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International Cricket 2016
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mimik1uk
10-06-2016
Originally Posted by alanwarwic:
“But it doesn”

it doesn't what ?

surely if hawkeye cant predict the amount of any late swing it must put into question what the margin of error is ?
Bhaveshgor
10-06-2016
Compton gonna get replaced most likely by Borthwick.
Vince is probably going to get 4 more test matches but question are being asked about him now.
Would prefer if Root goes to number 3.
Cook
Hales
Root
Vince/Borthwick/Bairstow
Vince/Borthwick
Stokes
Buttler/Bairstow.
Bowlers

would prefer Root going to 3 gives england more option in the batting order and don't really like the new guy batting at number 3 where it is likely he going to struggle a bit, can't remember any guy starting at number 3 and being a hit straight away.
even the likes of ballance and Pujara got dropped after being a hit for 18 months.
really the number 3 batsman should be a test regular and should know his batting quite well in most conditions.
Borthwick or who ever replaces compton at 3 is unlikely to be sure how he plays Amir or quicker bowlers or then Spin/Slow bowling in Sub Continent.
mimik1uk
10-06-2016
i'll just repeat that bairstow needs to be batting higher than #7 when stokes comes back so for me the most sensible option is to drop compton, move vince to #3, bairstow to #5 and have buttler keep
Bhaveshgor
10-06-2016
Originally Posted by mimik1uk:
“it doesn't what ?

surely if hawkeye cant predict the amount of any late swing it must put into question what the margin of error is ?”

Just wandering do you mean the late swing before it hits the leg or after hitting the leg.
Guessing you mean Reverse Swing, not sure if it does pick it up since from the animation who can barely see the swing but then again it could be the computer animation rather than the data.
Anyway ICC should have known all this ages ago.
Think MIT been testing the swing and to see if it pick it up, they doing all sort of test on the Hawkeye.
mimik1uk
10-06-2016
Originally Posted by Bhaveshgor:
“Just wandering do you mean the late swing before it hits the leg or after hitting the leg.
Guessing you mean Reverse Swing, not sure if it does pick it up since from the animation who can barely see the swing but then again it could be the computer animation rather than the data.
Anyway ICC should have known all this ages ago.
Think MIT been testing the swing and to see if it pick it up, they doing all sort of test on the Hawkeye.”

i mean any sort of swing that happens late

how often have we seen a ball swing so much after passing the bat that it almost goes to first slip ?

the assumption you mentioned in your previous post is where it gets complicated imo, the umpire has to assume the ball travels in a straight line after impact with the pads but we all know that the ball doesn't actually do that. so what we have is a predictive system being limited by an assumption put in place to deal with something that they dont predict

all i am saying is we often see decisions that look very weird because the ball has started to swing and to the naked eye can look like its going to miss but because of that assumption it ends up being predicted to hit
Miss Ann Thropy
10-06-2016
Originally Posted by mimik1uk:
“my only worry about that line-up, and i agree it does look good, is are woakes and stokes good enough with the ball to back up broad and anderson

compton's place is also far more at risk than vince i would think”

Agreed and then it would seem, all roads lead back to Finn.

I'm not a Compton fan at all and was surprised that he was back in for this series.

What happened to Sam Robson then?

England appear to have a history of trying these things out and not giving either batters or bowlers enough stage time?
alanwarwic
10-06-2016
Originally Posted by Bhaveshgor:
“Compton gonna get replaced most likely by Borthwick.
Vince is probably going to get 4 more test matches but question are being asked about him now...”

Now? It puzzled me how he even got in the side, a quite curious one from the start. Though even Bairstow had to assert major form to not get sidelined.

Sometimes form is not what the pickers want, them seeing ability as something a bit more intangible than actual results.
Bhaveshgor
10-06-2016
Originally Posted by mimik1uk:
“i mean any sort of swing that happens late

how often have we seen a ball swing so much after passing the bat that it almost goes to first slip ?

the assumption you mentioned in your previous post is where it gets complicated imo, the umpire has to assume the ball travels in a straight line after impact with the pads but we all know that the ball doesn't actually do that. so what we have is a predictive system being limited by an assumption put in place to deal with something that they dont predict

all i am saying is we often see decisions that look very weird because the ball has started to swing and to the naked eye can look like its going to miss but because of that assumption it ends up being predicted to hit”

thing is the ball isn't meant to be swinging after it hits something, it should really be going on a straight line.
But if the ball is swinging before it hits the leg and like you say it looks it was going to miss then the hawkeye prediction is wrong then the hawkeye has an issue on picking the direction of the line of the ball when the ball is swinging or turning and yes the margin of error get even bigger if this does happen since it could actually be big as 50% actually considering the width of the stump isn't actually that big.

TBH that what annoys me the most of the DRS, ICC should have gotten an independent testing on everything and not assume what Hawkeye says is correct and would work for cricket.
mimik1uk
10-06-2016
Originally Posted by Miss Ann Thropy:
“Agreed and then it would seem, all roads lead back to Finn.

I'm not a Compton fan at all and was surprised that he was back in for this series.

What happened to Sam Robson then?

England appear to have a history of trying these things out and not giving either batters or bowlers enough stage time?”

i think if finn was anywhere near his best then it would be either/or between stokes and woakes. finn hasn't looked great and was outbowled by woakes at durham.

i think robson might have been recalled if they had decided to drop hales after a poor winter but hales has done enough now to secure his spot for the foreseeable future. daniel bell-drummond i think will be a regular in the long term if he continues to progress the way he has.
makeba72
10-06-2016
Originally Posted by Miss Ann Thropy:
“England appear to have a history of trying these things out and not giving either batters or bowlers enough stage time?”

