Tuning across the AM band last night I heard more Spanish than anything else.
The 'AM death watch' thread...
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Originally Posted by jimbo:
“
Doubt if they can just close it like that. Remember that the old 247 metres network was a BBC network”
“
Doubt if they can just close it like that. Remember that the old 247 metres network was a BBC network”
Yes, and your point is ?.
Originally Posted by jimbo:
“They would need approval I assume to close it ”
“They would need approval I assume to close it ”
Yes, they'd effectively be handing back the INR 2 licence to Ofcom
Originally Posted by jimbo:
“and then what would happen to the transmitters - ie the ones used for that service?
.”
“and then what would happen to the transmitters - ie the ones used for that service?
.”
Switched off, and possibly scrapped, unless Ofcom re-advertised the INR2 licence, but who'd bother to apply ?
Originally Posted by swb1964:
“Tuning across the AM band last night I heard more Spanish than anything else.”
“Tuning across the AM band last night I heard more Spanish than anything else.”
In many countries DAB+ has replaced AM, but in Spain DAB has made little impact
From http://gorkazumeta.blogspot.com.es/2...a-pese-el.html
The El Pais newspaper said DAB is dead, but seems to refer to the auction of the unused L band, but DAB is continuing and there is a chance AM might start cutting back.
Originally Posted by Mark C:
“Yes, and your point is ?.
Yes, they'd effectively be handing back the INR 2 licence to Ofcom
Switched off, and possibly scrapped, unless Ofcom re-advertised the INR2 licence, but who'd bother to apply ?”
“Yes, and your point is ?.
Yes, they'd effectively be handing back the INR 2 licence to Ofcom
Switched off, and possibly scrapped, unless Ofcom re-advertised the INR2 licence, but who'd bother to apply ?”
I am sure the accountants at Bauer having been looking at the costs of the 1215AM/MW transmission contract against any potential loss of audience and the affect on advertising revenue. Basically a Cost–benefit analysis.
Absolute/Bauer also must have noticed that all digital service BBC 6 Music has got more listeners and slightly bigger market share than Absolute.
The national Absolute 1215 AM + DAB (includes London on 105.8 FM) and other digital platforms weekly reach is 4% 1,983,000 listeners who listen on average for 7.9 hours per week giving a market share of 1.5% of the UK 53,575,000 adult population.
BBC 6 Music on DAB + other digital platforms weekly reach is 4% 2,055,000 with 9.1 hours per listener giving 1.8% market share.
A clear sign if ever there was one to close down the entire AM network. Ofcom and transmission provider Arqiva would probably require at least 6 months notice. Ofcom would not readvertise the 1215 AM network + relays.
Originally Posted by Craig Kelly:
“I am sure the accountants at Bauer having been looking at the costs of the 1215AM/MW transmission contract against any potential loss of audience and the affect on advertising revenue. Basically a Cost–benefit analysis.
Absolute/Bauer also must have noticed that all digital service BBC 6 Music has got more listeners and slightly bigger market share than Absolute.
The national Absolute 1215 AM + DAB (includes London on 105.8 FM) and other digital platforms weekly reach is 4% 1,983,000 listeners who listen on average for 7.9 hours per week giving a market share of 1.5% of the UK 53,575,000 adult population.
BBC 6 Music on DAB + other digital platforms weekly reach is 4% 2,055,000 with 9.1 hours per listener giving 1.8% market share.
A clear sign if ever there was one to close down the entire AM network. Ofcom and transmission provider Arqiva would probably require at least 6 months notice. Ofcom would not readvertise the 1215 AM network + relays.”
“I am sure the accountants at Bauer having been looking at the costs of the 1215AM/MW transmission contract against any potential loss of audience and the affect on advertising revenue. Basically a Cost–benefit analysis.
Absolute/Bauer also must have noticed that all digital service BBC 6 Music has got more listeners and slightly bigger market share than Absolute.
The national Absolute 1215 AM + DAB (includes London on 105.8 FM) and other digital platforms weekly reach is 4% 1,983,000 listeners who listen on average for 7.9 hours per week giving a market share of 1.5% of the UK 53,575,000 adult population.
BBC 6 Music on DAB + other digital platforms weekly reach is 4% 2,055,000 with 9.1 hours per listener giving 1.8% market share.
