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The 'AM death watch' thread...


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Old 17-08-2013, 10:11
hanssolo
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I would love to see 648Khz used for high powered use as it would offer excellant coverage from one of the higher powered transmitters.

Like Radio Caroline
Ofcom have said 648k may be used for community radio
http://licensing.ofcom.org.uk/radio-...tes/update1012
And allowed stations to apply for new MW licences later this year.
http://licensing.ofcom.org.uk/radio-...tes/update1212
So there is a good possibility Caroline may get 648khz or another frequency in time for the 50th anniversary in 2014 but the power may be restricted, however Caroline even if they got a high power licence, may not have the funds from donations for high power anyway. I expect a lot of listeners will use online stereo rather than AM.
http://www.radiocaroline.co.uk/#support_group.html

990 from Berlin seems to be the next casualty lined up. 3rd September
Noticed the rest of the German frequencies 153, 207, 549, 756, 1268,
plus Luxembourg http://www.radioluxembourg.co.uk/ 1440 (currently CRI) and Netherlands Radio 5 747 are due to close in 2014
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Old 17-08-2013, 11:19
david16
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For AM listening on an old style standard analogue radio, it has the echo of an empty hall with vinyl or laminate flooring in many cases.

Hearing "Beep beep-beep-beep beep-beep beep-beep-beep-beep beep-beep beep ........." as well whining or whaling and constantly fading in and out when tuned in fully and you're trying to listen is truly horrific.
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Old 17-08-2013, 11:50
MikeBr
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Noticed the rest of the German frequencies 153, 207, 549, 756, 1268,
plus Luxembourg http://www.radioluxembourg.co.uk/ 1440 (currently CRI) and Netherlands Radio 5 747 are due to close in 2014
It was suggested on one website that Radio 5 Nostalgie 747 would possibly close early in 2015 and that a decision would be made in June. I haven't read anything else since? I did check this website for any follow up story a couple of weeks ago.
http://radio.nl/778116/radio-5-mogel...-de-middengolf

A German speaking contact of mine says the remaining public broadcast frequencies will probably close in 2014. The 990 transmitter was owned by Deutschlandradio. The others are "owned and operated by Media Broadcast, considerable investments (replacing the tube transmitters by new TRAM solid-state units, modifying the antennas) have been done to make these facilities DRM-capable (a good amount of licence fee payers money, wasted), and thus binding transmission contracts are in place until 2016. So cancelling early will presumably require compensations."
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Old 17-08-2013, 11:51
lundavra
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For AM listening on an old style standard analogue radio, it has the echo of an empty hall with vinyl or laminate flooring in many cases.

Hearing "Beep beep-beep-beep beep-beep beep-beep-beep-beep beep-beep beep ........." as well whining or whaling and constantly fading in and out when tuned in fully and you're trying to listen is truly horrific.
Are there are any figures for the number listening on Medium Wave? I have not used it for years and would struggle to find it on the car radio. At one time I might try Medium Wave / Long Wave when out of VHF FM coverage but now if out of DAB / VHF FM coverage I put a CD on.

I can't remember hearing anyone else listening to Medium Wave or Long Wave either.

I can't imagine anyone apart from the big national broadcasters being able to afford the running costs of high power Medium Wave / Long Wave and most of them would like to find a reason to close it down.
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Old 17-08-2013, 11:55
MikeBr
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Are there are any figures for the number listening on Medium Wave? I have not used it for years and would struggle to find it on the car radio. At one time I might try Medium Wave / Long Wave when out of VHF FM coverage but now if out of DAB / VHF FM coverage I put a CD on.

I can't remember hearing anyone else listening to Medium Wave or Long Wave either.

I can't imagine anyone apart from the big national broadcasters being able to afford the running costs of high power Medium Wave / Long Wave and most of them would like to find a reason to close it down.
Talksport and Radio 5 Live will have figures for AM listening, most of their in car listening will be on AM. Quick google gave me this one from James Cridland's blog:

"In Q1 2010, AM listening accounted for only 55% of Radio 5 Live’s listening, a figure that should have decreased since as more make the switch away from it."

