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Weather Watching - Enthusiasts Thread |
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#1301 |
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Forum Member
Join Date: Feb 2004
Location: Southern East Anglia
Posts: 75,211
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Quote:
OK then, I must be lying...
Why do you have reason to disbelieve? Without knowing the exact location of myself, you can't know for sure. There are all sorts of different situations that could cause the frost on my windscreen. The only situation that could cause ice on your windscreen are an air temperature at or below 0C, where any water deposits freeze, and I have serious doubts as to whether that happened. Not sure what part of the North West you are, but I've looked at several stations in that area, and the typical mimima overnight, was about 7 or 8 degrees. |
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#1302 |
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Join Date: Aug 2016
Location: The North!
Posts: 2,197
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Quote:
Purely factual.
The only situation that could cause ice on your windscreen are an air temperature at or below 0C, where any water deposits freeze, and I have serious doubts as to whether that happened. Not sure what part of the North West you are, but I've looked at several stations in that area, and the typical mimima overnight, was about 7 or 8 degrees. |
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#1303 |
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Forum Member
Join Date: Feb 2004
Location: Southern East Anglia
Posts: 75,211
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Quote:
Our garage is always a few degrees colder than outside, which probably helps. It wasn't fully frozen but it was enough that I had to scrape it off.
![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() Unless you've got some special refrigeration unit in there, your garage is not going to have an air temperature below freezing, while outside is several degrees above. |
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#1304 |
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Join Date: Aug 2016
Location: The North!
Posts: 2,197
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Quote:
Sorry, but
![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() Unless you've got some special refrigeration unit in there, your garage is not going to have an air temperature below freezing, while outside is several degrees above. |
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#1305 |
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Forum Member
Join Date: Feb 2004
Location: Southern East Anglia
Posts: 75,211
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Quote:
I don't know but put it this way, it can be cold enough in there that you can see your breath sometimes when you can't outside.
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#1306 |
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Forum Member
Join Date: Oct 2005
Location: derby
Posts: 14,740
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Quote:
Our garage is always a few degrees colder than outside, which probably helps. It wasn't fully frozen but it was enough that I had to scrape it off.
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#1307 |
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Forum Member
Join Date: Aug 2016
Location: The North!
Posts: 2,197
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Quote:
you had a frost on your windscreen in the garage?... c'mon.... do you know what frost is?..
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#1308 |
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Forum Member
Join Date: Feb 2004
Location: Southern East Anglia
Posts: 75,211
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Quote:
you had a frost on your windscreen in the garage?... c'mon.... do you know what frost is?..
![]() The 6am temperatures in the North West can be seen here The lowest I can see is a 6C. |
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#1309 |
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Forum Member
Join Date: Oct 2003
Location: Darn Sarf
Posts: 28,728
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Come on guys, give the fella a break! He's referring to yesterday, 22nd, and minimum air temperatures in Northern Ireland where he is were as low as 1.0 deg C in Castlederg (near Omagh) and 3.8 deg C Lough Fea near Cookstown. Both these are low enough to produce a ground frost in clear skies/low wind speeds as it was, including car roofs open to the air. Leaving aside the indoors-outdoors-garage banter on this page, what he originally wrote yesterday i.e. : Quote:
Currently 14c here in N.I and cloudy. I got up this morning to a temp of 4c and frost on the windscreen, it was certainly a shock to the system, first frost of the season.
Note to self: Cut the blooming grass this afternoon!
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#1310 |
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Forum Member
Join Date: Feb 2004
Location: Southern East Anglia
Posts: 75,211
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Quote:
Come on guys, give the fella a break! He's referring to yesterday, 22nd, and minimum air temperatures in Northern Ireland where he is were as low as 1.0 deg C in Castlederg (near Omagh) and 3.8 deg C Lough Fea near Cookstown. Both these are low enough to produce a ground frost in clear skies/low wind speeds as it was, including car roofs open to the air.