A clear sign if ever there was one to close down the entire AM network. Ofcom and transmission provider Arqiva would probably require at least 6 months notice. Ofcom would not readvertise the 1215 AM network + relays.”
As uncovered at the time Reading was turned off there are compulsory transmitters associated with the INR2 licence, and others that Virgin added to improve coverage. Presumably Bauer could turn off all the non-compulsory transmitters tomorrow as a first step, although unless Arqiva were going to give some sort of rebate it might not be of benefit.
Are there any penalties for handing in your licence early?
Originally Posted by Colin_London:
“As uncovered at the time Reading was turned off there are compulsory transmitters associated with the INR2 licence, and others that Virgin added to improve coverage. Presumably Bauer could turn off all the non-compulsory transmitters tomorrow as a first step, although unless Arqiva were going to give some sort of rebate it might not be of benefit.
Are there any penalties for handing in your licence early?”
“As uncovered at the time Reading was turned off there are compulsory transmitters associated with the INR2 licence, and others that Virgin added to improve coverage. Presumably Bauer could turn off all the non-compulsory transmitters tomorrow as a first step, although unless Arqiva were going to give some sort of rebate it might not be of benefit.
Are there any penalties for handing in your licence early?”
No. There is no Ofcom penalty for handing back an analogue licence; it is a commercial decision.
The programme service from Absolute Radio would continue as normal, nothing would change. It would be available UK wide on DAB on D1 plus 105.8 FM around London and 105.2 FM in Birmingham and the West Midlands and also on all digital devices including smartphones, tablets, online, DTV via Freeview and Sky.
Having heard the auto-loop announcements last night on 747 kHz for the Dutch NPO Radio 5 Nostalgia which is leaving AM when 747AM is shut down tonight, it does make sense for Absolute to do the same.
Absolute could have a schedule of transmission changes, including as suggested by Colin, closure of the low-powered relays (1197 kHz etc.) and the high powered main sites on 1215AM could be reduced in output power, for example, going down to the power levels when used by BBC Radio 1 on 247m.
Brookmans Park for London and the SE could change from 125 kW to 50 kW output power; Moorside Edge for Yorkshire and the north from 200 kW to 100 kW and Westerglen for central Scotland from 100 kW to 25 kW.
The advantage of that is reduced operating costs passed on to Absolute and it makes AM listeners move to digital platforms.
Originally Posted by Craig Kelly:
“and Westerglen for central Scotland from 100 kW to 25 kW.”
“and Westerglen for central Scotland from 100 kW to 25 kW.”
They might as well just switch it off as do that. It's barely listenable much of the time as it is.
Originally Posted by Craig Kelly:
“No. There is no Ofcom penalty for handing back an analogue licence; it is a commercial decision.
The programme service from Absolute Radio would continue as normal, nothing would change. It would be available UK wide on DAB on D1 plus 105.8 FM around London and 105.2 FM in Birmingham and the West Midlands and also on all digital devices including smartphones, tablets, online, DTV via Freeview and Sky.
Having heard the auto-loop announcements last night on 747 kHz for the Dutch NPO Radio 5 Nostalgia which is leaving AM when 747AM is shut down tonight, it does make sense for Absolute to do the same.
Absolute could have a schedule of transmission changes, including as suggested by Colin, closure of the low-powered relays (1197 kHz etc.) and the high powered main sites on 1215AM could be reduced in output power, for example, going down to the power levels when used by BBC Radio 1 on 247m.
Brookmans Park for London and the SE could change from 125 kW to 50 kW output power; Moorside Edge for Yorkshire and the north from 200 kW to 100 kW and Westerglen for central Scotland from 100 kW to 25 kW.
The advantage of that is reduced operating costs passed on to Absolute and it makes AM listeners move to digital platforms.”
“No. There is no Ofcom penalty for handing back an analogue licence; it is a commercial decision.
The programme service from Absolute Radio would continue as normal, nothing would change. It would be available UK wide on DAB on D1 plus 105.8 FM around London and 105.2 FM in Birmingham and the West Midlands and also on all digital devices including smartphones, tablets, online, DTV via Freeview and Sky.
Having heard the auto-loop announcements last night on 747 kHz for the Dutch NPO Radio 5 Nostalgia which is leaving AM when 747AM is shut down tonight, it does make sense for Absolute to do the same.