Think I've seen a more recent one. And there must be a large percentage of Talksport and 5 Live listeners who listen on digital at home, AM in the car.
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Old 17-08-2013, 12:37
BMR
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T

"In Q1 2010, AM listening accounted for only 55% of Radio 5 Live’s listening, a figure that should have decreased since as more make the switch away from it."

.
Wow, that is low-it's probably below 50% by now. Presumably Absolute is lower still?
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Old 17-08-2013, 12:51
hanssolo
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It was suggested on one website that Radio 5 Nostalgie 747 would possibly close early in 2015 and that a decision would be made in June. I haven't read anything else since? I did check this website for any follow up story a couple of weeks ago.
http://radio.nl/778116/radio-5-mogel...-de-middengolf

A German speaking contact of mine says the remaining public broadcast frequencies will probably close in 2014. The 990 transmitter was owned by Deutschlandradio. The others are "owned and operated by Media Broadcast, considerable investments (replacing the tube transmitters by new TRAM solid-state units, modifying the antennas) have been done to make these facilities DRM-capable (a good amount of licence fee payers money, wasted), and thus binding transmission contracts are in place until 2016. So cancelling early will presumably require compensations."
Thanks for the updates, 1440 was also used daytime for DRM by RTL's German pop service and had potential, but with the lack of reasonable sets sadly DRM30 is now virtually dead in Europe.
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Old 17-08-2013, 20:04
Glenn A
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It seems that we have gone down the American route with medium wave by largely confining it to talk and golden oldies stations. I only use it occasionally in the car if Wimbledon or the Olympics are on and almost all my listening is now on FM or DAB.
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Old 17-08-2013, 20:38
BMR
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AM. Say M it's over

Ray M. Pay M. it's rover

Lay M, Tay M. It's cover

Way M, Flay M. It's mover
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Old 17-08-2013, 20:57
G.F.M.
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I would love to see 648Khz used for high powered use as it would offer excellant coverage from one of the higher powered transmitters.

Like Radio Caroline
Who would pay??
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Old 17-08-2013, 21:00
wavy-davy
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Who would pay??
Mainly some US bible bashers probably.
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Old 17-08-2013, 22:56
Hertz
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I would love to see 648Khz used for high powered use as it would offer excellant coverage from one of the higher powered transmitters.

Like Radio Caroline
Depends on which antenna they're using if you're talking about Orford Ness. The directional one was abysmal at this location when the BBC World Service were using it, whereas the Omni directional one could be received even during the day.

It's a shame all these high powered transmitting stations are being dismantled after closing down, rather than being put out to tender. I'm sure some of the private commercial/pirate stations would love to use such a facility if the price were right. Seems a terrible waste.

I think Daventry was demolished some time ago. Daventry would have covered most of the UK by day and night.

I think Tullamore and Athlone are still there, as far as I'm aware. Both covered large parts of the UK by day and night as well.
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Old 18-08-2013, 01:06
lundavra
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Depends on which antenna they're using if you're talking about Orford Ness. The directional one was abysmal at this location when the BBC World Service were using it, whereas the Omni directional one could be received even during the day.

It's a shame all these high powered transmitting stations are being dismantled after closing down, rather than being put out to tender. I'm sure some of the private commercial/pirate stations would love to use such a facility if the price were right. Seems a terrible waste.

I think Daventry was demolished some time ago. Daventry would have covered most of the UK by day and night.

I think Tullamore and Athlone are still there, as far as I'm aware. Both covered large parts of the UK by day and night as well.
I can't imagine a 'private commercial/pirate stations' having a hope of affording one. I don't know how much Arquiva would charge but it would be a lot.

I think Daventry Medium Wave closed many years ago though the mast is still used.
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Old 18-08-2013, 08:08
LaurelandHardy
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AM. Say M it's over

Ray M. Pay M. it's rover

Lay M, Tay M. It's cover

Way M, Flay M. It's mover
Are you on drugs?
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Old 18-08-2013, 10:09
G.F.M.
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[quote=Hertz;67997359]Depends on which antenna they're using if you're talking about Orford Ness. The directional one was abysmal at this location when the BBC World Service were using it, whereas the Omni directional one could be received even during the day.

