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On reflection J&A were right to ditch the jive
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babyboomer10
18-12-2015
While their jive is arguably one of the best and most enjoyed dances on Strictly to date, it probably has less appeal for the 2 performers than it does for the viewers. Jay & Aliona spend most of the time dancing separately and at times just to the camera and hardly ever touch each other other than a few fingertips.

Although Aliona had to teach Jay the steps & sequence, of necessity the choreography was 90% copied from the original in the film. There are no kudos and probably little satisfaction for a professional like Aliona in getting her partner to the final and then putting on a dance that was a copy with hardly any original choreography, even if they did it better than Travolta & Thurman.

Jay said on ITT that he had only watched the jive a couple of times but he had watched the tango over & over, so that shows the kind of things that please him. In the Paso he will have the chance to dance with his partner and their attention is 100% on each other and not performed in a 'look at me' stance to the camera. He can put on his stern, haughty look while moving with Aliona round the floor and when they are out of hold, who wouldn't feel good ith a woman like Aliona teasing around wafting her skirts at him, eyes locked together.

The final is a once in a lifetime for Jay (3 for Aliona) and choosing the Paso is as much about them as the here today forgotten tomorrow glitterball.
claire2281
18-12-2015
That reads bizarrely like they're considering things like a romantic couple, which they aren't

Nor was it a copy of the film beyond the general feel of it.

Tbh they should be doing the Jive because it still remains his most impressive dance for both the public and judges and it was long enough ago in the competition that he could improve it further. It was also far better choreographed than the one he's chosen.

IF something unexpected happens and they don't win they might regret that choice.
DeltaBlues
18-12-2015
Originally Posted by babyboomer10:
“While their jive is arguably one of the best and most enjoyed dances on Strictly to date, it probably has less appeal for the 2 performers than it does for the viewers. Jay & Aliona spend most of the time dancing separately and at times just to the camera and hardly ever touch each other other than a few fingertips.

Although Aliona had to teach Jay the steps & sequence, of necessity the choreography was 90% copied from the original in the film. There are no kudos and probably little satisfaction for a professional like Aliona in getting her partner to the final and then putting on a dance that was a copy with hardly any original choreography, even if they did it better than Travolta & Thurman.

Jay said on ITT that he had only watched the jive a couple of times but he had watched the tango over & over, so that shows the kind of things that please him. In the Paso he will have the chance to dance with his partner and their attention is 100% on each other and not performed in a 'look at me' stance to the camera. He can put on his stern, haughty look while moving with Aliona round the floor and when they are out of hold, who wouldn't feel good ith a woman like Aliona teasing around wafting her skirts at him, eyes locked together.

The final is a once in a lifetime for Jay (3 for Aliona) and choosing the Paso is as much about them as the here today forgotten tomorrow glitterball.”

1) There is an active thread just a little bit further down the front page on this topic.

2) 90% of the choreography was NOT copied from the film. Travolta & Thurman don't jive in Pulp Fiction...the whole point of the scene is that they're rubbish dancers. Aliona copied a couple of the iconic moves (the first few seconds of their arm movements, the few seconds of twist before the music changes) to make it clear what they were referencing, but at least 90% of the choreo was her original work.
babyboomer10
18-12-2015
Originally Posted by claire2281:
“That reads bizarrely like they're considering things like a romantic couple, which they aren't ”

Nothing to do with personal involvement at all - how often do you hear the judges say things like 'supposed to be the dance of love but I didn't see any connection between the 2 of you' etc

