That's a good point Penny.

Sorry but this really makes no sense. The ladies fingers most definitely should not be on the mans back.

The lady should always be shaped out to her left, never upright. Once in hold, the lady must never change her shape, she must maintain this throughout the dance whether in closed or open positions. The clip you posted just shows how bad some of the latin Pro dancers are at ballroom. You can easily spot the (few) ballroom dancers among them.

There sure are some nasty, vindictive people on this forum....

I think Kevin comes across a little smug, that may be the reason some people may not like him, or prefer other dancers. He pulls very strange faces.

I totally agree!!

Now I don't begrudge Jay the win at all across the series but it is a paradox that there was a public outcry when the judges didnt save Jamelia (who did the best dance in the dance off) but now the public has awarded the main prize to the couple who (arguably) did not perform best on the night.

When Jamelia went out it was 'the judges should hang their heads in shame'. Now again 'the judges should hang their heads in shame' but -- bizarrely -- it's because they responded favourably to the best dances they saw on the night.

It feels as though in some quarters there's a pride in nursing a grievance at the same time as celebrating the victory.

Excellent point. What would be the purpose of fixing the show? What is in it for the fixers? Nothing. No expensive contract is at stake, so the producers do not have a vested interest in who wins.. And to suggest that they do it just to favour their favourites is to accuse them of being childish, which they are not.

I thought the judges got it in the right order. Kellie poured everything she had into it, gave 200% and deservedly topped the leaderboard. I thought her charleston was a little overmarked, not that she made mistakes, but it was a less impressive dance than Georgia's. Georgia also gave her all and I thought she deserved more than one 40. Of the three, it was Jay who seemed ever so slightly under par. At the end of the day, there wasn't a great deal in it.

So the public voted for Jay, based on his performances throughout the series rather than on the night. Viewed in that light, it was a fair result. The winner was the only one of the three who had never been in a dance-off, but he was also the only one never to score a 40.

This is a good point. However, I do think Craig could have dusted off his 10 paddle, it wouldn't have hurt him!

Overall I suppose Jay was the best dancer however on the night I thought he came third. As for choreography Kellie and Kevin were streets ahead. I thought Aliona was being a bit precious to say they didn't want to besmirch the memory of the jive and then give us a greatest hits compilation for a showdance.

It's just a bit of a shame that so many people on this forum take the results of this programme so personally.

I think a lot of the dislike of Kevin stems from the dislike that people had for his first partner, Susannah Reid.

I, like many others, did not appreciate the way she pushed herself into the front at every possible opportunity, the way that she shamelessly self promoted herself whenever she could, the fake tan etc etc etc.

Personally I think the popularity of Kevin from Grimsby is adversely affected by this. I also think the impression that some people have of a Clifton mafia does not help

I'm sorry but they're trained professionals unlike Ds so who are anyone here to say they overmark..

I have to laugh at ds thinking they know better than professional dancers

Because in the final - the judges comments and scores don't count for anything - the decision is down to the public and the public vote alone determines the winner, and having had two appearances in the dance off, it's clear that K&K were probably the least popular couple left, and if we saw the voting figures, it may have been close between K&K and K&A in the first vote off.

Personally, i wasn't a K&K fan - I thought their tango was overmarked, and G&G out danced them in the battle of the Charlestons, and for me the best dancers on the night were G&G. However, they weren't my favourites, and over the course of the series, Jay has impressed me more so he got my votes after Katie and Anton went out.

I agree with you totally

My wife who has been a Jay fan throughout the series was more angry with Aliona for not selling her boy in the showdance than being angry with judges.

Are you saying that because public opinion alone counts the judges lose their right to comment on what they see?

But even so, the studio audience as well as the judges lit up to Kellie's first two dances in particular. I wonder if there's something about being there in the studio that didn't translate across to everyone on TV?? For me, Kellie and Kevin were outstanding and really close to Georgia and Giovanni on the night. They're different kinds of dancer (one couple compact and full of gusto and pzazz, the other more emotional and lyrical) so which you pick is going to be personal, but both were stronger on the night than Jay in my opinion.