Absolute could have a schedule of transmission changes, including as suggested by Colin, closure of the low-powered relays (1197 kHz etc.) and the high powered main sites on 1215AM could be reduced in output power, for example, going down to the power levels when used by BBC Radio 1 on 247m.
Brookmans Park for London and the SE could change from 125 kW to 50 kW output power; Moorside Edge for Yorkshire and the north from 200 kW to 100 kW and Westerglen for central Scotland from 100 kW to 25 kW.
The advantage of that is reduced operating costs passed on to Absolute and it makes AM listeners move to digital platforms.”
I no its not on Fm but could talksport do the same then.
Originally Posted by David_Ayling:
“I no its not on Fm but could talksport do the same then.”
“I no its not on Fm but could talksport do the same then.”
Yes they could. However as a speech station people have less of a reason to want to listen in higher quality than the 4KHz bandwidth afforded by AM. Talksport still has a large majority of its listening via AM particularly drivers so I can't see them hurrying to follow Bauers lead if Abdolute does leave AM.
Originally Posted by Craig Kelly:
“No. There is no Ofcom penalty for handing back an analogue licence; it is a commercial decision.
The programme service from Absolute Radio would continue as normal, nothing would change. It would be available UK wide on DAB on D1 plus 105.8 FM around London and 105.2 FM in Birmingham and the West Midlands and also on all digital devices including smartphones, tablets, online, DTV via Freeview and Sky.
Having heard the auto-loop announcements last night on 747 kHz for the Dutch NPO Radio 5 Nostalgia which is leaving AM when 747AM is shut down tonight, it does make sense for Absolute to do the same.
Absolute could have a schedule of transmission changes, including as suggested by Colin, closure of the low-powered relays (1197 kHz etc.) and the high powered main sites on 1215AM could be reduced in output power, for example, going down to the power levels when used by BBC Radio 1 on 247m.
Brookmans Park for London and the SE could change from 125 kW to 50 kW output power; Moorside Edge for Yorkshire and the north from 200 kW to 100 kW and Westerglen for central Scotland from 100 kW to 25 kW.
The advantage of that is reduced operating costs passed on to Absolute and it makes AM listeners move to digital platforms.”
“No. There is no Ofcom penalty for handing back an analogue licence; it is a commercial decision.
The programme service from Absolute Radio would continue as normal, nothing would change. It would be available UK wide on DAB on D1 plus 105.8 FM around London and 105.2 FM in Birmingham and the West Midlands and also on all digital devices including smartphones, tablets, online, DTV via Freeview and Sky.
Having heard the auto-loop announcements last night on 747 kHz for the Dutch NPO Radio 5 Nostalgia which is leaving AM when 747AM is shut down tonight, it does make sense for Absolute to do the same.
Absolute could have a schedule of transmission changes, including as suggested by Colin, closure of the low-powered relays (1197 kHz etc.) and the high powered main sites on 1215AM could be reduced in output power, for example, going down to the power levels when used by BBC Radio 1 on 247m.
Brookmans Park for London and the SE could change from 125 kW to 50 kW output power; Moorside Edge for Yorkshire and the north from 200 kW to 100 kW and Westerglen for central Scotland from 100 kW to 25 kW.
The advantage of that is reduced operating costs passed on to Absolute and it makes AM listeners move to digital platforms.”
I might be wrong but isn't Moorside Edge already 100kW?
Originally Posted by Craig Kelly:
“No. There is no Ofcom penalty for handing back an analogue licence; it is a commercial decision.”
“No. There is no Ofcom penalty for handing back an analogue licence; it is a commercial decision.”
The maintenance contract might have a penalty for early closure?, If Virgin started using AM in 1993 and was say 12 years, might have been renewed in 2005 for another 12 years and was passed onto Absolute, so might finish 2017 (or 2016?)
I notice that the normally reliable Frequency Finder is now reporting this, albeit with the caveat "reportedly"
Has anyone else actually heard one of these announcements?
http://www.frequencyfinder.org.uk/updates_fa.html
Has anyone else actually heard one of these announcements?
http://www.frequencyfinder.org.uk/updates_fa.html
When Radio 3 was on 1215 kHz, Droitwich used 30kW. Now it is using 105 kW. Surely that could be put back at 30 kW?
Originally Posted by jimbo:
“When Radio 3 was on 1215 kHz, Droitwich used 30kW.”