If you are putting on a dance performance you need play the part not just do the moves. Jay's comments show he likes to dance with his partner rather than as a showman. Maybe it's because he is supposedly quite shy - a Wanted member said he was quite introverted in the group
Ellie1967
18-12-2015
I'm not sure if you're having a veiled dig at them or have just never seen Pulp Fiction, but hardly any of the choreography was copied from the film because, as Deltablues said, they don't jive in the film they just do a bit of twist. Aliona should get plenty of 'kudos' for her choreography - which was more like 95% original than 10%.
SeasideLady
18-12-2015
They've put in a little bit of the end of the jive at the end of the show dance as a nod to it - there's a few favourite parts of most of their dances in it, such as rumba, AS, AT, charleston and tango. Slightly tweaked with newer stuff as well. If you check the training clip you can see.
treetree
18-12-2015
i think the only reason they were right to ditch the jive was it was sooooo good first time around - should it not come off for any reason , they would be slated royally for trying to recreate it again
mirandaweb
18-12-2015
Pretty sure that the main reason they're not doing the Jive is that it would be problematic to get his hair from that (slicked black with extensions) to normal (and maybe back again) for at least one of the other dances. That was my first thought when people started talking about the jive for the final!
Ellie1967
18-12-2015
Originally Posted by mirandaweb:
“Pretty sure that the main reason they're not doing the Jive is that it would be problematic to get his hair from that (slicked black with extensions) to normal (and maybe back again) for at least one of the other dances. That was my first thought when people started talking about the jive for the final!”

If they did it as couple's choice it would be done after the break, so plenty of time to put the ponytail in and there would be no more dances afterwards.
Bedlam_maid
18-12-2015
Originally Posted by treetree:
“i think the only reason they were right to ditch the jive was it was sooooo good first time around - should it not come off for any reason , they would be slated royally for trying to recreate it again”

I absolutely agree with this, and although I'm disappointed not to be seeing it again I would be more disappointed to see it again and it be less than perfect.

That jive was one of the most memorable SCD moments of all time for me and I would like it to stay that way.
BMLisa
18-12-2015
Originally Posted by Bedlam_maid:
“I absolutely agree with this, and although I'm disappointed not to be seeing it again I would be more disappointed to see it again and it be less than perfect.

That jive was one of the most memorable SCD moments of all time for me and I would like it to stay that way.”

Same!

It was the right call. I'm only gutted it won't get its rightful 40
daziechain
18-12-2015
Originally Posted by treetree:
“i think the only reason they were right to ditch the jive was it was sooooo good first time around - should it not come off for any reason , they would be slated royally for trying to recreate it again”

This ^^. However good it was it could never be as good as when we first saw it (after pretty ropey training footage) but if it wasn't good he would get slaughtered. Most of the others (don't know Katie's choice yet) have the opportunity to improve upon theirs. He couldn't improve on his but he could muck it up. Jay's not the most confident of contestants ... the extra pressure on him would be immense.
He's made the right decision for him. If that affects his vote then so be it but I don't believe it will.
cantos
18-12-2015
Everyone I know that watches the show expect Jay to dance the Jive in the final.

As mentioned elsewhere, I do think that if he does not dance it, then he could actually cost him the title.

If Jay has been your favourite throughout then obviously it will not matter, but I along with a lot of others who vote for the best dance of the night,may have only earmarked that dance as the best he has done.

By not doing the jive he has handicapped himself and could possibly lose out if the dance he has chosen does not match the competitions choices.

If he had danced the jive, there was no doubt that my votes would have gone to him if performed to the same standard; but now it is going to be just the luck of the draw.
Reserved
18-12-2015
Of course it was the right call - they'd said they'd never got the rehearsals right throughout the week and it all fell into place on the night perfectly. They got lucky - they're saying best to let everyone keep the initial memory of it because they know that won't be able to repeat it mistake-free and don't want to risk it.

No shame in that since it was a difficult dance technically, but why their fans try to make up excuses, I have no idea. Just be honest - they'd never match it again and don't want to risk it in the final.

It doesn't even matter - he can turn up and dance the Jive perfectly, turn up and dance the Jive with mistakes, turn up and fart, or not turn up at all. The result will be the same regardless.

