Found it a bit far fetched. Ringing his girlfriend from the General's house, becoming another person in 3 weeks. I wanted to like it but gave up, I am going to try Spin on Friday.
Deutschland '83
4 of 30
I found it a big disappointment. Yes the music and design were good (though as with many such attempts, rooms like 'Stamm's' office were very uncluttered and pristine) but the basic story was daft - the idea that he would risk breaking into a locked office in a lunnch hour doesn't ring true, that his handler just happened to have memory loss drops in his pocket as a party, etc etc. Shame as the idea is sound enough.
Originally Posted by mgbstag:
“Found it a bit far fetched. Ringing his girlfriend from the General's house, becoming another person in 3 weeks. I wanted to like it but gave up, I am going to try Spin on Friday.”
“Found it a bit far fetched. Ringing his girlfriend from the General's house, becoming another person in 3 weeks. I wanted to like it but gave up, I am going to try Spin on Friday.”
I was puzzled as to why this would raise suspicion
Originally Posted by Straker:
“Forced to do so IIRC. Still, they shouldn't announce/promise things that aren't nailed down beforehand.”
“Forced to do so IIRC. Still, they shouldn't announce/promise things that aren't nailed down beforehand.”
They have to announce things prior because the BBC Trust has to approve or deny what the BBC proposes.
I'm very interested in the Cold War years,and found this quite good and atmospheric.Will definitely tune in again next week.Although the subtitles were a minor irritation,it certainly held my interest.
Originally Posted by heiker:
“I was puzzled as to why this would raise suspicion”
“I was puzzled as to why this would raise suspicion
”
He gave his true first name and said he was in the West and would be coming back soon.
Originally Posted by dsimiller:
“I'm very interested in the Cold War years,and found this quite good and atmospheric.Will definitely tune in again next week.Although the subtitles were a minor irritation,it certainly held my interest.”
“I'm very interested in the Cold War years,and found this quite good and atmospheric.Will definitely tune in again next week.Although the subtitles were a minor irritation,it certainly held my interest.”
The thing that always seems to be crying our to be used as a basis for a film is BRIXMIS. As far as I know no one has ever done anything about them apart from a couple of non-fiction books and perhaps the odd (rather poor) documentary.
Originally Posted by nomad2king:
“He gave his true first name and said he was in the West and would be coming back soon.”
“He gave his true first name and said he was in the West and would be coming back soon.”
TBH I thought he was too far away from the woman for her to hear any of his whispered conversation.
Originally Posted by heiker:
“Subtitles don't match what they're saying....."Sit Down" not "Take a Seat"”
“Subtitles don't match what they're saying....."Sit Down" not "Take a Seat"”
It's think they're translating the sense of the expression in context as well as the words - the former would be more rude in English, but not in German.
Same intention.
Originally Posted by Tulip19:
“It's think they're translating the sense of the expression in context as well as the words - the former would be more rude in English, but not in German.
Same intention.”
“It's think they're translating the sense of the expression in context as well as the words - the former would be more rude in English, but not in German.
Same intention.”
"Sit Down" is an instruction whereas "Take a Seat" is an invitation. He was an East German soldier and consequently would be used to taking direct orders and anyway the scene was a formal one.
.
Originally Posted by Tulip19:
“It's think they're translating the sense of the expression in context as well as the words - the former would be more rude in English, but not in German.
Same intention.”
“It's think they're translating the sense of the expression in context as well as the words - the former would be more rude in English, but not in German.
Same intention.”
Originally Posted by heiker:
“"Sit Down" is an instruction whereas "Take a Seat" is an invitation. He was an East German soldier and consequently would be used to taking direct orders and anyway the scene was a formal one.
.”
“"Sit Down" is an instruction whereas "Take a Seat" is an invitation. He was an East German soldier and consequently would be used to taking direct orders and anyway the scene was a formal one.
.”
It's not really relevant to it being in a language other than English.
If you watch an English programme. with the subtitles on. you will notice that they frequently don't subtitle exactly what was said.
Sometimes it's quite sensible as it avoids screensful of rapid fire text but sometimes it seems quite pointless and arbitrary. It's very annoying if you can hear the dialogue and it doesn't match the subtitles - it's a lot harder to ignore them that you might think.
Also, 'take a seat' is just as much an instruction as 'sit down' - albeit a little politer in general use. 'Have a seat' might be considered and invitation.
Originally Posted by Vetinari:
“It's not really relevant to it being in a language other than English.
If you watch an English programme. with the subtitles on. you will notice that they frequently don't subtitle exactly what was said.
Sometimes it's quite sensible as it avoids screensful of rapid fire text but sometimes it seems quite pointless and arbitrary. It's very annoying if you can hear the dialogue and it doesn't match the subtitles - it's a lot harder to ignore them that you might think.