“When Radio 3 was on 1215 kHz, Droitwich used 30kW.”
And reception, especially at night, was diabolical. I remember trying to listen to winter cricket tours of the West Indies and giving up.
I'd rather they simply flicked the switch off than did that.
Parts of Wales would probably still need Absolute to remain on AM to keep listening due to lack of DAB signal (same goes for some other parts of the UK)
Originally Posted by swb1964:
“And reception, especially at night, was diabolical. I remember trying to listen to winter cricket tours of the West Indies and giving up.
I'd rather they simply flicked the switch off than did that.”
“And reception, especially at night, was diabolical. I remember trying to listen to winter cricket tours of the West Indies and giving up.
I'd rather they simply flicked the switch off than did that.”
Depends where you are. I happened to be in Worcester and it was fine there but I was only 8 miles from the transmitter! It was OK in Hereford as well but not 100% - small amount of indterfearance underneath.
Originally Posted by philengland:
“Parts of Wales would probably still need Absolute to remain on AM to keep listening due to lack of DAB signal (same goes for some other parts of the UK)”
“Parts of Wales would probably still need Absolute to remain on AM to keep listening due to lack of DAB signal (same goes for some other parts of the UK)”
You are certainly right, but of course Absolute aren't a PSB and have no coverage obligations AFAIK? They could ...(I'm not saying they would).... simply say tough luck.
I have to add, however, that I've still to hear one of these announcements, despite listening pretty extensively to Trowell 1197 this aft. It's possible they are only on at certain times or certain transmitters but I'm calling this out as BS until I hear something myself, or see an announcement on the website.
Here is another own showing the last few minutes of 747 kHz and then 675 kHz. Apparently that last tune played on 747 was a tune that Radio Veronica used to play to end their broadcasts for the day. The AM broadcast of 675 was shutdown at lot less ceremoniously in the middle of a phone-in conversation. Presumably most people were already listening digitally anyway.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-o4fQU2qLw8
One by one the stations of our youth are disappearing into the ether as the digital advance cuts swathes through the analogue wavebands. Its not quite the same having a perfect signal for some distant radio station when it was a struggle to log some dx after a local or strong tx had closed down. Mind it could be interesting in the winter months to come with transAtlantic, African and Asian stations ( and maybe Australasian) to hunt down now that the high power European ones are no longer there.
Yes I'm afraid DXing broadcast stations is a dying hobby. Satellite TV DX may last a bit longer, but again as access to fast broadband and IPTV streaming grows that too is on borrowed time.
I've said before we maybe heading for a final golden age of AM DX as Europe closes down before Africa and Asia and the USA. After they too close we may see pirates set in? I can't see closing down an AM pirate would be a very high priority in 2025 so they maybe become fairly common across Europe?
Originally Posted by swb1964:
“I've said before we maybe heading for a final golden age of AM DX as Europe closes down before Africa and Asia and the USA. After they too close we may see pirates set in? I can't see closing down an AM pirate would be a very high priority in 2025 so they maybe become fairly common across Europe?”
“I've said before we maybe heading for a final golden age of AM DX as Europe closes down before Africa and Asia and the USA. After they too close we may see pirates set in? I can't see closing down an AM pirate would be a very high priority in 2025 so they maybe become fairly common across Europe?”
Interesting point but I'm sure that Offcom and its equivalents, not to say governments will want to flog off the spectrum to the highest bidders for anything but broadcast reasons. Somehow these authorities have to keep up the establishment dissaproval of anything exiting or innovative or risque just in case us lower classes and plebs might enjoy and get away with something which may challenge the required Reithian standards!
One is always drawn to the saying "Bugger the and damn the consequences"!
Would anyone be interested in buying the MW spectrum ? Is there anything just above or just below the medium wave band currently?
Originally Posted by swb1964:
“I've said before we maybe heading for a final golden age of AM DX as Europe closes down before Africa and Asia and the USA. After they too close we may see pirates set in? I can't see closing down an AM pirate would be a very high priority in 2025 so they maybe become fairly common across Europe?”
“I've said before we maybe heading for a final golden age of AM DX as Europe closes down before Africa and Asia and the USA. After they too close we may see pirates set in? I can't see closing down an AM pirate would be a very high priority in 2025 so they maybe become fairly common across Europe?”
Yes I agree, for the next few years MW should be fertile ground for dx.
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