He's a wimp. His best received dance and he denies his fans of it in a celebratory episode/finale just because he wants to win - which everyone knows he will, so just do it. Really has nothing to lose. Even if his win wasn't locked in, surely you want to give your fans what they want or is he that desperate to win?
Ellie1967
18-12-2015
Originally Posted by Reserved:
“He's a wimp. His best received dance and he denies his fans of it in a celebratory episode/finale just because he wants to win - which everyone knows he will, so just do it. Really has nothing to lose. Even if his win wasn't locked in, surely you want to give your fans what they want or is he that desperate to win?”

That doesn't really make much sense. It's obvious that a lot of viewers wanted to see the jive, so surely if he was 'that desperate to win' he would do the jive to ensure he gets as many votes as possible? The fact that he isn't doing it actually suggests he's not that desperate to win and just wants to enjoy the final.

I think the couple's favourite dance doesn't really make much difference to the votes anyway as its in the second part and there's not much time to vote afterwards. In quite a few of the finals, if leaks etc. are to be believed, the eventual winner had it sewn up before the second show even started.
Gill P
18-12-2015
As I said in another thread, as he is doing the jive on the tour, how can he be classed as a wimp?
Penny Crayon
18-12-2015
Jay's jive was amazing.

Whilst I'd love to see it again - I also think some of his other dances have been amazing too. I like to think of it as a 'one off surprising and perfect moment' - some things are better left that way.

It's not as if he hasn't a load of other great stuff to fall back on - he is anything but a one dance wonder. I'm looking forward to whatever is on offer.
amelia_lee
18-12-2015
Originally Posted by Reserved:
“Of course it was the right call - they'd said they'd never got the rehearsals right throughout the week and it all fell into place on the night perfectly. They got lucky - they're saying best to let everyone keep the initial memory of it because they know that won't be able to repeat it mistake-free and don't want to risk it.

No shame in that since it was a difficult dance technically, but why their fans try to make up excuses, I have no idea. Just be honest - they'd never match it again and don't want to risk it in the final.

It doesn't even matter - he can turn up and dance the Jive perfectly, turn up and dance the Jive with mistakes, turn up and fart, or not turn up at all. The result will be the same regardless.

He's a wimp. His best received dance and he denies his fans of it in a celebratory episode/finale just because he wants to win - which everyone knows he will, so just do it. Really has nothing to lose. Even if his win wasn't locked in, surely you want to give your fans what they want or is he that desperate to win?”

Once you 'get' a dance and perform it well, it doesn't matter how bad the rehearsals were, it will be that you know what to do from then on.
Plus he would have had an extra week of rehearsal here too. No problem.
Sammi42
18-12-2015
Originally Posted by Reserved:
“Of course it was the right call - they'd said they'd never got the rehearsals right throughout the week and it all fell into place on the night perfectly. They got lucky - they're saying best to let everyone keep the initial memory of it because they know that won't be able to repeat it mistake-free and don't want to risk it.

No shame in that since it was a difficult dance technically, but why their fans try to make up excuses, I have no idea. Just be honest - they'd never match it again and don't want to risk it in the final.

It doesn't even matter - he can turn up and dance the Jive perfectly, turn up and dance the Jive with mistakes, turn up and fart, or not turn up at all. The result will be the same regardless.

He's a wimp. His best received dance and he denies his fans of it in a celebratory episode/finale just because he wants to win - which everyone knows he will, so just do it. Really has nothing to lose. Even if his win wasn't locked in, surely you want to give your fans what they want or is he that desperate to win?”

You completely contradict yourself. First you say he made the right call then call him a wimp, then say he's thrown away his chances but is desperate to win.

I totally respect their decision not to do it again, they would never have been able to captured the magic of that moment again and it would have tainted the memory of the first time round. I was so relieved to hear they weren't dancing it again. He is more than 'that Jive'

It's not about winning for him, yes I'm sure he would love to as they all would, but it's more about enjoying the experience doing that Jive would put a lot of pressure on him and probably spoil his last memories in the show. I want him to go out there and enjoy these last moments.