Leaving aside the indoors-outdoors-garage banter on this page, what he originally wrote i.e. : ... is perfectly feasible, in fact highly likely in parts of N.I. yesterday morning. For comparison, my own minima this morning (we seem to be running a day behind the NW!) were: air 7.3C; grass 2.6 C - and the grass needs cutting which tends to keep it a bit on the high side. Note to self: Cut the blooming grass this afternoon! ![]() |
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#1311 |
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Forum Member
Join Date: Oct 2003
Location: Darn Sarf
Posts: 28,728
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Quote:
Except we were referring to the poster Nakatomi, not the poster, One man on the bog.
I'll have a look at Nakatomi's claims shortly...
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#1312 |
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Join Date: Feb 2004
Location: Southern East Anglia
Posts: 75,211
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Quote:
Both you and mushymanrob cast doubt on what onemanontheblog said.
I'll have a look at Nakatomi's claims shortly... ![]() |
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#1313 |
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Forum Member
Join Date: Oct 2003
Location: Darn Sarf
Posts: 28,728
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Quote:
I don't agree with his claims either. Not with +4C.
There were some good examples last night in widely varying locations: http://www.weatheronline.co.uk/weath...mph&CEL=C&UD=0 (ground) http://www.weatheronline.co.uk/weath...mph&CEL=C&UD=0 (air) High Wycombe - air min 8 C, ground minimum 0 C Kenley - air min 7, ground 1. Thorney Island - air min 7, ground 1. Even Heathrow - air min. 9, ground 4. and Lerwick - air min 7, ground 1. I sometimes see differences as high as some of those even here in my walled back garden (when the grass is shorter than it is now!). But it's impossible to confirm or refute Nakatomi's claim as it depends on exact location and site, whether he was in a clear skies area late in the night, and there aren't many stations in the North West who report grass minima. |
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#1314 |
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Forum Member
Join Date: Jul 2003
Location: Pimlico, central London, UK
Posts: 14,872
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Beautiful warm, sunny day in London today. 22 degrees tomorrow which isn't bad at all for late September.
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#1315 |
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Forum Member
Join Date: Feb 2004
Location: Southern East Anglia
Posts: 75,211
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Quote:
Differences between grass and air minimum temperatures can be way more than 4 deg C, it all depends on the exact site and night time conditions, more so than than what region of the country it's in. And the ground minima are taken at 5 cm, so the actual surface (including car roofs if there's no wind) can be lower.
There were some good examples last night in widely varying locations: http://www.weatheronline.co.uk/weath...mph&CEL=C&UD=0 (ground) http://www.weatheronline.co.uk/weath...mph&CEL=C&UD=0 (air) High Wycombe - air min 8 C, ground minimum 0 C Kenley - air min 7, ground 1. Thorney Island - air min 7, ground 1. Even Heathrow - air min. 9, ground 4. and Lerwick - air min 7, ground 1. I sometimes see differences as high as some of those even here in my walled back garden (when the grass is shorter than it is now!). But it's impossible to confirm or refute Nakatomi's claim as it depends on exact location and site, whether he was in a clear skies area late in the night, and there aren't many stations in the North West who report grass minima. I'm calling bullshit. You can believe what you like. |
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#1316 |
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Join Date: Oct 2003
Location: Darn Sarf
Posts: 28,728
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Quote:
I'm sorry, but I don't agree that if Nakatomi is in the North West of England, there was frost on his car last night. No station in that area had a minima at ground level anywhere near zero.
I'm calling bullshit. You can believe what you like. And I finally managed to cut my grass! Current air temperature here 14.6, grass 9.3 |
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#1317 |
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Forum Member
Join Date: Aug 2016
Location: The North!
Posts: 2,197
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Well our windscreen was frosty but the car outside was fine, which makes me think it's probably a combination of the garage, the car being wet and the roof leaking anyway. Like I said, it wasn't hard or anything, quite slushy but I still had to clear it off.