It's just a funny parallel to Jameliagate...

Oh course the judges can manipulate the public ( ask Simon Cowell he is an expert). They can manipulate by what they say about the dance, many people believe every word. Take Len saying about heel leads in Jay's VW, on Len's lens they were hard pushed to find any mistakes and struggled to find 2 I think. Yet look how many people said about his errors. No one else was picked up on such small errors. Also can manipulate on which Judges choice they pick, funny Jay's worst dance was picked but Anton didn't get picked a Latin as they knew it would be a disaster. The order of dance can make a big difference. They tried so many tactics to get their favourite to win but the public won in the end with their choice.

This is somewhat pretenious.

You are not manipulated obviously by your comments, but the bulk of the nation are?

No not saying that they lose their right to comment at all, just that in the final the comments and marks are for guidance only - and in the final, I for one don't think sarky comments and low marks are appropriate. ALL the finalists have worked hard to get there, and have battled to get the public vote behind them, and it's not really on to keep pushing an agenda which the public clearly doesn't want!

Personally, I feel that the panel have had their say (and two bites of the cherry interns of the result) up to and including the semi final, and who knows how many times they saved the person who scored the lowest in the dance off. I'd like to see their scores removed from the final altogether, as basically, by the time we get to the final, most viewers will have decided who their favourites are and will vote accordingly.

News Flash: Jay won!!

I must be obtuse (or still drunk). I don't get the reason for complaining. It's like there are sour grapes and champagne at the same time. Jay is being presented simultaneously as underdog and victor, like he's got a monopoly on every possible outcome

Kelliewozrobbed threads or Georgiawozrobbed threads would make sense. Not sure I'd agree with them as such but I'd understand them more than JayWasn'tRobbed threads

Its funny, I don't really watch Strictly avidly but OH does and I kind of keep half an eye on it and it did seem to me that A & J were not the 'favoured' couple last night by any means.

None of the Show dances deserved any 10s as there were clear mistakes in all even to my untrained eye, yet the comments for the other couples seemed to gloss over that.

I also agree it was an odd dance to pick for the judges 'choice' dance.

Like I said I'm not biased as I'm only a casual viewer so I can't even say whether it was a 'deserved' win or not but there did seem something a bit off with the way the final was presented to my eyes.

he is all things to all people...

another one that baffles me is that georgia (24) is annoying crybabay who ought to grow up but jay (25) is a lovely young lad (read 12) who is emoting at a far deeper (if unseen) level....

Sorry - but of the four judges, only one of them is trained in the dance genre they are actually judging. Len is the only judge qualified to judge real ballroom competitions, and he's probably forgotten more that the other three combined actually know..

Yes they are (or were) all professional dancers, but in very different disciplines to Ballroom and Latin dancing, and their lack of knowledge of what is put before them each week has been picked up on more than once by quite a few of the professional dancers. We even saw Brendan mouthing "no they don't" behind Peter's back when Peter was doing one of his bum licking monologues about the judges knowing what they are talking about!

Craig in particular spouts a lot of ballet terms out in his critiques, and more often than not, they are not relevant to the dance he has just seen, and his obsession with thumbs is beyond a joke now - especially when he refuses a 10 because of something like that.

And there are more than a few professional dance teachers on the forum who do know what they are talking about! I know a lot of folk dislike James Jordan, but his judge along with James tweets over the last couple of series have been quite insightful and honest, and it's been interesting to see what an impartial trained ballroom dancer thinks of the dances!

That's about how I see it too.

It's not hard to know why, but it's just not worth the grief from people to even suggest it.

I fully agree with this - 3 of the judges know very little about ballroom and latin technique. We cringe with embarrassment for them, when they are giving incorrect "advice" when addressing the couples. Goodness knows what the Pro's are thinking at the time, unfortunately it seems that they are unable to respond anymore.

I think the judges accurately commented on what they observed. The positions on the judges' leaderboard were accurate. Jay and Aliona were not the best dancers on the night but it's not a dancing completion it's a popularity contest and they were always going to win no matter how they danced last night.