They will pay homage to the Jive in their showdance. The Paso was one of my favourite dances of Jay's so I'm looking forward to seeing how it looks now 8 weeks later with the more confidence he has grown on the floor
DiamondDoll
18-12-2015
Originally Posted by DeltaBlues:
“1) There is an active thread just a little bit further down the front page on this topic.

2) 90% of the choreography was NOT copied from the film. Travolta & Thurman don't jive in Pulp Fiction...the whole point of the scene is that they're rubbish dancers. Aliona copied a couple of the iconic moves (the first few seconds of their arm movements, the few seconds of twist before the music changes) to make it clear what they were referencing, but at least 90% of the choreo was her original work.”

Originally Posted by Ellie1967:
“I'm not sure if you're having a veiled dig at them or have just never seen Pulp Fiction, but hardly any of the choreography was copied from the film because, as Deltablues said, they don't jive in the film they just do a bit of twist. Aliona should get plenty of 'kudos' for her choreography - which was more like 95% original than 10%.”

I had never seen Pulp Fiction so found the clip on youtube.
You are both exactly right.
mogglet
18-12-2015
I think it was a good decision not to do the Jive because it makes it a much more open final,anyone could win it, which is much fairer on the other contestants.Who wants to
give their best when its a forgone conclusion?.
If he doesnt win does it really matter,he has got his paycheck,he gets to do the tour and he has gained publicity should he wish to carry on in showbiz.
If he does win he gets to lift the glitterball in a decent outfit looking like Jay and not a John Travolta impersonater.
At the end of the day its only a light entertainment show and I am sure people will recover from not seeing the Jive again lol.
Whatever ever happens I will be voting for Jay. Jay for the win.
memmh
18-12-2015
I know I'm going to get slated for saying this but the dance is the couple's favourite, not the public's. If this was the dance they wanted to do, then it's their choice. Right or wrong, it's too late to change that decision now.
babyboomer10
18-12-2015
Originally Posted by Ellie1967:
“I'm not sure if you're having a veiled dig at them or have just never seen Pulp Fiction, but hardly any of the choreography was copied from the film because, as Deltablues said, they don't jive in the film they just do a bit of twist. Aliona should get plenty of 'kudos' for her choreography - which was more like 95% original than 10%.”

I wasn't having a dig & you are right - my mind played few tricks. I didn't see the film but after all the raving about J&A I watched the Youtube movie clip but only once as J&A was so much more enjoyable. The things that stuck in my mind from the movie were the slow gyrations/twist moves, 'armography', swimming strokes, submarining, head shake & sidestep hip movements which Aliona mimicked to a T. These were the recognisable bits from the film but all the jive was in J&A with none at all in the movie. So apologies to Aliona, it really was her jive based on a theme.
DeiseDays
18-12-2015
Originally Posted by memmh:
“I know I'm going to get slated for saying this but the dance is the couple's favourite, not the public's. If this was the dance they wanted to do, then it's their choice. Right or wrong, it's too late to change that decision now.”

Thank you for posting this, that's exactly how I feel too.

Surely all of the finalists deserve to choose what THEY want to dance in the final after all their weeks of hard work!

I hope all four finalists have got out of Strictly what they hoped for at the beginning of their journey and that win or lose, the final gives each of them a fitting closure to their experience.
Thom001
18-12-2015
Originally Posted by Bedlam_maid:
“I absolutely agree with this, and although I'm disappointed not to be seeing it again I would be more disappointed to see it again and it be less than perfect.

That jive was one of the most memorable SCD moments of all time for me and I would like it to stay that way.”

His jive was definitively the dance of the series. When I was watching it, I did end up going into a trance and forgot about everything else.

Originally Posted by mirandaweb:
“Pretty sure that the main reason they're not doing the Jive is that it would be problematic to get his hair from that (slicked black with extensions) to normal (and maybe back again) for at least one of the other dances. That was my first thought when people started talking about the jive for the final!”

Agreed. He ended up having that haircut - I'm sure they showed that on a VT one week -
which to be honest makes him look so much better. With his previous look, he looked like a stereotypical rock singer.
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