If I wanted to make something up I'd make something more interesting up! However today has been a surprise. It was quite sunny this morning going to the wedding but when we left to come home to get changed at about 7 I was surprised by just how bloody cold it was outside. It's very chilly. |
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#1318 |
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Forum Member
Join Date: Aug 2016
Location: The North!
Posts: 2,197
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Quote:
I don't believe anything, I have no idea and I won't unless he tells us more accurately than 'North West' where he is. Just pointing out that you can have bigger differences between ground/surface and air temperatures than was mentioned, that's all. 1manonthebog sounds plausible for yesterday in N.I. though.
And I finally managed to cut my grass! Current air temperature here 14.6, grass 9.3 |
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#1319 |
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Forum Member
Join Date: Aug 2014
Location: North West England
Posts: 1,810
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Quote:
Freezing this morning here in the North West, I had to scrape the ice off the car. We're at a wedding today so hoping the weather stays dry as part of it will be outside. It could be very chilly I think though for those in dresses!
Highs of 16 today here, 18 tomorrow potentially but from Sunday onwards we're only seeing highs of about 15 and lows of 8, so very different indeed! https://drive.google.com/file/d/0B56...ew?usp=sharing https://drive.google.com/file/d/0B56...ew?usp=sharing Overnight temperatures not even close to being a frost (temp needs to be at or just above freezing). Nakatomi also claims that in her part of the north west she's getting moderately high temps during the day - it was also 16C here day, same as me. But for temperatures to then drop to near freezing level from the mid-teens in the course of one day - it just doesn't add up I don't know which part of the North West you're from, but either you live in some crazy microclimate in the middle of nowhere, or you live at the top of a mountain (and then walked down to the bottom during the day where it was warmer)...BTW, I was out today in a t-shirt, and out tonight in just football shorts and a football shirt (I do footie training) and even before I started training I was fine.. It isn't cold.... Quote:
Come on guys, give the fella a break! He's referring to yesterday, 22nd, and minimum air temperatures in Northern Ireland where he is were as low as 1.0 deg C in Castlederg (near Omagh) and 3.8 deg C Lough Fea near Cookstown. Both these are low enough to produce a ground frost in clear skies/low wind speeds as it was, including car roofs open to the air.
Leaving aside the indoors-outdoors-garage banter on this page, what he originally wrote yesterday i.e. : ... is perfectly feasible, in fact highly likely in parts of N.I. yesterday morning. For comparison, my own minima this morning (we seem to be running a day behind the NW!) were: air 7.3C; grass 2.6 C - and the grass needs cutting which tends to keep it a bit on the high side. Note to self: Cut the blooming grass this afternoon! ![]() Firstly, you live in the far South of the UK where it barely gets cold, I thought frosts were quite rare down there.... How can you measure the temperature of grass???? ![]() And, if the grass is really that cold, how is it still growing if it's nearly at freezing point?? |
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#1320 |
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Forum Member
Join Date: Aug 2016
Location: The North!
Posts: 2,197
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Quote:
I don't believe this at all either.. I live about 150m above sea level, and frost in September is almost unheard of here.. These Observations come from the Bingley Salmos Weather Station (nearest one to me) and that is about 260m above sea level:
https://drive.google.com/file/d/0B56...ew?usp=sharing https://drive.google.com/file/d/0B56...ew?usp=sharing Overnight temperatures not even close to being a frost (temp needs to be at or just above freezing). Nakatomi also claims that in her part of the north west she's getting moderately high temps during the day - it was also 16C here day, same as me. But for temperatures to then drop to near freezing level from the mid-teens in the course of one day - it just doesn't add up I don't know which part of the North West you're from, but either you live in some crazy microclimate in the middle of nowhere, or you live at the top of a mountain (and then walked down to the bottom during the day where it was warmer)...BTW, I was out today in a t-shirt, and out tonight in just football shorts and a football shirt (I do footie training) and even before I started training I was fine.. It isn't cold.... I don't understand this one either... Firstly, you live in the far South of the UK where it barely gets cold, I thought frosts were quite rare down there.... How can you measure the temperature of grass???? ![]() And, if the grass is really that cold, how is it still growing if it's nearly at freezing point?? Secondly, I just said we were predicted those highs, not that we actually got them. I don't think we got above about 10 here yesterday, probably about 12 or so today. Anyway, never mind. You don't believe me, just move on, no need to do a character assassination. |
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#1321 |
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Forum Member
Join Date: Oct 2003
Location: Darn Sarf
Posts: 28,728
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Quote:
I don't believe this at all either..