It's a shame all these high powered transmitting stations are being dismantled after closing down, rather than being put out to tender. I'm sure some of the private commercial/pirate stations would love to use such a facility if the price were right. Seems a terrible waste.
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Old 18-08-2013, 10:11
G.F.M.
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[quote=G.F.M.;68004501]
Depends on which antenna they're using if you're talking about Orford Ness. The directional one was abysmal at this location when the BBC World Service were using it, whereas the Omni directional one could be received even during the day.

It's a shame all these high powered transmitting stations are being dismantled after closing down, rather than being put out to tender. I'm sure some of the private commercial/pirate stations would love to use such a facility if the price were right. Seems a terrible waste.
Orford Ness would not be the best site for a high power omni directional signal. Half of it would be wasted over the north sea
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Old 18-08-2013, 10:26
MikeBr
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Wow, that is low-it's probably below 50% by now. Presumably Absolute is lower still?
I wonder if that figure included Sports Extra. The 5 Live Review said:

""Some 39 per cent of listening to 5 live is on a digital platform,with the majority of this on DAB radio. This is the highest proportion of all the BBC network radio stations. BBC management’s submission to the review states that the inconsistent availability of 5 live’s medium wave frequency, as well as the possibility that medium wave will become unsustainable in the long term,has made migrating audiences from medium wave to digital a high priority for the station."

Those are Q1 2011 figures.
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Old 18-08-2013, 10:31
MikeBr
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I can't imagine a 'private commercial/pirate stations' having a hope of affording one. I don't know how much Arquiva would charge but it would be a lot.

I think Daventry Medium Wave closed many years ago though the mast is still used.
Yes for BBC National DAB and Digital One.
http://tx.mb21.co.uk/gallery/daventry/daventry-mb21.php
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Old 18-08-2013, 19:17
Hertz
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I think Daventry Medium Wave closed many years ago though the mast is still used..

Nope. Was demolished quite some time ago:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=AGFO-ShonEU

I can't imagine a 'private commercial/pirate stations' having a hope of affording one. I don't know how much Arquiva would charge but it would be a lot
Has anyone ever tried, apart from the Netherlands ?

Orford Ness would not be the best site for a high power omni directional signal. Half of it would be wasted over the north sea
Well, I was thinking in the context that both antennas are still there. The Omni directional one did cover quite a huge area of the UK by day and even more at night. It was quite audible at this location (Co. Antrim) during daylight even in summer.
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Old 18-08-2013, 19:23
Hertz
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It's fine saying most stations are available on the internet, but what happens if the internet ever goes down ? We're stuck. That's the problem with it, and it could take quite a long time to get back up and running again.

Putting all your eggs in one basket is a dangerous strategy. At least good old fashioned AM and FM were impervious to these sort of problems.

DRM would have been great if they'd sorted out the receiver problem. Why no one did this is beyond me..They managed it with DAB. Why not DRM ?
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Old 18-08-2013, 20:30
kev
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DRM would have been great if they'd sorted out the receiver problem. Why no one did this is beyond me..They managed it with DAB. Why not DRM ?
Lack of demand? DAB already catered for the main PSBs and for the shortwave stations operations were already winding down and on FM in major population centres.
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Old 18-08-2013, 20:46
ney
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I myself have no really listened to AM radio much for a good few years now, As all the AM stations here are also on DAB. I remember the days lieing in bed going though the old AM trying to see what I could pick up tha was not local or from Scotland.
I still listen to FM at times though.

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Old 18-08-2013, 22:17
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[quote=G.F.M.;68004533]

Orford Ness would not be the best site for a high power omni directional signal. Half of it would be wasted over the north sea
The lovely thing about sea path is that when the signal hits land it wouldn't have been severely attenuated.
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Old 18-08-2013, 22:19
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I think Tullamore and Athlone are still there, as far as I'm aware. Both covered large parts of the UK by day and night as well.
Athlone is effectively gone as one mast was dismantled. Tullamore could be used with a new transmitter.
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Old 18-08-2013, 22:35
hanssolo
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Spirit radio in Ireland which has an AM licence was going to build a new 100kw site for 612khz but decided it was cheaper to use the existing unused 20kw 549khz site and go for many FM relays in towns
Sad video, they said the very tall 648 AM mast was too expensive to keep.
The remaining Daventry mast now used for DAB at 10kw shown on the mb21 site might have been part of the 250kw shortwave arrays?
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