye to Clara. That's not great for a fan who fell in love with Rose, Martha and Donna.
My point is that it doesn't matter how big the story arc is, or how enormous the threat. If you haven't been given characters you care about, none of it matters.
I'm very sad to say that I don't give two hoots about Clara. However she leaves - death or happiness - I just want her to go. I don't think I'm alone in that point of view.
Originally Posted by Mulett:
“I don't give two hoots about Clara. However she leaves - death or happiness - I just want her to go. I don't think I'm alone in that point of view.”
“I don't give two hoots about Clara. However she leaves - death or happiness - I just want her to go. I don't think I'm alone in that point of view.”
Great post, it sums up something I've been meaning to post. RTD's show not only had good, endearing characters, it had lots of them. The current show is just about the Doctor and Clara. Last series, Danny Pink was a very superficial part of the mix, but he was made of papier mâché so I cared even less about that character than Clara.
Most of the characters on the current show (even the guest cast) feel like they've been dreamt-up during a brainstorming session inside Frankie Howerd.
Originally Posted by david_Robinson:
“What do you want them to say?
"Hell sent is the worse episode I've ever seen. I wouldn't recommend you waste 60 minutes with this bullshit, go watch the X-Factor instead"
They try to get you to watch it, not put you off watching it.”
“What do you want them to say?
"Hell sent is the worse episode I've ever seen. I wouldn't recommend you waste 60 minutes with this bullshit, go watch the X-Factor instead"
They try to get you to watch it, not put you off watching it.”
Well that was my point
I wasn't being disrespectful to DWM but of course they are going to say the show is brilliant. My only point was that I wasn't going to get excited about an episode because DWM gave it a great recommendation.
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