I think they did have a history of that, but not really anymore, IMO. Robson, Lyth and Compton were all given a good go. I think Robson's technique was exposed and Lyth failed to impress by continually getting out in the same way, wafting at a wide ball.

The modern game is very different, but I think the fashion for ever-faster scoring has led to a real dearth of those who can grind out an innings and look safe at the crease. Bairstow's playing very well indeed, but even he has had 3 (?) lives already in this innings.
mimik1uk
10-06-2016
Originally Posted by Bhaveshgor:
“thing is the ball isn't meant to be swinging after it hits something, it should really be going on a straight line.
But if the ball is swinging before it hits the leg and like you say it looks it was going to miss then the hawkeye prediction is wrong then the hawkeye has an issue on picking the direction of the line of the ball when the ball is swinging or turning and yes the margin of error get even bigger if this does happen since it could actually be big as 50% actually considering the width of the stump isn't actually that big.

TBH that what annoys me the most of the DRS, ICC should have gotten an independent testing on everything and not assume what Hawkeye says is correct and would work for cricket.”

not disagreeing with any of that, all i am saying is we know in real life the ball does swing and we have a predictive system not taking account of something we know happens, maybe just not explaining myself very well and have confused myself as well
Bhaveshgor
10-06-2016
Originally Posted by mimik1uk:
“not disagreeing with any of that, all i am saying is we know in real life the ball does swing and we have a predictive system not taking account of something we know happens, maybe just not explaining myself very well and have confused myself as well”

Hawkeye takes into account of swing and spin before the ball hits the leg but not after.
Although questions can be asked about the accuracy of the swing or Turn.
Think it does have problem with turn, seen loads of dodgy prediction on the Turn.
Miss Ann Thropy
10-06-2016
Yes, I've been pleased with Hales and his approach and improvement in the openers berth.

Returning to the Finn situ, just listening to discussion on the radio where Footit is mentioned - "is he really quick though?" - Tuffers isn't convinced.

Then Meaker - as a Surrey fan I can say he hasn't really done enough to warrant inclusion.

Finn really is on and off as we know and what's needed is another in the mould of an Anderson, pace and swing, to really aid what we already have.
Miss Ann Thropy
10-06-2016
Originally Posted by makeba72:
“Bairstow's playing very well indeed, but even he has had 3 (?) lives already in this innings.”

Yes. Although he has this lovely knack doesn't he. Seems to just get better and better the longer he bats. Just what's needed for England's middle order glass-jaw chin. They were just giving a statistic about the last three innings where England have put on huge runs for the sixth and seventh wicket. As I write, Broad is out caught slashing, if you'll excuse the terminology.
mimik1uk
10-06-2016
Originally Posted by Miss Ann Thropy:
“
Finn really is on and off as we know and what's needed is another in the mould of an Anderson, pace and swing, to really aid what we already have.”

in theory thats what woakes has the potential to be

i think he has focussed maybe a bit too much on pace and forgotten about lateral movement, and he also has a tendency to bowl too straight rather than the 4th/5th stump line
mimik1uk
10-06-2016
that review from finn would be worthy of shane watson

edit : i cannot believe that was missing, it looked absolutely plumb in real time
Miss Ann Thropy
10-06-2016
Finn could be out here but he's reviewing it as it could be going down, snicko indicating no inside edge and the result is... missing the stumps!

Now England should go past 400 and hopefully (as mimik1uk mentioned), Woakes can have a go at bowling not so quick, but with a bit of variety and guile, much like the Sri Lankans did yesterday actually, I thought they bowled terrifically well given the conditions.
Lojen
10-06-2016
Did not fancy our chances of making 400 most of yesterday. Wonderful job done by Bairstow, he really is in the form of his life.
mimik1uk
10-06-2016
just a question now if finn and anderson can hang around long enough with him to get him to the double
Bhaveshgor
10-06-2016
Kumar Sangakkara just replied to me on Twitter lol.
Quote:
“@bhaveshgorsia @gisby_marc @BigKev67 @njhcricket then get rid of DRS for LBW”

looks like he isn't fan of the system when he found out about the margin of error.
Quote:
“@bhaveshgorsia @gisby_marc @BigKev67 @njhcricket use only hotspot or snicko. If Hawkeye then use it properly. Or leave it out”

Quote:
“Kumar Sangakkara ‏@KumarSanga2 4m4 minutes ago
@bhaveshgorsia @gisby_marc @BigKev67 @njhcricket it's not the margin but the fact that the umpire is both right and wrong on one decision”

Although kumar the margin is the reason why the umpire can be right or wrong on one decision.

Surprised how quick he actually replied to it.
mimik1uk
10-06-2016
personally i would have no problem with the 3rd umpire making a judgement on lbw referrals from seeing the slow-mo replay

the issue is that because broadcasters would still use the technology as part of their TV coverage then you end up with alot of moaning afterwards

unless the ICC does a BCCI and bans broadcasters from using it when covering games
bradybrady
10-06-2016
Anyone know when Mark Wood is due to be fit

I would have him in the team and he can also bat
mimik1uk
10-06-2016
Originally Posted by bradybrady:
“Anyone know when Mark Wood is due to be fit

I would have him in the team and he can also bat”

i think he is going to miss most of the summer from what i read last , not 100% tho
mimik1uk
10-06-2016
that really was a poor drop from bairstow

from woakes' first ball as well
bradybrady
10-06-2016
Originally Posted by mimik1uk:
“i think he is going to miss most of the summer from what i read last , not 100% tho”

Ok I Hope he does come back
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