Also, 'take a seat' is just as much an instruction as 'sit down' - albeit a little politer in general use. 'Have a seat' might be considered and invitation.”
“It's not really relevant to it being in a language other than English.
If you watch an English programme. with the subtitles on. you will notice that they frequently don't subtitle exactly what was said.
Sometimes it's quite sensible as it avoids screensful of rapid fire text but sometimes it seems quite pointless and arbitrary. It's very annoying if you can hear the dialogue and it doesn't match the subtitles - it's a lot harder to ignore them that you might think.
Also, 'take a seat' is just as much an instruction as 'sit down' - albeit a little politer in general use. 'Have a seat' might be considered and invitation.”
So true. Good subtitling is an art in its own right, a highly specialised translation skill, the results of which are potentially open to criticism from millions of users!
For what it's worth I thought they did a very good job in D83. I enjoyed the part where he had to learn the "Wessi" words for everyday objects (Orange / Apfelsine). 
And the music was great!
Originally Posted by Vexille1:
“I found it a big disappointment. Yes the music and design were good (though as with many such attempts, rooms like 'Stamm's' office were very uncluttered and pristine) but the basic story was daft - the idea that he would risk breaking into a locked office in a lunnch hour doesn't ring true, that his handler just happened to have memory loss drops in his pocket as a party, etc etc. Shame as the idea is sound enough.”
“I found it a big disappointment. Yes the music and design were good (though as with many such attempts, rooms like 'Stamm's' office were very uncluttered and pristine) but the basic story was daft - the idea that he would risk breaking into a locked office in a lunnch hour doesn't ring true, that his handler just happened to have memory loss drops in his pocket as a party, etc etc. Shame as the idea is sound enough.”
When else would he break into the locked office? That lunch hour was the only time the American general's briefcase was being left unattended. It was literally the only opportunity 'Stamm' had to get those photos of the documents.
I don't think they were memory loss drops in the handler's pocket, just a sedative that, mixed with the amount of alcohol the General's sister-in-law was knocking back, meant she'd be so bombed she wouldn't remember what happened.
just watched this and enjoyed it. one ofthe stranger viewing experiences for me though. I'm blind and make use of Audio Discription which for this programme is literally the audio describer reading out the subtitles with no expression in his voice as well as trying to describe what is going on! full marks to C4 for doing this with AD though for a subtitled drama, I wouldn't have expected it from them.
Originally Posted by Neio:
“When else would he break into the locked office? That lunch hour was the only time the American general's briefcase was being left unattended. It was literally the only opportunity 'Stamm' had to get those photos of the documents.
I don't think they were memory loss drops in the handler's pocket, just a sedative that, mixed with the amount of alcohol the General's sister-in-law was knocking back, meant she'd be so bombed she wouldn't remember what happened.”
“When else would he break into the locked office? That lunch hour was the only time the American general's briefcase was being left unattended. It was literally the only opportunity 'Stamm' had to get those photos of the documents.
I don't think they were memory loss drops in the handler's pocket, just a sedative that, mixed with the amount of alcohol the General's sister-in-law was knocking back, meant she'd be so bombed she wouldn't remember what happened.”
As a matter of interest, was he seen to lock the outer office door whilst he was photographing the contents of the US Military briefcase in the General's office?
If he didn't then he should have done so.
Originally Posted by heiker:
“As a matter of interest, was he seen to lock the outer office door whilst he was photographing the contents of the US Military briefcase in the General's office?
If he didn't then he should have done so.”
“As a matter of interest, was he seen to lock the outer office door whilst he was photographing the contents of the US Military briefcase in the General's office?
If he didn't then he should have done so.”
I'm not sure he did, although possibly locking that would have aroused suspicion, especially as he wouldn't have been able to unlock it again before the others returned (he wasn't able to lock the older lady secretary's desk where he got the keys up again in time for instance - something she looked a little suspicious about for a moment).
As he'd had little espionage training, it's probably understandable that he'd make some mistakes even though he accomplished the mission.
Originally Posted by mgbstag:
“Found it a bit far fetched. Ringing his girlfriend from the General's house, becoming another person in 3 weeks. I wanted to like it but gave up, I am going to try Spin on Friday.”
“Found it a bit far fetched. Ringing his girlfriend from the General's house, becoming another person in 3 weeks. I wanted to like it but gave up, I am going to try Spin on Friday.”
To the contrary, that type of thing did happen and there were quite a number of East German agents operating in West Germany. The most high profile case was that of Günter Guillaume whose case can be read about here: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Günter_Guillaume
That incident was one of the most moronic and counterproductive things that East German "intelligence" ever did because it brought down Chancellor Willy Brandt who was in favour of rapprochement and coexistence with East Germany.