I don't understand this one either... Firstly, you live in the far South of the UK where it barely gets cold, I thought frosts were quite rare down there.... How can you measure the temperature of grass???? ![]() And, if the grass is really that cold, how is it still growing if it's nearly at freezing point?? http://weatherfaqs.org.uk/node/26 "The difference between the two levels can be considerable: On still, clear nights, with air of a low humidity content, 5 degC or more is not uncommon." Car windscreens can be even colder than 'official' grass or concrete surfaces - you must have occasionally noticed a frost on car windscreens or roofs when there's no frost anywhere else? If not, look out for it on cars parked overnight well away from buildings or trees, as the autumn and winter develop. It will happen at some point. |
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#1322 |
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Forum Member
Join Date: Aug 2014
Location: North West England
Posts: 1,810
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Quote:
We're not far from Frodsham. It can get pretty cold here even when the surrounding areas are warm.
Quote:
First of all, I'm a him.
Secondly, I just said we were predicted those highs, not that we actually got them. I don't think we got above about 10 here yesterday, probably about 12 or so today. Anyway, never mind. You don't believe me, just move on, no need to do a character assassination. https://goo.gl/photos/FeuaA2cJnTjDddkW6 Starting to think you are spinning us a yarn..... |
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#1323 |
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Forum Member
Join Date: Aug 2016
Location: The North!
Posts: 2,197
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Quote:
And a quick google search of "Frodsham" reveals that the weather is currently 13C at 11:00pm tonight... Ive even done a screenshot at this very moment to prove it.
https://goo.gl/photos/FeuaA2cJnTjDddkW6 Starting to think you are spinning us a yarn..... Our car thermometer on the drive is saying it's currently 9c and our one in the shed says 10c, so I wouldn't go off the internet. You do realise that you can get wildly different temperature variations in the same town dependent on all sorts of factors, don't you? As I said, just leave it. I don't know why you think I'd lie about this - what would be the point? |
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#1324 |
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Forum Member
Join Date: Feb 2004
Location: Southern East Anglia
Posts: 75,211
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Quote:
And a quick google search of "Frodsham" reveals that the weather is currently 13C at 11:00pm tonight... Ive even done a screenshot at this very moment to prove it.
https://goo.gl/photos/FeuaA2cJnTjDddkW6 Starting to think you are spinning us a yarn..... In fact the post of the 6am temperatures at various stations in the North West of England showed that stations near to the coast stayed in double figures overnight, and Frodsham's positioning is consistent with that. |
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#1325 |
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Join Date: Oct 2003
Location: Darn Sarf
Posts: 28,728
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The nearest official stations to Frodsham are Rostherne (minimum air temp. last night 7.6 C) and Hawarden (minimum air temp 6.0 C). I'm not getting into the argument with Nakatomi except to say places in between could feasibly have had different air minima ( + or - ) and different ground or car roof minima. It was undoubtedly clear in the early morning at both sites, with light winds (Rostherne 4mph at 10m at 7 am, much less or calm at the ground).
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I don't know which part of the North West you're from, but either you live in some crazy microclimate in the middle of nowhere, or you live at the top of a mountain (and then walked down to the bottom during the day where it was warmer)...