I can see it having a bad ending.
If anyone has seen it, and knows either way, please don't comment.
If anyone has seen it, and knows either way, please don't comment.
Martin, er "Moritz" reminds me a bit of the green PC Jim Carver way way back during the first season of The Bill back in the 80s. My other half doesn't think so.
http://www.aveleyman.com/ActorCredit.aspx?ActorID=18581
And Martin's girlfriend reminds me a bit of Jennifer Lawrence.
http://www.aveleyman.com/ActorCredit.aspx?ActorID=18581
And Martin's girlfriend reminds me a bit of Jennifer Lawrence.
Originally Posted by Oldnjaded:
“Surely the fact that it is up against both the new series of Endeavour and the (possibly) epic War & Peace means it will bomb, at least in the overnights?
Personally I can't cope with subtitles on a Sunday evening but I will record it and give it a chance.”
“Surely the fact that it is up against both the new series of Endeavour and the (possibly) epic War & Peace means it will bomb, at least in the overnights?
Personally I can't cope with subtitles on a Sunday evening but I will record it and give it a chance.”
It was excellent, I particularly enjoyed the period attention to detail. I also find that after a while I don't even notice the subtitles I'm reading.
The whole series has been uploaded to a very popular video sharing site (U), but no subtitles. Not sure it its legal.
Maybe you can only watch from Germany.
Maybe you can only watch from Germany.
Originally Posted by kathyd:
“I agree have scoured the listings but can't find a repeat anywhere!! I have virgin but when I record several things at various times overlapping the ending sometimes gets cut off-quite annoying!!!”
“I agree have scoured the listings but can't find a repeat anywhere!! I have virgin but when I record several things at various times overlapping the ending sometimes gets cut off-quite annoying!!!”
It is online now
http://www.channel4.com/programmes/d...mand/62893-001
But only appears to be on Channel 4 and +1 with no repeats so maybe they only bought First showing rights for 4 and +1 and online without repeats
As previously stated the inability to lock Frau Netz desk after "borrowing" her keys should have set alarm bells ringing especially after his comment about the filter coffee being nice. Don't think a 24 year old West German would bother with that kind of comment probably drinking it every day back in the 70/80's. The DDR 70's coffee crisis may have caused him to make such a statement as the Ossies love coffee but the state made them drink coffee substitute for years hence the jar of Nescafe Gold Blend being given as a gift..
I was looking forward to a gritty Cold War drama, what I saw was almost a spoof with some glaring plot holes. From border guard to spy with three weeks training; the murder of the genuine ADC on the train (and no-one noticed); the bungled brush pass at the barbecue; the dead drop in the tree next to a track used by soldiers out exercising, and the handler meeting the spy at the same location. But I will be watching next week.
I loved the first episode. I lived in Germany in the 80s and early 90s and the show brought back a lot of memories for me.
I agree that Martin made many mistakes, but given that he was trained only for three weeks,that's understandable. Making the phone call from the General's house was a major blunder. My husband pointed out that Martin is working with the phone logs from around the military base. He should have known that the General's personal phone was monitored. Also, calling an East German phone number is a dead giveaway. Certainly someone would check the number and investigate who was being called and who might have made the call. I think the call would also be picked up by investigators on the East German side since it was coming from the West, and they would want to know why someone from the West was trying to contact Annette. Surely Martin would have been better off using a public phone booth.
I have a friend in Germany who recommended the show Cenk Batu to me- it's another show that's currently featured on the Channel 4 Walter Presents website- https://l.facebook.com/l.php?u=http%...tu&h=cAQEnWkaw There's a trailer on Youtube here: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8OKnoGbVwTM
It's a German show about a police agent in Hamburg who goes undercover to investigate criminal gangs.
I agree that Martin made many mistakes, but given that he was trained only for three weeks,that's understandable. Making the phone call from the General's house was a major blunder. My husband pointed out that Martin is working with the phone logs from around the military base. He should have known that the General's personal phone was monitored. Also, calling an East German phone number is a dead giveaway. Certainly someone would check the number and investigate who was being called and who might have made the call. I think the call would also be picked up by investigators on the East German side since it was coming from the West, and they would want to know why someone from the West was trying to contact Annette. Surely Martin would have been better off using a public phone booth.
I have a friend in Germany who recommended the show Cenk Batu to me- it's another show that's currently featured on the Channel 4 Walter Presents website- https://l.facebook.com/l.php?u=http%...tu&h=cAQEnWkaw There's a trailer on Youtube here: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8OKnoGbVwTM
It's a German show about a police agent in Hamburg who goes undercover to investigate criminal gangs.
4 of 30
